FPV’s resale value in the future.

[ITZON]

Hi all,
I’d like to see what everyone thinks about the resale value of FPV’s in the future. We’ll say 20+ years from now?

I own an FG MKII F6 Sedan, and I’m wondering whether I should sell it or not.
Part of me says hang onto it because it’s the last of the F6’s.
Other part of me says, it’s not worth spending an estimated $50,000 over the next 20 years to keep it registered, insured and maintained. Just to possibly see a greater return.

I highly doubt they will see resale values like the Phase 3 HO.
But you never know right. Im sure back in the 70’s people would never have thought a HO would be worth so much later in the future.


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[lra]

I seriously doubt if by 2040ish, a FPV will have the same magic as a (fake?) GTHO has today.
People's tastes change, technology changes, fuel (or whatever) will change.
Investors with their car-cooned FGXs and limited edition VF2s are going to be disappointed.
If you like it, drive it and enjoy it. If you don't, sell it to some-one who will.

[au2000]

Originally Posted by lra

I seriously doubt if by 2040ish, a FPV will have the same magic as a (fake?) GTHO has today.
People's tastes change, technology changes, fuel (or whatever) will change.
Investors with their car-cooned FGXs and limited edition VF2s are going to be disappointed.
If you like it, drive it and enjoy it. If you don't, sell it to some-one who will.

Could not agree more,
Although I do baby my GTE I'm not doing it for $$ I'm doing it as it's special to me and because my son will inherit it down the track. I stil drive it thoughcmind you it has less that 50,000 on it,
As for the GS, it will be one of the highest ks cars in the country once I'm done with it,

In 20 years time the market will be flooded with low k GTF fgx HSV's and SS from guys hoping to make a quick buck.

[ebv8]

if you paid top dollar the chances of making a profit are slim, picking up an FPV at the bottom of its value cycle would be the best bet
BA/BF's are cheap right now but are going up, gone are the days of a low km $15k BA GT, you would more likely get a well used one for that and $20+k for a low km one
i got mine at the low point and 5 years ago, after rego and insurance i'm well behind even though its increased in value.
mines in storage now because it is a plastic GT and won't age too well if i keep driving it and i don't need it now, i'm going to dust it off in a few years when my daughter has out grown her baby seat and can ride up front

[GT0132]

Originally Posted by ebv8

if you paid top dollar the chances of making a profit are slim, picking up an FPV at the bottom of its value cycle would be the best bet
BA/BF's are cheap right now but are going up, gone are the days of a low km $15k BA GT, you would more likely get a well used one for that and $20+k for a low km one
i got mine at the low point and 5 years ago, after rego and insurance i'm well behind even though its increased in value.
mines in storage now because it is a plastic GT and won't age too well if i keep driving it and i don't need it now, i'm going to dust it off in a few years when my daughter has out grown her baby seat and can ride up front

I don’t know about todays plastic not ageing too well. My BA GT is now over 14 years old with no visible signs of rust. Compare that with a 10 year old XC Fairmont I had in 1986 and it couldn't pass a rego inspection because of the rust it had . In general cars these days don't seem to rust as badly as they did in the 60's to 80's, but you do seem to notice that clearcoat on paint seems to be wearing thin on a lot of the 90's to 2000's cars.

[XR Martin]

Regardless of what car you own, you will still have the yearly rego, insurance and maintenance bills.
So you can either spend this on a car you enjoy or not.

The amount of Falcon enthusiasts won't increase, but probably won't decrease any further either.
The only thing that will decrease is the amount of cars over time.

So I think prices are as low as they'll ever be, but I doubt they'll ever get to silly amounts.

[fordomatic]

B series and early FG series GT's and F6's are still depreciating, they havn't even flattened out. I reckon it's almost there but i've seen a few low km BF GT's sell for low 20's lately which is super cheap.

Do I think they will be worth something in the future? I think so, you only have to look at what an immaculate AU series 3 XR8 is fetching these days or an AU TS50, fetching good dollars now. I don't think they will go to epic crazy prices though. Invest $40,000 in shares now, statistically in 30 years you'll have a lot more than $150,000.

As more and more of the GT and F6's end up with heaps of kms and on the scrap heap those in great condition will start to climb, simply because of supply and demand.

