High Performance Cars And P Platers

[XR-ENVI]

got my rego in the mail today and next to the sticker in bold print is the statement " PROBATIONARY DRIVERS MUST NOT DRIVE HIGH POWERED VEHICLES UNLESS EXEMPTED BY THE PROVISIONS OF THE ROAD SAFETY (DRIVERS) REGS 1999"
i know this has probably been bought up before but
HOW many p-platers get round in high performance cars!!!!
why dont the cops and vic roads regulate this properly

[Falcon Coupe]

I hear ya, two P platers i personally know are driving hypo 308 holdens, one has 260rwkw, the other has 220 rwkw, this rule is just not policed.

[sbutler]

Sbutler Jnr here and i drive a XT V8 on red P's

[Falcon Coupe]

Jnr one of the cars i mentioned pulls an 11:50 @ 118mph.

[Kryton]

yep another rule IMO that needs to be enforced alot more.

[svo347]

wtf's red "P"'s

[b2tf]

At the risk of starting another long winded thread debating the pros and cons of this issue, i will try to keep this short and (perhaps not) sweet.

I am a Green P plater, and in all honesty i would absolutely love to drive a 'performance' car, ideally an N/A XR6. However, there is one reason, and one reason alone why i wont do it. It's not because i cant afford the car or the upkeep, its because i refuse to line the pockets of an insurance company.

For that reason alone i am reluctantly going to wait till i am over 25 with a bit better rating to get behind the wheel of an XR, FPV or similar.
Too many people my age i know are working day and night to afford the insurance and rego on SS's and the like, while i am just about to slip into a Focus, which may not have enough go for some but is more than adequate to get me to and from work each day.

In my opinion it's not the 'laws' or 'legislations' that would stop me, its a rational look at the costs of running such a vehicle at my age.


Oh, and svo347, NSW has 2 levels of Probationary Licence - first is Red P's, 90kms/hr and 4 points, 2nd is Green P's, 100kms/hr and 7 points.

[Falcon Coupe]

You have taken the mature option B2F, good for you, i did the same thing, i didn't own my first V8 until i was over 30.
BTW it's a better looking and MUCH faster V8 than my friends all had....which they do not anymore

[T_Terror]

Well done people.

Its good to know that "some" people actually believe the shock media reports from great news providers like Herald Sun and Today Tonight. P-plater + fast car = instant death!


Seriously, i cant believe some people actually care about the power-to-weight law. All it does is restrict young motoring enthusiasts becasue of a few bad apples who present a nice target for the media and outraged citizens such as yourself.

Falcon Coupe, so what if you know young drivers with strong V8s? Does it automatically mean theyre shit drivers?

Personally i dont have the patience to wait till 30 to own a V8/turbo, and i have yet to see any valid reasons why i should have to wait till 21.


I believe in targeting bad drivers, not age groups in an effort to improve road safety. A better licencing system would be far more appropriate instead of screwing me cause some idiot from the other side of town drives like a ********.

[sbutler]

Most of these guys that get killed or hurt, are driving old commies, or old nissan skylines, or the like. Why the majority is held responsable for the minority I dont know......

[XR-ENVI]

this was all about the law not what today tonight a current affair or statistics say.
laws are there for a reason, and yeah perhaps they base it on statistics, but that is how the reason for the law is backed up, my point was, if its a law then why isnt it policed. Unfortunately laws are there and we should CARE about them, there are consequences if we dont. So its not about personal opinion its about the LAW. And by the way you dont have to be 30 to get a V8 or a turbo, unless of course you dont get your P's until you are 27.

And also in alot of things the minority wreck it for the majority, happens everywhere, not jsut on the roads but at work and in the community.

[Yaw]

I have a question to pose to you guys that think its unfair about power to weight issues and the "majority being blamed for the minority"

I know this has not been brought up here but in another thread about insurance if you have a read through there are a lot of differing opinions.
Link: http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=6160

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=6636

If insurance companies are out to line thier own pockets by charging high premiums, why then do so many of them say to under 25 drivers no V8'S, No Turbos, we DO NOT want your buisness. ?
Do you honestly think if an insuarnace company can make money they would knock back the buisness????


The answer is simple, the statistics of claims made by young people is too high let alone a high powered machine.
Have a think about it that rationally.

I for one an all for a power to weight ratio for not just p platers but drivers with less than 5 years experience.

[Falcon Coupe]

Originally Posted by T_Terror

Well done people.
Falcon Coupe, so what if you know young drivers with strong V8s? Does it automatically mean theyre shit drivers?

