Part, whatta part, dey all same, pixie dust

[whitetruck]

Ok this is my first post on this forum, even-though I have been around a fair while.
Because of my somewhat remote location and the downgrading of many traditional suppliers. I am forced these days to source most of my automotive parts on-line.
I recently bought some struts for my RTV, from a seller on ebay.
The ad read “2 Front SS Gas Strut Shock Absorbers FORD FALCON BA RTV Ute Cab Chassis 03-04”. But you guessed it, they arrived as standard BA struts.
Fortunately this seller had a contact number as well as the usual ebay return procedure. I rang them, after some convincing they agreed a ford falcon RTV ute excited with some parts different to the standard ute, an RA was arranged.
Well that was ok I guess, however while the replacement struts are RTV they are clearly not “new” as the original ad stated they are in fact rebuilt. Who do they think they are fooling? I am a man almost in his 60s and over 40 years in auto maintenance.

Another thing comes to mind I see many ads with mostly on-line sellers and some forums referring to aussie built falcons etc. as having V6 engines.
To those, Ford Australia never built a V6, all 6 cylinder Australian built falcons, fairmonts etc. have straight or inline 6s.
In fact I used to live in Geelong in 80s and 90s and had friends that worked at Fords casting plant. During that time ford cast many I6 blocks (blanks). I was told they were stored in SA somewhere near Woomera, in the dry desert great for aging the cast iron. Apparently those were the blocks ford used throughout the e series, au, ba and indeed fg’s. In fact we had probably the most well developed inline 6 in the world. By contrast Holden were importing V6 block castings from Mexico during much of that time, barely adhering to our then aussie made content rule. I’m proud that Ford Australia cast all there own engine blocks and developed, among other things, sophisticated shaving techniques in Australia with Australian workers, and so should you.

[mike_nofx]

Unusual I know, but many people don't understand what the V stands for in V6 so therefore all 6 cylinders are V6. Then you have workers at auto barn or super cheap when you ask for a part to suit a 2006 6 cylinder BF Falcon who say "I don't have a 6 cylinder on the system, just a 4000cc"

I also find many eBay sellers will list an item to suit BA and BF when I know that particular part is different between the 2 models. Many sellers assume that because they are 95% the same, that 100% of parts are interchangeable.

[Sabantien]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Unusual I know, but many people don't understand what the V stands for in V6 so therefore all 6 cylinders are V6. Then you have workers at auto barn or super cheap when you ask for a part to suit a 2006 6 cylinder BF Falcon who say "I don't have a 6 cylinder on the system, just a 4000cc"

I also find many eBay sellers will list an item to suit BA and BF when I know that particular part is different between the 2 models. Many sellers assume that because they are 95% the same, that 100% of parts are interchangeable.

Or my girlfriend's mechanic when I picked up her car from there. I asked him a question about my Falcon and he asked, "The V6?"

I will not be taking my car there.

[whitetruck]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Unusual I know, but many people don't understand what the V stands for in V6 so therefore all 6 cylinders are V6.

You know I never thought of that, but in hindsight it makes sense to me.

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Then you have workers at auto barn or super cheap when you ask for a part to suit a 2006 6 cylinder BF Falcon who say "I don't have a 6 cylinder on the system, just a 4000cc"

Yes I get that too. Just illustrates what pixie dust has made of us and our children IMO.

[lra]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Unusual I know, but many people don't understand what the V stands for in V6 so therefore all 6 cylinders are V6.

Thanks to Lego, my 7 year old grandson knows what V8, V6, L4 and Boxer4 engines are. When he first started asking about them, I took him to the garage and showed him a V8, V6 and L6, and with a few Lego bits, he understood.
Ignorance on the part of young parts salespersons is due to their lack of education and interest, and their bosses need a big kick in the bum for not ensuring that they know.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by lra

Thanks to Lego, my 7 year old grandson knows what V8, V6, L4 and Boxer4 engines are. When he first started asking about them, I took him to the garage and showed him a V8, V6 and L6, and with a few Lego bits, he understood.
Ignorance on the part of young parts salespersons is due to their lack of education and interest, and their bosses need a big kick in the bum for not ensuring that they know.