[Tsar01]

I got my 2011 GS Sedan 4 yrs ago and my Agreed value was $42k had 76thou on the clock then. Just got my Insurance renewal what a kick in the nuts, agreed value is now $32k premium up by $260 a year. Just clicked over 117000klm. Insurance company say its based on "Glasses" guide. Reckon we will be waiting a looong time for values to rise. Yes I know its "just" a GS not a GT or R or F, there still a minority build with an FPV badge. Value aside will keep driving it as its just too darn enjoyable, and when I go its passes down to the kids.

[M&Ms]

I've just had the opposite happen with my FGX XR8. Renewal came with agreed value up from $54.6k to $63.6k, and only a $70 premium increase! Do they know something I don't???

Still for sale though!

Originally Posted by Tsar01

I got my 2011 GS Sedan 4 yrs ago and my Agreed value was $42k had 76thou on the clock then. Just got my Insurance renewal what a kick in the nuts, agreed value is now $32k premium up by $260 a year. Just clicked over 117000klm. Insurance company say its based on "Glasses" guide. Reckon we will be waiting a looong time for values to rise. Yes I know its "just" a GS not a GT or R or F, there still a minority build with an FPV badge. Value aside will keep driving it as its just too darn enjoyable, and when I go its passes down to the kids.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by Fiji

The next generation car enthusiasts are more about buying a car for its specs on a page rather than how it drives, they keep their cara for 2 -3 years and flip em.

If a new model comes out with a 0-100 time that is 1/10th quicker, its time to trade it in. They want actual performance not nostalgia

The fpv GT cars are pretty good against a stopwatch but aren't that fun to drive. I'm thinking of trading my fgx xr8 for a Honda civic type r.. More fun to drive day to day.
Would be slower against a stop watch but more fun

Also thinking of trading your wife in for a man?

[sly_ba]

Originally Posted by Fiji

The next generation car enthusiasts are more about buying a car for its specs on a page rather than how it drives, they keep their cara for 2 -3 years and flip em.

If a new model comes out with a 0-100 time that is 1/10th quicker, its time to trade it in. They want actual performance not nostalgia

The fpv GT cars are pretty good against a stopwatch but aren't that fun to drive. I'm thinking of trading my fgx xr8 for a Honda civic type r.. More fun to drive day to day.
Would be slower against a stop watch but more fun

I would disagree. A well sorted car with quality suspension/brake components and a bit more hp is a blast to drive.

[minheim]

I think the biggest threats to an increase in price are electrification and demographics. In time the majority of cars on the road will be electric, hybrid or alternative fuel (hydrogen etc). You can bet that Governments will want to "tax" petrol based cars off the road and petrol will be expensive (thanks to climate change/pollution issues). Then there is the issue of demographics. The old supercars were race bred machines that inspired a generation of baby boomers who want to relive their youth or who influenced their kids and who have the money (super at hand or no mortgage/kids now). The later local performance cars don't have the same heritage of the supercars even though they outperform and handle them. I think later generations generally see cars as a disposable good that is upgraded for newer tech safety or economy hence they have a commodity rather than treasure attitude. Then if you factor in the costs of maintaining and insuring the car for investment as others have said is it worth the trouble. As others have said drive and keep for enjoyment not hoped for profit. The other issue I think they will weigh in is that unlike the old supercars the later local performance cars are increasingly reliant on electrical components which will fail and be harder to replace/repair or source as time goes buy given they were small volume cars.

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by minheim

The old supercars were race bred machines that inspired a generation of baby boomers who want to relive their youth

I'm 34 and just bought an EL because I had two of them when I was younger. I intend to keep it some time.