It does not mean they are bad drivers, only inexperianced, one of the cars turned the tyres and stepped left as he changed into 3rd gear at around 130kph while cresting a small rise, this was a dry road with an 19 yo at the wheel ! but he had nearly a years experiance in a 1.3 litre Escort, so i guess it's ok. :
And whether we think it's ok or not, it is still breaking the law.

[XR-ENVI]

here here!

[Psycho Chicken]

The system is stupid, you can't expect someone to drive a 4 cylinder pos for 3 years then automatically know how to drive a high powered car. Yes they may be a better driver due to 3 years experience, but 3 years in a 1.5 litre FWD means shit all when you lose the **** end of a RWD V8.

Power has nothing to do with it, it's how you drive it. I've driven cars three times over the power to weight limit and didn't stack one of them.

[xdc351]

Its a load of rubbish. Its just Victoria that has the power restrictions isn't it?

I wonder if their statistics are made to look worse when they compare 'P' plater accidents in Vic as compared to the rest of Aus but fail to compensate for the mandetory 3 year probationary period in Vic. Its just more swinging in the dark from the bracks government.

I had a 351 on my 'P' and didn't hurt or kill anyone. Also, any law that classifies a BA XT Utility as a 'high powered' vehicle is not worth having. Luckily for 18yo tradesmen its not policed.

[Yagz]

I drive a V8 on my P's here in victoria (got one on my 19th bday), and i don't get picked on much..

That said, i don't wear my P plates very often..

[T_Terror]

Originally Posted by XR-ENVI

this was all about the law not what today tonight a current affair or statistics say.
laws are there for a reason, and yeah perhaps they base it on statistics, but that is how the reason for the law is backed up, my point was, if its a law then why isnt it policed. Unfortunately laws are there and we should CARE about them, there are consequences if we dont. So its not about personal opinion its about the LAW. And by the way you dont have to be 30 to get a V8 or a turbo, unless of course you dont get your P's until you are 27.

And also in alot of things the minority wreck it for the majority, happens everywhere, not jsut on the roads but at work and in the community.

Youre argument rests on the premise that the Government is wise and all knowing :

Laws are brought in by the Government (and the courts, but thats another story) and arent always necesarily "right". Plenty have been scrapped due to public opinion.
Do you really believe that the obsession with "speeding" and the laws which convieniently allow teh State Government to reap millions from motorists are genuinely in place for the sole benefit of safety?

Ive studied law and politics and how one sometimes influences the other with unfortunate results. The law is determined by the people, so if i disgree with a law it is whithin my power to change it.
As a citizen it is my right to protest laws which i dont agree with (as well as laws which i want put into place). Thats what being a democracy is all about.

If you agree with the current laws then youll show youre support by voting for Bracks at the next election. Nothing wrong with that.

And by the way you dont have to be 30 to get a V8 or a turbo, unless of course you dont get your P's until you are 27.

I know you dont have to be 30 to get a fast car, i was just questioning the logic behind the often-heard argument that getting older will magically make you a better driver.

And also in alot of things the minority wreck it for the majority, happens everywhere, not jsut on the roads but at work and in the community.

Im glad we agree on something, however i dont believe a person has the right to complain about the something unless they do something about it.

[ef5l]

im 19 on my p's i own a v8, the way i see it im safer in my falcon than in some of my mates datsun and etc, mine stops and handles unlike the peices of shit that shouldn pass rego. but one thing id like to add driver training should be included in gettin a licence it would make more of a difference then simply tellin me i cant drive my pride and joy.

[b2tf]

Originally Posted by ef5l

im 19 on my p's i own a v8, the way i see it im safer in my falcon than in some of my mates datsun and etc, mine stops and handles unlike the peices of shit that shouldn pass rego. but one thing id like to add driver training should be included in gettin a licence it would make more of a difference then simply tellin me i cant drive my pride and joy.

I agree with you on that, better policing of dodgy cars and dodgy mechanics handing out RWC's would be nice to see. I also 100% agree with you driver training.

[shane3]

It's amazing to see that people think that driving a V8 with all that "power" on your "P's" will get you killed, you should jump on a Suzuki GSXR750T and do the almost 300km/h that the bike is capable of, It does have some power and a LOT of speed! And you will find that it's the speed aspect of thing's that people get court up on.
Then Again I can talk as I was driving my FPV GT on my "P's".

[flukeyluke]

It all comes down to maturity. Some numbnuts (P Platers) up the street from me drift past in their Silvias all the time. These guys should be made to drive 1973 Corollas.

I dont have issues with anybody enjoying their cars in the right place.

[Psycho Chicken]

Originally Posted by flukeyluke

I dont have issues with anybody enjoying their cars in the right place.

