Just when you thought you'd heard it all...

SEZ213 · 13-07-2010, 11:08 AM

Interesting spin - and scary outcomes if this is anything to go by. It seems that we are setting double standards...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/q...-1225890936050

||| · 13-07-2010, 11:27 AM

as someone on that site explained, they're teaching kids that its ok to speed a small amount so when they get their licence the government can book them for speeding and collect more sweet sweet tax dollars. if they failed kids for speeding on the test they may lose an valuable revenue source.

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 11:39 AM

"It just seems to be quite a confused message ", reads one part of the report.
This whole article seems to be "quite a confused message". Irregardless of ones opinions on the right or wrongs of the speed limits we have, I can't believe that there is any tolerance whatsoever for disregarding them during the very test where one is supposed to be demonstrating that they have a fairly basic understanding of the road rules they will soon have to be obeying.
It's been a long(long long) time since I sat my test, and I know that many things have changed over the years, but it was pretty well taken as read that if you exceeded the speed limit when being tested,(along with stalling on a hill start, failling to indicate amongst other similar transgressions), it was straight back to the testing centre, no questions asked.. fail!!!

"The Queensland driver test also allows examinees to stall six times before failing, steer with one hand on six occasions and fail to indicate six times. Drivers can also fail to start the engine five times and pass." I am lost for words!!

aussie muscle · 13-07-2010, 11:47 AM

by comparison, my nephew in NSW failed his exam for speeding (65 in 60zone) and not indicating at a roundabout. i only wish they'd have the same sort of tolerance for full licenced drivers.

Brazen · 13-07-2010, 11:51 AM

As any driving instructor would tell you: full control of the car, paying attention to the road and surroundings is much more important than exceeding an arbitary number by a small amount. Im glad there is some common-sense out there.

388cube_edxr8 · 13-07-2010, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zdcol71

Drivers can also fail to start the engine five times and pass.

How the hell do you do that?

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 388cube_edxr8

How the hell do you do that?

Exactly, particularly when youv'e already stalled it 6 times!!!

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brazen

As any driving instructor would tell you: full control of the car, paying attention to the road and surroundings is much more important than exceeding an arbitary number by a small amount. Im glad there is some common-sense out there.

I am inclined to agree, somewhat,(although I'm not sure that "exceeding an arbitary number by a small amount" is the same as disregarding the speed limit 5 times in one test!!), but have alook at the rest of the article and tell me, if a learner is allowed such leeway on all these points, how in hell can they be in "full control of the car, paying attention to the road and surroundings "

MAD · 13-07-2010, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zdcol71

I am inclined to agree, somewhat,(although I'm not sure that "exceeding an arbitary number by a small amount" is the same as disregarding the speed limit 5 times in one test!!), but have alook at the rest of the article and tell me, if a learner is allowed such leeway on all these points, how in hell can they be in "full control of the car, paying attention to the road and surroundings "

It all depends on which angle you look at it from.
As an apprentice, or even starting work at a new firm that has a different computer system in place, you would want to be given some leeway for the occasional mistakes as you were learning.

SEZ213 · 13-07-2010, 03:21 PM

Personally, I'm all for 'education' - if you have decent driving instructors, but as per the Qld transport website...

'Your driving supervisor can be anyone who has held an open licence for at least one year (relevant to the class of vehicle driven). Driving supervisors must not exceed the legal blood or breath alcohol concentration level for the vehicle they are instructing you in. '

One year isn't a hell of a long time...and mistakes are sure to be made.

Legislation isn't going to fix this, or make our roads any safer.

Patience for learners is one thing, the indication from some of the metro transport departments advises that less than 50% pass rate for learner drivers tests.

I think nervousness can account for some level of 'stalling' but a failure to start a car is not a standard thing - perhaps they should bring in psych testing prior to obtaining a license? The other question that needs to be asked, is if this is 'common' as would be indicated - are we setting ourselves up for a fall?

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAD

It all depends on which angle you look at it from.
As an apprentice, or even starting work at a new firm that has a different computer system in place, you would want to be given some leeway for the occasional mistakes as you were learning.

Sure, and in both instances, I was, (given some leeway ie.), but when you have completed the training and the time comes to be tested on what you have learned ,then I would suggest that the margin for a "bit of leeway" is a little tighter than the examples that are being suggested.

MAD · 13-07-2010, 03:28 PM

Yeah good point. I didnt think that one through very well.
During you should have leeway, but by the time you complete your apprenticeship (as per example) you should know what you're doing.

Maybe they should focus more on teaching kids how to drive, not how to pass a test.

fangq · 13-07-2010, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zdcol71

I am inclined to agree, somewhat,(although I'm not sure that "exceeding an arbitary number by a small amount" is the same as disregarding the speed limit 5 times in one test!!), but have alook at the rest of the article and tell me, if a learner is allowed such leeway on all these points, how in hell can they be in "full control of the car, paying attention to the road and surroundings "

How can a passenger ( eg tester ) accurately determine the speed of a vehicle when they are looking at a speedometer from an angle ?
Steve

SVD · 13-07-2010, 04:34 PM

If you don't teach them/allow them to speed at a young age what would be the point of all the revenue camera's.... WHOOPS!!! i mean safety camera's....