Same goes I guess.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by minheim

I think the biggest threats to an increase in price are electrification and demographics. In time the majority of cars on the road will be electric, hybrid or alternative fuel (hydrogen etc). You can bet that Governments will want to "tax" petrol based cars off the road and petrol will be expensive (thanks to climate change/pollution issues). Then there is the issue of demographics. The old supercars were race bred machines that inspired a generation of baby boomers who want to relive their youth or who influenced their kids and who have the money (super at hand or no mortgage/kids now). The later local performance cars don't have the same heritage of the supercars even though they outperform and handle them. I think later generations generally see cars as a disposable good that is upgraded for newer tech safety or economy hence they have a commodity rather than treasure attitude. Then if you factor in the costs of maintaining and insuring the car for investment as others have said is it worth the trouble. As others have said drive and keep for enjoyment not hoped for profit. The other issue I think they will weigh in is that unlike the old supercars the later local performance cars are increasingly reliant on electrical components which will fail and be harder to replace/repair or source as time goes buy given they were small volume cars.

To carry on from your demographics point...

The car scene over the past 20 years has opened up a lot of decent performing Jap and European cars which a lot of them shat on anything out of HSV or FPV.
These cars have become cheap to buy, diluting the market to enthusiast in that time (reducing the amount of people that FPV/HSV appeal to).
If motoring enthusiasts aren’t into other performance cars, a lot are into 4wding, a scene that had also taken off over the past 20 or so years, especially with then popularity of the DC Ute.

The traditional buyer of HSV/FPV is the white Aussie, who are becoming a minority in a country where living costs are constantly rising. A lot of people will not place an older car on their list of priorities while they struggle to or cannot afford to buy a house, or live pay check to pay check.

As far as investments go, there is no global market for these. The amount of potential buyers an FPV will appeal to further down the track will be minuscule.
Contrast that with desirable Jap and Euro cars which have cult followings all over the world. Only need to look at prices for 911 Porsche’s, E type Jags, any high end Mercedes from the ‘60s-70s, BMW E28-39 M5, M Coupe, E46 M3 (manual).

[GT0132]

Originally Posted by smoo

To carry on from your demographics point...

The car scene over the past 20 years has opened up a lot of decent performing Jap and European cars which a lot of them shat on anything out of HSV or FPV.
These cars have become cheap to buy, diluting the market to enthusiast in that time (reducing the amount of people that FPV/HSV appeal to).
If motoring enthusiasts aren’t into other performance cars, a lot are into 4wding, a scene that had also taken off over the past 20 or so years, especially with then popularity of the DC Ute.

The traditional buyer of HSV/FPV is the white Aussie, who are becoming a minority in a country where living costs are constantly rising. A lot of people will not place an older car on their list of priorities while they struggle to or cannot afford to buy a house, or live pay check to pay check.

As far as investments go, there is no global market for these. The amount of potential buyers an FPV will appeal to further down the track will be minuscule.
Contrast that with desirable Jap and Euro cars which have cult followings all over the world. Only need to look at prices for 911 Porsche’s, E type Jags, any high end Mercedes from the ‘60s-70s, BMW E28-39 M5, M Coupe, E46 M3 (manual).

Exactly why I don't see the market for local old school muscle being sustainable. Guys who are in their 50's-60's now were teenagers in the late 60's and 70's. They grew up with Aussie and American muscle which their Dads owned and they wanted to continue the tradition by buying a piece of that history themselves. Trouble is the stock numbers are much fewer than back in the day so the prices rise accordingly.

The kids of those 50-60 year olds are now at an age where they can now drive (including my own two sons) . When discussing the topic of cars with my sons and their mates, they are either (a) not into cars at all - an uber app on the phone is all they need for transport, or (b) they buy a car as a mode of transport because i.e they need it for work , or (c) are car enthusiasts to a point but balk at the idea of owning Aussie or American muscle as they are considered cars for oldies and much prefer a Euro.

A facebook owners survey on the age of new S550 Mustang owners in Australia revealed that almost 70% are aged over 45 which shows that even though the Mustang is at the cheap end of performance cars in Australia based on bang for buck, they are not appealing to young buyers - again a market being driven primarlily by the more mature drivers who see owning a Mustang as a bucket list thing.

So , the way I see it once the baby boomers and the first half of Gen X are dead and buried the Aussie/US performance car market will, by enlarge, go with them.

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by GT0132

Exactly why I don't see the market for local old school muscle being sustainable. Guys who are in their 50's-60's now were teenagers in the late 60's and 70's. They grew up with Aussie and American muscle which their Dads owned and they wanted to continue the tradition by buying a piece of that history themselves. Trouble is the stock numbers are much fewer than back in the day so the prices rise accordingly.