Overall, people don't care that much anymore about cars. I've mentioned before that when we bought a brand new G6E Falcon back at the start of 2011, I asked to see under the bonnet and the salesman was surprised, saying it had been maybe three months since anyone had asked to even see under the bonnet of a new car.
Then again...maybe the factories don't either. I pointed out that the engine block in the Falcon looked "rusty" and the salesman called the service manager out to have a look, and he shrugged and said he had noticed that on other cars...he said that "They probably save two bucks a car by not painting the engines anymore and no one cares about the look of the engine".

[lra]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

Overall, people don't care that much anymore about cars..

True ........ look at how they are advertised on TV, fun with friends, selfie photos, music, Appleplay (whatever that is), fantasy imaginings, satnav to get home when you don't know where you are ..... and somewhere in the background, behind the happy shiny people is "THE CAR".

[Itsme]

All I can say is you are taking a high risk if purchasing goods unseen from any obscure ebay sellers, I'm sure you can buy online from other trustworthy sources, if any most reputable businesses will post or freight spare parts to you for reasonable costs.

Interesting story you mentioned on the I6 blocks, I heard something similar years ago.....cheers.

[Vesper Martini]

Funny enough it sounds like you are dealing with an Ebay seller located in Australia.
especially if they have rebuilt parts. and a ph number
stick to your guns if anything they should agree on a discount.

I actually think Ebay is better than dealing with a store for returns support etc.
I just had some oversize signs that were falling apart replaced that I bought 2 years ago free of charge

[Mr Brooksy]

I had a Kloster Ford salesman telling me about the revolutionary Falcon V6 whilst standing in front of a brand new FG I6 XR6 with the bonnet open...

Some parts are fine to buy online, however first read all their feedback and compare with others before you commit. It's a minefield at times, but once you do your homework you can spot the fraudulent sellers most times.

[lra]

[QUOTE=Mr Brooksy;5873906]I had a Kloster Ford salesman telling me about the revolutionary Falcon V6 ................... QUOTE]

Oh dear, same dealer salesman who could not tell me what type of auto gearbox was in a Focus two years ago ? Torque converter, CVT or dual clutch ?
Took him 10 minutes to find out, then I said 'no thanks' and walked out.

[OwnTheRoad]

There are very few people in the auto sales and parts industry these days that are motoring enthusiasts, real knowledgeable parts interpreters are impossible to find as well.
Most are low paid clueless muppets.

[frankie86]

Originally Posted by OwnTheRoad

There are very few people in the auto sales and parts industry these days that are motoring enthusiasts, real knowledgeable parts interpreters are impossible to find as well.
Most are low paid clueless muppets.

110% correct, I've been a qualified parts interpreter for 14 years now and the quality of so called "interpreters" is a joke, most parts places will find a muppet who will take 19 bucks a hour, has no qualification but still get hired because they "like" cars, once rang a fellow so called interpreter at another store and asked him for big end bearings on a 88 model rx7... he actually had a look and said "sorry mate you gotta go genuine cause we haven't got a listing"

[commodorenutt]

^^^ Hahaha, I reckon he'd look up blinker fluid too!

Best one I had was when I was "accosted" by an over-zealous sales guy when I needed to buy a new timing light (broke my 25 year old one). Saw it on sale in the catalogue, so I went to that specific shop to buy it.

He leads me past the tool section, up to the parts counter, and pulls out a catalogue. I told him it would be on the shelf, pointing back towards the tools area, and said I'll go find it myself, but he proceeds to tell me they keep that stuff out the back now.
So I follow along with his cluelessness, thinking maybe not that many DIY people buy them anymore, and I'll need to order it in.

He and he asks me what model. I said it doesn't matter, they're generic. He tells me that certain cars run different options so he needs to know the model. So I tell him I can't use it on anything modern, but I actually want to use it on old Chevs and VL V8 Commodores, so look that up.
He says "2000cc, 3000cc or 3000cc turbo?"
"No, it's a 5L V8 - 4987cc actually." (didn't want to confuse him with the stroker).
"It can't be, it's not in the book, they mustn't have made one? Did you convert it?"
I couldn't help myself "No mate, but maybe Peter Brock converted them in 1986, he built 500 of them actually, do you want to see a photo?"

He still looked bewildered. So I continued. "He actually won Bathurst in '87 in one, albeit a late victory, and his last Bathurst 1000 win. Do you follow Bathurst at all?"

By this stage a more senior (like, can grow facial hair) guy wanders over. He asks what I'm looking for. I said "timing lights" - he laughs, and flips the book over - timing belts.