TheInterceptor · 13-07-2010, 04:37 PM

Thats just incredible! And a joke aswell.

dishpig · 13-07-2010, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sezzy

Personally, I'm all for 'education' - if you have decent driving instructors, but as per the Qld transport website...

'Your driving supervisor can be anyone who has held an open licence for at least one year (relevant to the class of vehicle driven). Driving supervisors must not exceed the legal blood or breath alcohol concentration level for the vehicle they are instructing you in. '

One year isn't a hell of a long time...and mistakes are sure to be made.
?

thats not just one year thats really 4 and I'd like to think that anyone thats been driving for 4 years would have a pretty good understanding of whats right and wrong.

04redxr8 · 13-07-2010, 04:56 PM

I think everyone here has missed the point.

The Queensland government is issuing as many licenses as it can, and encouraging the younger generation to go just that little bit faster. Its like lining up a whole new group of customers for the Revenue Camera campaign. :hrod

Business will be booming.

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 04redxr8

I think everyone here has missed the point.

The Queensland government is issuing as many licenses as it can, and encouraging the younger generation to go just that little bit faster. Its like lining up a whole new group of customers for the Revenue Camera campaign. :hrod

Business will be booming.

Oh boy, here we go.....
Mods, can someone design a smilie that kind of represents a round-about that always leads back to a cash register???
Or one that simply screams "Revenue!!!!" Simply to save so much time and effort at a key pad

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fangq

How can a passenger ( eg tester ) accurately determine the speed of a vehicle when they are looking at a speedometer from an angle ?
Steve

Ummm, lean over and have a look?? And before anyone says that that may upset or panic the testee, then I am sure someone has mentioned already that maybe the testee is not yet ready or confident enough to be sitting a test. Again, it's not all about just getting a licence.

SEZ213 · 13-07-2010, 05:59 PM

When I originally posted this thread, I actually had no thought in mind of revenue raising, more a little scared of what is going to happen when these individuals get their probationary licence or open licence.

My issue isn't with the revenue - it's about the lowering of standards to allow anyone to get a licence, it's dangerous and socially irresponsible on the part of the government.

The money, I couldn't give a toss about, it's the principle that I soon will be sharing the road with someone who has the potential to fail to indicate, stall a vehicle (and then be unable to start it again), and it will all be condoned behaviour, courtesy of a system that doesn't allow for adequate 'education' of young drivers.

04redxr8 · 13-07-2010, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sezzy

When I originally posted this thread, I actually had no thought in mind of revenue raising, more a little scared of what is going to happen when these individuals get their probationary licence or open licence.

My issue isn't with the revenue - it's about the lowering of standards to allow anyone to get a licence, it's dangerous and socially irresponsible on the part of the government.

The money, I couldn't give a toss about, it's the principle that I soon will be sharing the road with someone who has the potential to fail to indicate, stall a vehicle (and then be unable to start it again), and it will all be condoned behaviour, courtesy of a system that doesn't allow for adequate 'education' of young drivers.

Take a drive through Sunnybank Hills. The standard was lowered a long time ago.

SEZ213 · 13-07-2010, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 04redxr8

Take a drive through Sunnybank Hills. The standard was lowered a long time ago.

I know, I try not to drive anywhere near there if I can help it. :(

The point is, it's way too easy to obtain a licence, and keep it - that's the issue.

Qld, Vic, Tas, NSW, WA, SA, NT, ACT; it's the same with slight differences in each state to conform to state legislation.

Our state governments are setting dangerous precedents if they all follow this misguided direction...the softly softly approach when giving someone a licence to drive a 2-tonne vehicle...is NOT the answer.

zdcol71 · 13-07-2010, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sezzy

When I originally posted this thread, I actually had no thought in mind of revenue raising, more a little scared of what is going to happen when these individuals get their probationary licence or open licence.

My issue isn't with the revenue - it's about the lowering of standards to allow anyone to get a licence, it's dangerous and socially irresponsible on the part of the government.

The money, I couldn't give a toss about, it's the principle that I soon will be sharing the road with someone who has the potential to fail to indicate, stall a vehicle (and then be unable to start it again), and it will all be condoned behaviour, courtesy of a system that doesn't allow for adequate 'education' of young drivers.

Don't worry mate, the issue isn't about revenue. Just be aware that to a lot of people the issue is often only about revenue.
I am with you in that we will be sharing the road with lots of people who have the potential to fail to indicate, stall a vehicle (and then be unable to start it again,etc...) we are already there; unfortunately, anything that may, or may not have the ability to change that, is often cast aside too easily as "Revenue Raising".

Franco Cozzo · 13-07-2010, 06:49 PM

There is too much varience between the license test and the tester, its basically all down to the tester and how they feel, if they like you etc, here in Victoria. There is no real set guidelines apart from "Do a low speed maneuver" and "Drive around town for 50 minutes". Also theres about 5 different routes for the test, they range from stupidly easy to the hardest one, which I copped haha.

meteoriTE · 13-07-2010, 07:07 PM

Sounds like they're looking for future cab drivers aswell as more revenue