Tri Y's vs 4 into 1 AU V8....

KR1STO · 10-08-2010, 08:35 PM

Ok guys,
I reckon this topic may have been touched on before, but, I did a search and couldn't find anything..

My question is.. Which extractors are better for the AU V8..
Tri Y's or 4 into 1's..?

Also, Why.....?

Cheers
Kris

JC · 10-08-2010, 08:38 PM

Try Ys (a la Paccies or hurricanes, IIRC) = better torque down low. 4 into 1 (a la Herrod or Defillipo pipes) = better up high. On a 200kw Windsor, you can't beat a set of hurricanes.

Johndec · 10-08-2010, 09:13 PM

There are so many variables involved that is hard to give a straight answer. As a rule of thumb, for the street, tooling around the 'burbs, probably tri-y. However, I've found the 4 into 1 that came stock with my AU3 XR8 definitely don't hurt low down torque. These were originally made by HM Headers for Ford. There used to be a thread here in the HM sub forum that has been hidden as they are no longer a sponsor which argued the toss about how good the stock headers were. Strangely, the HM guy bagged his own (OEM) product, probably just to get people to buy their tri-y version.

KR1STO · 10-08-2010, 09:14 PM

interesting....
would've liked to have seen that thread....

b2tf · 10-08-2010, 09:33 PM

There are sooooo many variables in this question it isnt funny and it will likely end up being closed because people get very protective of their opinion.

Look for what it is worth I am a big fan of 4 into 1s because I believe they get the gas out a lot more than what tri-y's can. That and if they put 4 into 1's on these from factory, they obviously do work.

It depends a lot on your plans for the car - if you intend to work the engine a bit eg cam, headwork etc then 4 into 1's are the go. If it will likely stay a stocker on the donk front then tri-y's will be fine.

Johndec · 10-08-2010, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KR1STO

interesting....
would've liked to have seen that thread....

I've got a printout of it, got it from google cache about a month ago but it has now disappeared. Perhaps a mod might let you take a peek at it:

www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11190803

I can understand the desire to hide stuff from a sponsors forum once they stop paying the bills, but often a lot of good info gets thrown out along with the sales spiels...

Johndec · 10-08-2010, 09:48 PM

Doh, you are a mod!!

KR1STO · 10-08-2010, 09:37 PM

That's fair enough..
Yeah, the std 4 into 1 headers don't look all that bad..For a stock item I mean..

This isn't just a question I wanted to know, relating to my car, more of a spot for people to express their opinions for others and newcomers to read...

Is there any difference in sound from try y's to the 4 into 1's.....?

KR1STO · 10-08-2010, 09:48 PM

hahaha...
I'll see what I can see....

**TICK4D-TAS** · 10-08-2010, 10:46 PM

I was warned against the 'new version' of hurricanes due to the build quality when i was doing my engine, and this was from an avid supporter of hurricanes. He has them on a couple of cars and has recommeneded them to quite a few.

Kris, i had the pacey tri y's on the xr8 and they were good, i have the pacey 4 into 1 ceramic coated on the TS, these were recommended by Spiro at Autotech.

At the end of the day, headers and exhausts come down to the application you want them for and personal preference.

RspecAU · 10-08-2010, 11:47 PM

I guess we will see how the 4 into 1 will go with AFR heads and a much better cam and a good tune from my car

Sox · 11-08-2010, 07:11 AM

It's a no brainer as far as I see it and the discussions I've had with my exhaust dude.
Good tri-y scavenge far better than any other header will at revs that are seen on the street.

4-1's have no place on the street, as you don't see anything above 7000rpm, as this is where a good 4-1 might have some advantage over a good tri-y.

The dyno tests that Bruce had done with different headers over the years, always showed tri-y to have a much better spread of power.

Bruce lovingly hand made my step back tri-y headers, as he did for many of his better customers.

The engine builder I worked for shared the same opinion.

It's all about usable power, not peak power.

