Two Friends Killed After Sitting In Modded Ford Fiesta ST

[uniacidz]

Yeh i dunno

Wouldnt they open a window or stand away from the car if was stinking?
Or open windows?

Surely been able to smell the carbon monoxide



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Two Friends Killed After Sitting In Modded Ford Fiesta ST
Link
http://shiftinglanes.com/2017/03/two...ord-fiesta-st/




Back in December, tragedy struck as two friends sat and chatted (assuming) along a road in the UK and succumbed to carbon monoxide poisoning. The way it happened, however, was not known until today and it is a reminder to us all to be careful even when not on the road.

Tom Putt and Nikki Willis were 20 and 23 years old respectively. Tom drove a Ford Fiesta ST that he had modified himself. Tom was an engineering apprentice with Ford so he wasn’t inexperienced in the modding world. Strangely though, it was a modification that unfortunately and tragically killed the two youths.



According to reports, Putt and Willis were found at 10:30 in the morning after being noticed at 4:30 that same morning with the car running. As with many enthusiasts Putt has modified his ST for more power. The mods that were performed were a catalytic converter delete (or removal) as well as vents cut into the front hood of the car near the windshield. You can see the one vent in the picture above.

Apparently the modification was not done properly and there was a small gap between where the exhaust met the engine allowing deadly amounts of exhaust fumes and carbon monoxide out. While sitting in the car, the two apparently passed out from the fumes and met their sad end. It was only known after the fact and a full investigation that the amount of carbon monoxide gas present in the car’s cabin was found to be 1000 times the normal amount.

Forgive the cheesiness of the video below, but it’s an excellent representation of how fast carbon dioxide builds up and then dissipates when in open air.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t38AhLMQk7I

Sadly, Putt and Willis did not make it, but this is a reminder to all that when you modify your car to check it 5 times over to make sure there are no leaks of any kind. Hopefully this won’t become a scary trend.

[GO FURTHER]

Originally Posted by uniacidz

Yeh i dunno

Wouldnt they open a window or stand away from the car if was stinking?
Or open windows?

Surely been able to smell the carbon monoxide

Carbon monoxide (CO) is a odourless.

[DJR-351]

Originally Posted by BAXRSIX

Carbon monoxide (CO) is a odourless.

Exactly, hence the name “silent killer”

Carbon monoxide (CO) is a gas that can kill you quickly. It is called the “silent killer” because it is colourless, odourless, tasteless and non- irritating.

[DJM83]

Lol decat and bonnet vents caused their deaths, hardly.

[dunga]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Lol decat and bonnet vents caused their deaths, hardly.

What you have to realise is the human body will absorb carbon monoxide 20 times more readily than oxygen it takes a very small amount of co to kill you. If the exhaust gas enters the vehicle through the air plenum then through the internal vents its quite plausible it is the cause .

[.:4:.]

It sounds awfully similar to the old hose taped into the tail pipe of the Mitsubishi sigma wagon that leads into the boot.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by dunga

What you have to realise is the human body will absorb carbon monoxide 20 times more readily than oxygen it takes a very small amount of co to kill you. If the exhaust gas enters the vehicle through the air plenum then through the internal vents its quite plausible it is the cause .

Yes i understand that but, there a thousands of cars in the UK running around with decats (quite popular within the Fiesta ST/Focus ST/RS scene.

While yes once fitted emissions are higher, but from the exhaust not the catalytic converter itself, couple that with the other 'issue' of RS bonnet vent fitment of which is another popular mod there should be hundreds more dead. IMO this is either a dodgy installation of said decat or something more sinister. the HVAC system draws air in the cars from the cowling so the vents may have helped somewhat.

Also air would never enter the car via the intake plenum.

[Falcon SXR8]

Very very sad for these two but how could they not smell exhaust fumes ?? I realize co on its own is odorless but there is a lot more to exhaust fumes that stink.

