Need someone's help with wiring...

Alan Shore · 29-01-2007, 04:25 PM

Hey peoples...been racking my brain out trying to wire my EL thermo's to a relay that incorporates a temp switch (used in the spare hole in the thermostat housing). I'm gonna give up coz I'm stupid

: if anyone has some free time during the week at any time during the day or night...come over and wire them up for me. There's either cash or booze for whoever's up for it. I live in the northern suburbs of Melbourne...PM I guess...

EA2BA · 29-01-2007, 04:43 PM

North is a long way from me, or I would help you out.

EL XR8 · 29-01-2007, 05:07 PM

Have you got the thermo switch mounted anywhere yet?
Cause if you have, i can easily help you with the relay. They're easy to wire up.

Alan Shore · 29-01-2007, 05:22 PM

Oop I should re-affirm that I'm using a 'Narva' relay (I've got a 4pin and a 5 pin just in case), a coolant temp sensor from a Honda Integra or Civic (on at 85c I believe) which I have already screwed into the housing...and of course the fans...

**aussiblue** · 29-01-2007, 07:46 PM

See http://www.the12volt.com/relays/relays.asp This should help you understand what you need to do. Essentially you get one wire to run from the battery through the relay pin 85 to the from pin 86 temp sensor so that when it grounds it switches the relay coil so current flow from another wire that goes to the relay pin 30 and via pin 87a at the relay switch to the fans and the fans are earthed (black wire goes to ground).

EL XR8 · 29-01-2007, 07:50 PM

Ok well thats a good start.

You will need to get a supply across from the battery or another constant 12V source. Battery is just easier, and you know you're not going to be overloading another circuit in the car. This will connect into the no. 30 on the relay.

Then you will need an Earth, you can get that anywhere on the chassis, or usually engine bay, or the negative side of the battery. This connects into the no. 85 pin on the relay.

Then you need to get a signal supply from the thermostat to the relay, this connects into the no. 86 terminal of the relay.

Then you'll need two supplies to have both thermo's running, so use you 5 pin relay and go from the two 87 pin on the relay to the two red wires on the thermo's.

Then you just need to get another or bridge off the earth on your relay to plug into the two black wires coming from your thermo's.

That should be about it.
I don't know if that makes much sense.

**aussiblue** · 29-01-2007, 07:56 PM

Also see http://oldholden.com/possible/index....System_Upgrade
and http://www.panteraplace.com/Tech%20I...%20mod%20a.gif

**aussiblue** · 29-01-2007, 08:06 PM

and http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2.../schematic.gif
and http://www.aaroncake.net/rx-7/efaninstall1.gif

Alan Shore · 29-01-2007, 09:09 PM

Hmm...EL XR8...pretty sure I've tried that setup before but with no results. I've got power into the relay (30), temp switch into relay (86), negative of switch into relay (85), power of fans into relay (87 and 87a). Nothing. I then changed the negative of the switch to just any ground source...fans into relay. Nothing. I've tried numerous things...even bought another relay to make sure...but I can't make sense of it...worst. I've left the car to run for quite a few minutes (even after I've just got home from work) so it should be round the temperature where the fans come on...I dunno :(

used:

EL XR8 · 29-01-2007, 10:04 PM

Well what you can do to check to see if its the thermostat you have already connected that could be playing up, is put another 12v supply across where the thermostat wire plugs into on the relay (86), then you will no for sure where the thermo fans work, and if the relay is switching correctly.
You will need a Negative/Earth wire to the relay, and then one to the two terminals on the connector block of the thermo fans, and the two supply wires to the thermo's.
If thats all done, and the thermo's work by putting an active supply to the (86) terminal then i'd hate to say it but it sounds like the actual thermostat could be busted.

Give it a try and let me know how you go. I'm over in Sunbury if you really get desperate and need someone to look at it.

sphell · 29-01-2007, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Shore

Hmm...EL XR8...pretty sure I've tried that setup before but with no results. I've got power into the relay (30), temp switch into relay (86), negative of switch into relay (85), power of fans into relay (87 and 87a). Nothing. I then changed the negative of the switch to just any ground source...fans into relay. Nothing. I've tried numerous things...even bought another relay to make sure...but I can't make sense of it...worst. I've left the car to run for quite a few minutes (even after I've just got home from work) so it should be round the temperature where the fans come on...I dunno :(

used:

From what you've described there it sounds like your trying to switch a relay using two earths! That's never gonna happen. To switch a relay you need an earth on Pin 85 and 12V+ on Pin 86 (or vice versa). Your temp switch in the radiator will give an earth signal (providing the radiator is earthed) when it reaches the pre-determined temperature so you need to supply 12V+ on the other side of the relay coil, which means running power to your switch instead of an earth.

Wire it like this - Use one relay per fan.

Pin 85 - Temp sender in radiator
Pin 86 - 12V+ Wired inline with a dash mounted switch so you can over-ride the fans if necessary.
Pin 30 - 12V+ (FUSED WITH 30A FUSE)
Pin 87 - Positive of thermo fan
Pin 87a - Nothing (put a terminal over the pin to insulate it)

Maximus · 29-01-2007, 10:55 PM

I'd just like to say, one of the great things about these forums is that the people on here are all willing to help as much as they can. Well done.

Alan Shore · 29-01-2007, 10:57 PM

tryin it now...i'll let ya know soon

Alan Shore · 29-01-2007, 11:36 PM

thanks for the info guys...but it hasnt seemed to work. I tried that move EL XR8 and that worked...which suggest that my sensor is gone?! But how could that be?! It's like 2 weeks old man...they go just like that? How crap is that? Still would prefer someone else look at it...otherwise I'm gonna end up breaking something...

EL XR8 · 30-01-2007, 09:40 AM

Yeah it might be the unfortunate problem that the sensor is broken.
If its a sensor with a long metal lead type looking thing (capillary), thats looks like it shouldn't really be bent. They can break extremely easily, or malfunction if bent or kinked.
The only other way to now test it, would be to leave it all connected up correctly, with the thermostat plugged into the relay, and go for a drive for a 10 mins around the block. Cause for your car to get to 85 degresxs celcius will take more than a couple of mins. Even just idling.
As you said in your first post, if the coolant temp sensor is from a Honda, it could've been broken from the start.
If thats not too hard to take out of the car, you could try and place it, if it wont damage the sensor, in a cup of boiling water and see if it the contacts open up (if you can actually see it, on this thermostat).
Also, whereabouts have you put the coolant sensor on the car?

Rollin · 31-01-2007, 12:21 AM

Fullisik PSP picture coming:

[IMG]hxxp://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p148/Rollinfourlitre/thermowiring.jpg[/IMG]

The circles are obviously the fans and the yellowy brown thing is the switch.

That should give you a visual idea of what the circuit should look like, provided the switch is normally open and closes when it's hot enough - a lot of switches are normally closed and then open at the correct temp, so you need to run 5 pin relays instead of 4 pin.

Most relays have a visual representation of the pin orientation stamped into the side of them - I always use that because I can never remember the pin assignments.

You will have to add a little extra onto that circuit to have the fans running when the AC is on, but we'll try and get them going first before adding complications.