The kids of those 50-60 year olds are now at an age where they can now drive (including my own two sons) . When discussing the topic of cars with my sons and their mates, they are either (a) not into cars at all - an uber app on the phone is all they need for transport, or (b) they buy a car as a mode of transport because i.e they need it for work , or (c) are car enthusiasts to a point but balk at the idea of owning Aussie or American muscle as they are considered cars for oldies and much prefer a Euro.

A facebook owners survey on the age of new S550 Mustang owners in Australia revealed that almost 70% are aged over 45 which shows that even though the Mustang is at the cheap end of performance cars in Australia based on bang for buck, they are not appealing to young buyers - again a market being driven primarlily by the more mature drivers who see owning a Mustang as a bucket list thing.

So , the way I see it once the baby boomers and the first half of Gen X are dead and buried the Aussie/US performance car market will, by enlarge, go with them.

What do we define as young? Under 45?

How many under 45s are going out to buy a current generation Mustang? Presumably, a huge proportion of under 45s would be in family mode, ergo the Mustang wouldn't be a suitable vehicle. Would the same have been said for the last of the performance Commodores?

If current trends are younger generations moving away from buying toy cars so to speak, there's not necessarily anything to suggest that this won't turn back around. Our economy is fickle and you just never know what is going to happen.

Like all vehicles, stock numbers will continue to decrease for availability even with modern vehicles. This same conversation may have been valid 30 years ago, for instance. If I recall, an old girlfriends father wrote off two XY GT or GTHOs (can't recall) - they were of no sentimental value to him around that time and just everyday cars you could buy - just like modern cars aren't sentimental now.. but of course they will have some sentiment in the future.

[Polyal]

Its going to be interesting, will these cars be sought after in 10-20 years? You need to ask the people with the disposable income.

I think thats going to be the greatest challenge, the culture and market has moved on. All these people who have sunk $$ into them for investments may get burnt IMO. I wouldnt leave selling any longer than 10 years and I certainly wouldnt be dropping big $$ into modern FPV's if all you are after is a good ROI.

For example, it may be a bit late now but the Gran Turismo generation will and are buying up hi-po Japanese cars now. So finding the next lot of collectibles or trends is the key.

Its going to be interesting to see who is going to spend $500k on a XT GT in 10 years time.

[cheap]

My view is that the technology that goes into modern cars it will become a total nightmare to keep these vehicles serviced and roadworthy in +25 years time. Modern cars are built with a shelf life of 5-7 years, they show their age very quickly.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by cheap

My view is that the technology that goes into modern cars it will become a total nightmare to keep these vehicles serviced and roadworthy in +25 years time. Modern cars are built with a shelf life of 5-7 years, they show their age very quickly.

tech back up will roll with the era of the car for a while yet

problems will be with often stacked bits, plastics and harder to source model specific parts are already there

[lra]

Originally Posted by Fiji

I have a fgx xr8 I hardly drive.. not to get money for it in the future. More so to enjoy it for a longer time and own a unique car in the future in great condition.

Me... delete fgx xr8, insert CV8. Same reasons .
First owner, driven rarely because DHs want to race. Grandson wants it when I fall off the perch. Be interesting if he still wants it in 7 years time.

[davenl5l]

Originally Posted by Fiji

I doubt there will be any dollar increase. It's only the mob on here that pay for these Ford's and to be honest I see the interest dwindling away by the day, we are getting older too.. the next generation aren't interested in cars like us.

Look at some of the sub forums on here, lucky if there is a post here and there. Years back a thread would go pages and pages in a single day.

We are all unfortunately disbanding as a community and cars will only improve making the old fpv cars nothing to get excited about. Whilst some of us talk fpv, we drive a suv.

The used car market will be flooded with various brand used performance cars soon, going for cheap and most of them would give an fpv a black eye too.

I have a fgx xr8 I hardly drive.. not to get money for it in the future. More so to enjoy it for a longer time and own a unique car in the future in great condition.

thats because of all the specialist car groups on face book

[ITZON]

I’m quite surprised at the amount of honesty that has be put forth from everyone in this thread.
Everyone pretty much seems to be on the same page, which is basically these cars won’t be a gold mine in years to come.