[The Yeti]

It says a small gap between the exhaust and the engine, poorly written true, it it's saying there was an exhaust leak

Sounds like a plausible explanation to me

[The Yeti]

Originally Posted by Falcon SXR8

Very very sad for these two but how could they not smell exhaust fumes ?? I realize co on its own is odorless but there is a lot more to exhaust fumes that stink.

You would think, and but the chances are they did smell it but it probably didn't smell that bad so they ignored it

[dunga]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Yes i understand that but, there a thousands of cars in the UK running around with decats (quite popular within the Fiesta ST/Focus ST/RS scene.

While yes once fitted emissions are higher, but from the exhaust not the catalytic converter itself, couple that with the other 'issue' of RS bonnet vent fitment of which is another popular mod there should be hundreds more dead. IMO this is either a dodgy installation of said decat or something more sinister. the HVAC system draws air in the cars from the cowling so the vents may have helped somewhat.

Also air would never enter the car via the intake plenum.

The cabin intake plenum is the vents behind the bonnet below the windscreen where do you think the outside air enters the cabin. Read the post there was a leak in the exhaust manifold (gap) therefore raw exhaust gases entered the cabin.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by dunga

The cabin intake plenum is the vents behind the bonnet below the windscreen where do you think the outside air enters the cabin. Read the post there was a leak in the exhaust manifold (gap) therefore raw exhaust gases entered the cabin.

As i posted where the HVAC draws air from my bad confused with intake plenum. Still IMO its nothing to do with the decat and RS vents, more poorly fitted modifications ie decat. That said the article is very poorly writtwe aswell which doesnt help ie exhaust gap.

But im certain plenty of people with de cats and bonnets vents have done the same and survived!

[dunga]

Originally Posted by DJM83

As i posted where the HVAC draws air from my bad confused with intake plenum. Still IMO its nothing to do with the decat and RS vents, more poorly fitted modifications ie decat. That said the article is very poorly writtwe aswell which doesnt help ie exhaust gap.

But im certain plenty of people with de cats and bonnets vents have done the same and survived!

Defiantly plenty of people have successfully modified their cars (obviously some more successful than others) got to remember most journalists are mechtards and wouldn't have a clue about automotive mechanical terms .

[malazn mafia]

Have driven my car for years with a definite exhaust leak, can smell unburnt gases in the cabin if car is on boost or under heavy load. Haven't passed out or passed away from the fumes yet? Are some more tolerant to CO than others ?

[cat007]

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

Have driven my car for years with a definite exhaust leak, can smell unburnt gases in the cabin if car is on boost or under heavy load. Haven't passed out or passed away from the fumes yet? Are some more tolerant to CO than others ?

Remind me never to go in your car! Eeeek


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[XR Martin]

Does the Fiesta ST have one of those sound tubes that route exhaust noise into the cabin?
Maybe that caused it when combined with the exhaust leak?

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by XR Martin

Does the Fiesta ST have one of those sound tubes that route exhaust noise into the cabin?
Maybe that caused it when combined with the exhaust leak?

Yes it does, but it pipes noise from the inlet manifold.

[snowcone]

Apparently the modification was not done properly and there was a small gap between where the exhaust met the engine allowing deadly amounts of exhaust fumes and carbon monoxide out.

This might as well be written in Klingon.
"Where the exhaust met the engine"? Manifold? Headers? Engine pipe?
Still none of this is close to the actual cat which is further back.
If the exhaust was leaking at the previous position of the cat I would think the bonnet vents would have nothing to do with it at all and that the exhaust would have to be entering the cabin from the underfloor area. In theory it would not seem possible for exhaust gases to move toward the front of the vehicle and re-enter the engine bay against the positive cooling fan pressure that is forcing the gases towards the back of the vehicle and then pop themselves up out of the bonnet and then somehow make another directional turn and entire the fresh air plenum.
A bit like the bullet that changed direction several times and supposedly killed President Kennedy

[Mercury Bullet]

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

Have driven my car for years with a definite exhaust leak, can smell unburnt gases in the cabin if car is on boost or under heavy load. Haven't passed out or passed away from the fumes yet? Are some more tolerant to CO than others ?