T3man · 11-08-2010, 09:58 AM

That's good theory for a race engine Sox but it isn't necessarily the case for a street cammed vehicle. The revs that the 4>1s work at is determined by their length and that is dependent on the port size and cam. There are plenty of 4>1 designs that work from 3,000 up and you don't necesarily feel any slump down low. The OE headers on the Windsors are a case in point. I have yet to see a definitive answer that tri-Ys improve the low down response at all.

b2tf · 11-08-2010, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3man

That's good theory for a race engine Sox but it isn't necessarily the case for a street cammed vehicle. The revs that the 4>1s work at is determined by their length and that is dependent on the port size and cam. There are plenty of 4>1 designs that work from 3,000 up and you don't necesarily feel any slump down low. The OE headers on the Windsors are a case in point. I have yet to see a definitive answer that tri-Ys improve the low down response at all.

I'm a bit scared because I actually agree with you.

Sox · 11-08-2010, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3man

That's good theory for a race engine Sox but it isn't necessarily the case for a street cammed vehicle. The revs that the 4>1s work at is determined by their length and that is dependent on the port size and cam. There are plenty of 4>1 designs that work from 3,000 up and you don't necesarily feel any slump down low. The OE headers on the Windsors are a case in point. I have yet to see a definitive answer that tri-Ys improve the low down response at all.

Yes it's true that 4-1's are tuned by their length, and to a lesser degree the tube diameter, however they don't scavenge nearly as well as a good tri-y at low revs, meaning below 5000rpm.

The OE headers are a great thing from an OE point POV, though they are a pretty average compared to a properly made set of headers.
They were simply built to perform as best as can to a budget.
The biggest problem with tri-y's is not many know how to make them work really well as they are more complex than 4-1's.

You have to deal primary and seconday length, and primary and secondary tube diameter. Only the very experienced get this right.
Mine have 2 different tube diameters in primary section alone.
Few header manufactures will be bothered going to these lenghts because it's costly, and the moment there header is $200 more than the competitors, they lose.

The difference between the OEM and the set made for me was night and day.
Low end response from idle picked up dramatically, mid range range much the same and the top end revs more freely.
There are no holes in the power curve, and no step.
The surge is perfectly linear.

But, they weren't cheap, though you get what you pay for.

I've put forward the usual arguments to the fella that made mine, and he said he's seen them all on engine dynos. He was in the game for over 20 years and knows what works.
Guess what he uses on his own car.......

Sox · 11-08-2010, 12:48 PM

Low end response from idle picked up dramatically, mid range range much the same and the top end revs more freely.

What I mean by that is the mid range picked up much the same as the low end did.
It was win win from top to bottom.

sleeper393 · 11-08-2010, 03:30 PM

Try burns stainless in the u.s, they have a form you can fill out and it will recommend the best header for you application, the you take the info to a good header builder give him the specs and your away.
http://www.burnsstainless.com/
download this form
http://www.burnsstainless.com/RESF.pdf

tbomb182 · 11-08-2010, 09:01 PM

hey i just took off a set of pacemaker tri y's and fitted a set of hi tech tri y's because of a ticking noise that sounded like a leak from the drivers side, still have the ticking and every 1 ive taken it to says its just exhaust echo or extractor slap ???? has anyone else had this problem ????? i have a au II xr8 ute !

WiggyMK2 · 11-08-2010, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomb182

hey i just took off a set of pacemaker tri y's and fitted a set of hi tech tri y's because of a ticking noise that sounded like a leak from the drivers side, still have the ticking and every 1 ive taken it to says its just exhaust echo or extractor slap ???? has anyone else had this problem ????? i have a au II xr8 ute !

Ive always been told that the noise you are discribing is the signs of a well made header i.e you can hear the individual cylinders firing. I had that sound on my custom pacemaker comps on my I6

b2tf · 11-08-2010, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomb182

hey i just took off a set of pacemaker tri y's and fitted a set of hi tech tri y's because of a ticking noise that sounded like a leak from the drivers side, still have the ticking and every 1 ive taken it to says its just exhaust echo or extractor slap ???? has anyone else had this problem ????? i have a au II xr8 ute !

What exactly is an 'extractor slap' - never heard of it. To me that sounds like you have a leak somewhere but you would think that they would find it somewhere in fitting 2 sets of headers. A weird one indeed.

KR1STO · 11-08-2010, 09:15 PM

charcoal canister perhaps...
Try posting a new thread in Aufalcon.com area..
or use the search box in the toolbar at the top of the page..

Cheers
Kris

KR1STO · 12-08-2010, 09:29 AM

I'm with you Austin...
Never heard of 'extractor slap'..?