I’ve brought this topic up a fair bit with people and plenty of them have given me the opposite answer.
“Nah don’t sell, it will be worth heaps in the future, it’s the last of the aussie fords” etc etc.

I’ve come to the decision to sell my F6 a little over a week ago, but have always been in two minds about it. But as each day goes by and more thoughts filter through my mind, it’s becoming easier to let it go.

Yes I love the car and enjoy it very much.
I’ve put heaps of time and money into it, to make it faster and look different.
But at the end of the day, I’ve achieved what I set out to do.
That was to have a fast ford and crack a 10 second 1/4 mile pass.
Now that I have done that, I don’t have the urge to go faster anymore.
Besides, with the current road laws, it’s pretty much pointless owning a powerhouse street car.
You can’t use it safely and legally.
So, it’s time to let it go and move on to something else.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by ITZON

I’ve brought this topic up a fair bit with people and plenty of them have given me the opposite answer.
“Nah don’t sell, it will be worth heaps in the future, it’s the last of the aussie fords” etc etc.

You may find people will say things like that but are not the ones willing to be the one holding onto it themselves. funny how it changes when its their own money

IMO
If these cars go up in value it will be to around the value they were new - nothing more.

[JC]

Originally Posted by ITZON

I’m quite surprised at the amount of honesty that has be put forth from everyone in this thread.
Everyone pretty much seems to be on the same page, which is basically these cars won’t be a gold mine in years to come.

I’ve brought this topic up a fair bit with people and plenty of them have given me the opposite answer.
“Nah don’t sell, it will be worth heaps in the future, it’s the last of the aussie fords” etc etc.

I’ve come to the decision to sell my F6 a little over a week ago, but have always been in two minds about it. But as each day goes by and more thoughts filter through my mind, it’s becoming easier to let it go.

Yes I love the car and enjoy it very much.
I’ve put heaps of time and money into it, to make it faster and look different.
But at the end of the day, I’ve achieved what I set out to do.
That was to have a fast ford and crack a 10 second 1/4 mile pass.
Now that I have done that, I don’t have the urge to go faster anymore.
Besides, with the current road laws, it’s pretty much pointless owning a powerhouse street car.
You can’t use it safely and legally.
So, it’s time to let it go and move on to something else.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, it’s only an F6 not a GT so selling is the right decision.

[fordomatic]

I dunno, i'm in the young age bracket, i'm 32, i'd consider myself and my friends to be upper middle class. Most of us are car enthusiasts, we have modern muscle worth over 20k plus and love our cars.

I think you older blokes just aren't in touch with us younger ones. I'm not keen on sitting at a car show on my weekends but i love going cruising with my mates on a friday night, stopping with other youg enthusiasts, talking crap and heading home. I Sold a VE Clubsport for a decent amount more than I paid for it after owning it for two years. I've been offered 12.5k for my AU XR8 and it owes me 8k, i don't think the car scene is dead.

I just don't think prices will skyrocket like they did for the older muscle, they will probably just hold their value as time goes on and slowly increase. I've been watching V8 prices over the last 5 years and the only ones still going down are B series, but even then good examples are still fetching ok money.

[GT0132]

Sure there's gonna be exceptions but in general terms the passion is changing

I'm 56 and when we got our drivers licences in late 70's my mates and I all drove Fords, Holdens and Valiants and spent vast amounts of coin on them. Our parents drove Fords, Holdens and Valiants – mostly station wagons in those days as they were the flavour. Others had utes and vans, a couple had GT's, XU1's and Chargers. Not unusual to see a Mum drive an HQ GTS to pick up the kids from school. Now 30 to 40 years later many of those blokes want to relive the past. Totally understandable

Fast forward to this generation…Ford, Holden and Valiants ???……well if they're not around anymore people just aren't buying them. It's Kia's, Hyundai's, Camry's, Mazda CX5's and any other SUV you care to name . Its no wonder kids don't aspire to be motoring enthusiasts anymore when you consider what their parents are driving. The fun has died . Here's the opinions of my 2 kids and 2 step kids on cars

1. Son aged 24 – has a license but doesn't own a car, sees them as a waste of money and would rather save to travel overseas again. If he needs to get from A to B, he'll get public transport or Uber.