But he's topped by an even better one. Had a young P-plater barge past the queue to ask how much more power he'd get in his SSS Pulsar if he fitted one of the pod filters they had hanging on the wall behind them. Counter jockey's response was "normally about 5 to 0 kilowatts at the rear wheels"
I ****ed myself laughing. REAR wheels! Ripper, on a front wheel drive car. Neither of them even realised why it was so funny, but everyone else in the queue had a good chuckle.....

[Crazy Dazz]

Personally I prefer to pay a cheaper price to be served by somebody that hasn't a clue. I prefer to get my facts strait first, and not have to deal with someone that thinks selling crap for 20 years makes them an expert

[whitetruck]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Personally I prefer to pay a cheaper price to be served by somebody that hasn't a clue. I prefer to get my facts strait first, and not have to deal with someone that thinks selling crap for 20 years makes them an expert

Well I agree, I have always done this. However, to do this better we need accurate information. This is the way the original advertisement appearerd on ebay. 2 Front SS Gas Strut Shock Absorbers FORD FALCON BA RTV Ute Cab Chassis 03-04. Well despite, what seems the supplier thinks RTV is it not an abbreviation it is a legitimate and recognized ford falcon utility model.
I believe, these suppliers should be compelled to print OEM part numbers along with their number if any. Accurate dimensions etc. would also help, a photo is not enough because some put up representative or example photos.
Web sites like this help alot but more needs to done IMO.

[sasn07]

Originally Posted by whitetruck

Well I agree, I have always done this. However, to do this better we need accurate information. This is the way the original advertisement appearerd on ebay. 2 Front SS Gas Strut Shock Absorbers FORD FALCON BA RTV Ute Cab Chassis 03-04. Well despite, what seems the supplier thinks RTV is it not an abbreviation it is a legitimate and recognized ford falcon utility model.
I believe, these suppliers should be compelled to print OEM part numbers along with their number if any. Accurate dimensions etc. would also help, a photo is not enough because some put up representative or example photos.
Web sites like this help alot but more needs to done IMO.

Hello i was wondering do the rtv s have different front suspension to normal ba bf ours is 04 ba rtv ute auto 6cyl.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

[whitetruck]

Originally Posted by sasn07

Hello i was wondering do the rtv s have different front suspension to normal ba bf ours is 04 ba rtv ute auto 6cyl.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

I think this has already been covered elsewhere. But I can tell you there are just a few differences. The top wishbone is different only because the inboard fixing bracket is a different shape. The spindle [steering knuckle] has an inverted 7degree taper for the tie-rod end. I used a normal one by reaming and sleeving. The steering rack ends are a little longer, you can use a normal one so long as you use RTV ends or make an extended swivel joint with a lathe or something. The wheels have a different offset. Thats about it as I recall.

[Gothefalcon]

Originally Posted by whitetruck

I think this has already been covered elsewhere. But I can tell you there are just a few differences. The top wishbone is different only because the inboard fixing bracket is a different shape. The spindle [steering knuckle] has an inverted 7degree taper for the tie-rod end. I used a normal one by reaming and sleeving. The steering rack ends are a little longer, you can use a normal one so long as you use RTV ends or make an extended swivel joint with a lathe or something. The wheels have a different offset. Thats about it as I recall.

They also have a different shock absorber/spring arrangement and both front cross members are different to standard Falcon (dropping the pivot points of the lower control arm by 56(?)mm.. which is what gives the RTV it's lift.

D

[Gothefalcon]

Originally Posted by whitetruck

Well despite, what seems the supplier thinks RTV is it not an abbreviation it is a legitimate and recognized ford falcon utility model.

Correct... the RTV is another model Falcon in itself... but RTV is an also an abbreviation (or more an acronym) for Rough Terrain Vehicle.

D

[aussiblue]

But if we want to be pedantic strictly speaking Falcons don't have struts at all they have coil over shocks; they don't have strut suspension but double A arm , multilink or wishbone suspension. The most common true strut is a McPherson strut.

SAs they say here http://www.team-integra.net/forum/bl...-i-basics.html

Double Wishbone suspension also use the "coil-over-oil" design, much like the MacPherson Strut, which often leads to people calling the shock absorbers on their cars "struts" even when their cars don't use a strut type suspension.

But I have noticed over the last 20 years the distinction has been lost in general usage and now event some manufacturers call their coil overs struts in their parts catalogue. It might happen with the V6 versus inline 6 usage too as our Aussi sixes vanish from the market.

Also see http://mechanicalmania.blogspot.com....on-double.html