That's what it boils down to, however there is no simple way to say who is responsible and who isn't.

[Trevor 57]

Dear oh dear, here we go again. I am going to try to stay out of this one, but to correct this statement.

Originally Posted by xdc351

Its just more swinging in the dark from the bracks government.

This law has been around since the late '80's or early '90's, so there is no point blaming the current Government. I was a round when it was introduced if you want to argue the point with me on this.

The law was introduced around the same time as the 260cc restriction on motorbike P & L plate riders.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by back2thefutura

I agree with you on that, better policing of dodgy cars and dodgy mechanics handing out RWC's would be nice to see.

Less than 1% of all fatal or serious accidents in Victoria have been attibuted to un-roadworthy cars, this is why the Victorian Government won't enforce compulsory roadworthies every year like other States, the accidents statistics just don't support it's introduction.

I also 100% agree with you driver training.

I refer you to my post on the following thread: Kee jerk reaction by Police and one of my statements in particular

By nature, humans are risk taking animals. This is a good thing otherwise we wouldn't have evolved to where we are today.

Most animals in their teens (or formative time) show higher than normal risk taking behaviour, humans are no different, in fact I would go as far to say that teen humans are many times worse because of their intelligence(?).

No matter how much we try to educate, we cannot train out this natural risk taking behaviour. We can try to reduce it only

[FASTXR]

Originally Posted by Yaw

If insurance companies are out to line thier own pockets by charging high premiums, why then do so many of them say to under 25 drivers no V8'S, No Turbos, we DO NOT want your buisness. ?
Do you honestly think if an insuarnace company can make money they would knock back the buisness????

As a side note to this, I'm 36 and have a maximum no claim bonus with my car insurance (AAMI). I've just gone from an EF XR6 to an AU XR8, and both policies have stated that my insurance is completely void if the vehicles were driven by anyone under the age of 25.

Hey, at least it keeps the gf out of the car :

[XRQTOR]

Im 2o and bought my Ba xr8 (MKII) when i was 19. This car has 50% more power than my first car Ef xr8 and is 1oo% safer on the roads, brakes better handles better better safety designs. Its not what you drive it's how you drive that causes accidents. If everyone drove according to the road rules and the speed limits there'd be bugger all accidents regaurdless of the type of cars involved.


Speed is the biggest factor in death's on our roads, young or old. Not many people die from hitting other cars or poles doing the speedlimit.

S.A has a rule for P platers, get caught doing 1ok's and over and you lose your licece on the spot for 6 months. Top rule, kept me at sain speeds most of the time. I bet only 1% of cars on australian roads aren't capable of reaching and exceeding any speedlimit.

[Tiges]

My mate got done a couple of days ago for Neg. Driving. I took the corner just as fast or even faster too keep up with him, slid across the road going around the roundabout, with the cop on my *** the whole time, the cop pulled out and went flying past me and got my mate.

When the cop pulled him over, he did the normal cop stuff and said to him "dont you think this car has a bit too much power for a 17yo"! His car is a VP or VQ V8 Statesman and mine is a POS (and i will gladly say it is) 1988 Magna.

My mate asked the cop why he didnt get me as well (the bastard) the cop said that all he heard was his car and saw P on the back off it.

So my understanding of what happened is that a cop didnt take any notice of me doing the same thing as my mate as I am driving a POS and he is driving a V8 and got pulled over for it, either being a V8 with a "P" on it or just the cop wanted him, not me.

[Cobra]

Tiges are you on your Ps too? What state are you in?

[XRQTOR]

Originally Posted by Tiges

My mate got done a couple of days ago for Neg. Driving. I took the corner just as fast or even faster too keep up with him, slid across the road going around the roundabout, with the cop on my *** the whole time, the cop pulled out and went flying past me and got my mate.

When the cop pulled him over, he did the normal cop stuff and said to him "dont you think this car has a bit too much power for a 17yo"! His car is a VP or VQ V8 Statesman and mine is a POS (and i will gladly say it is) 1988 Magna.

My mate asked the cop why he didnt get me as well (the bastard) the cop said that all he heard was his car and saw P on the back off it.

So my understanding of what happened is that a cop didnt take any notice of me doing the same thing as my mate as I am driving a POS and he is driving a V8 and got pulled over for it, either being a V8 with a "P" on it or just the cop wanted him, not me.

Copper knew he was going to be able to give him another ticket, makes himm look better. I also bet you didn't slide anywhere near as far as he did going through the round about, makes him stand out more than you.

If that was my mate i'd belt him for trying to get me in the shit, then belt him again for driving a commadore.