2. Son aged 21 – owns a second hand Mazda 3 to get him to uni and back otherwise it sits at home. Sees cars as being like a TV…a necessity but a depreciable asset.

3. Step son aged 22 – works as a mechanic and drives a rough VZ SS Commodore. The car keeps him broke and can't wait till he gets a job where he can save enough coin to buy what he calls a respectable car (BMW M3)

4. Daughter aged 20 – drives a large SUV to tow her horsefloat. If it wasn't for the horse she'd want to own a Subaru Imprezza. Out of the 4 she is the only one who likes my cars and takes an interest but has said she'd never want to own either one and when I was looking at buying an old school 1970 Mach 1 Mustang instead of the 2017 she couldn't understand why.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

I dunno, i'm in the young age bracket, i'm 32, i'd consider myself and my friends to be upper middle class. Most of us are car enthusiasts, we have modern muscle worth over 20k plus and love our cars.

I think you older blokes just aren't in touch with us younger ones. I'm not keen on sitting at a car show on my weekends but i love going cruising with my mates on a friday night, stopping with other youg enthusiasts, talking crap and heading home. I Sold a VE Clubsport for a decent amount more than I paid for it after owning it for two years. I've been offered 12.5k for my AU XR8 and it owes me 8k, i don't think the car scene is dead.

I just don't think prices will skyrocket like they did for the older muscle, they will probably just hold their value as time goes on and slowly increase. I've been watching V8 prices over the last 5 years and the only ones still going down are B series, but even then good examples are still fetching ok money.

What you are also witnessing is cars of "our" age being at a price point that is still attainable but also from that generation.

Im a 80/90's kid and recently bought a ZF Fairlane, but more for sentimental reasons while my Dad is still around. And its a shedload cheaper than getting a XA/XB Falcon and its essentially the same experience.

For me the F6 was the halo car even if the GT had the badge. To be honest if I had space and the extra cash if happily have one of each.

Point is you can buy modern muscle and break even, or if you play it well make a little bit of coin. But remember, when you do you maths dont forget ll the $$ spent in bringing brakes, suspension, diff bushes etc up to scratch. Comparing the buy and sale price is only half the story.

But most of all, buy what you want, drive it, because one day you wont be able too.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by lra

Last night I was reading about Mick Jagger's heart problems, and how many rock legends have passed away lately, and that some music guru was declaring rock and roll was dead.
Young people prefer hip-hop, rap and light pop.
This thread is similar, 'the times, they are achanging'. The majority of the younger generation just don't have any passion for cars. I could speculate on a dozen reasons, but can't be bothered as I am too old.
So, I will sit here with my coffee mug, and think about what AC/DC, Stones, LedZep, or DeepPurple CD I can slot into the dash of my V8 tomorrow.

What garbage. Just look how many people turn up to see Metallica, The Foo Fighters etc. Then look at how many people turn up to see rappers. Only the absolute top end rappers like Eminem, Jay Z etc can bring in big crowds.

Might be a different story in the US where rap is more widespread, but we don't have that culture, nor do we have a big african american population (raps biggest audience).

[PooDog]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

What garbage. Just look how many people turn up to see Metallica, The Foo Fighters etc. Then look at how many people turn up to see rappers. Only the absolute top end rappers like Eminem, Jay Z etc can bring in big crowds.

Might be a different story in the US where rap is more widespread, but we don't have that culture, nor do we have a big african american population (raps biggest audience).

Really ....i spend a lot of time at servos unloading and every car full of young ones that comes in sub shaking the parcel tray and distorting to the max has some gangster/ hip hop crap spewing out , my young fellas 30 now and when i go out in his car about an hour of boom chic, boom chic gangster crap is all i can stand ....and he grew up on Floyd, Metallica ,LedZep

My apologies for taking the thread off track

[raised by monkeys]

you mean like guys with BF Rspec F6's trying to sell them for absolute fortunes because of a build number?

edit. A car with the only changes/addiiton to other same series f6's being suspension, floor mats and another badge. I'll pass on that 10-20k jump in price, especially when those floor mats and suspension are flogged out in a 13yr old car now anyway.