If you have to drive that car do so with the window(s) down and please don't take any kids until it's fixed.

Carbon monoxide is deadly and you will get NO warning.

And no people don't have different tolerances, you have been very lucky...so far.
I for one don't want to have to write a condolence message on this forum.

[cat007]

Originally Posted by snowcone

A bit like the bullet that changed direction several times and supposedly killed President Kennedy

Kennedy and Tupac are hanging out in long beach together.

[Olbucko]

Originally Posted by snowcone

If the exhaust was leaking at the previous position of the cat I would think the bonnet vents would have nothing to do with it at all and that the exhaust would have to be entering the cabin from the underfloor area. In theory it would not seem possible for exhaust gases to move toward the front of the vehicle and re-enter the engine bay against the positive cooling fan pressure that is forcing the gases towards the back of the vehicle and then pop themselves up out of the bonnet and then somehow make another directional turn and entire the fresh air plenum.

If it had been a cold day the radiator cooling fan would have been off most of the time but the heater fan would most likely have been turned on, sucking in some of the warm gasses back into the heater plenum that leaked from the exhaust system that would have escaped through the vents in the bonnet.

[Crazy Dazz]

I'm not sure about this particular model, but normally on these cars the CAT is next to the engine, NOT under the floor. So easily conceivable that exhaust gases escaped through the bonnet vents and were then sucked into the a/c.

The problem with CO is the way it kills. It's not a "toxin" in the regular sense, but its "toxicity" comes from the way it interacts with your haemoglobin. Oxygen attaches & detaches readily. As the blood flows through the body cells take the oxygen and release CO2. When it reaches the lungs, they easily scrub the CO2 from the haemoglobin, allowing it to be replaced with Oxygen. Unfortunately CO will readily attach to the haemoglobin, but doesn't detach. And so the effect is cumulative.
A person can be almost dead from (CO2) asphyxiation, give them fresh air (or better yet Oxygen) and the CO2 can be completely flushed form their body in minutes. Not so with CO. I recall a case where a suicidee was pulled from their car still alive and semi-concious, and died despite being given Oxygen because the body could not flush the CO. At least not fast enough to overcome the damage being done.

To explain it another way, asphyxiation from CO2 is dependent on the level of CO2 in the air being breathed. I'm sure we have all been in plenty of high CO2 rooms (crowded, poorly ventilated) and at most you get tired and maybe a headache, and as soon as you get outside you perk back up. But with CO you need only a small level present, and it is the length of exposure that builds up the level in your blood.

Plus as others have said, it is odourless and not irritant, There are nastier gases out there, but they mostly stink and will irritate your lungs causing coughing. You would literally NEVER notice CO.

[Bonn]

Did they find a Mr Juicy bottle with a small piece of garden hose sticking out of it?

[jpblue1000]

Why so much effort questioning the coroners report?
Investigation found they died of carbon monoxide poisoning they were found dead in the car idling. They found an exhaust leak. They died...
JP

[uniacidz]

Since it was tuned and such, do the Fiesta's burn gasses cleanly?
And hence not smell much of the exhaust gas

Cos i would have thought smelling exhaust gas is pretty prominent and i wouldn't stick my head up my exhaust to sniff it as would get a lot of fumes and stench

[Bonn]

Hence my question above ; were they coning?

[NGN 351]

Boyles law and the partial pressure of oxygen...

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

I'm not sure about this particular model, but normally on these cars the CAT is next to the engine, NOT under the floor. So easily conceivable that exhaust gases escaped through the bonnet vents and were then sucked into the a/c.

The problem with CO is the way it kills. It's not a "toxin" in the regular sense, but its "toxicity" comes from the way it interacts with your haemoglobin. Oxygen attaches & detaches readily. As the blood flows through the body cells take the oxygen and release CO2. When it reaches the lungs, they easily scrub the CO2 from the haemoglobin, allowing it to be replaced with Oxygen. Unfortunately CO will readily attach to the haemoglobin, but doesn't detach. And so the effect is cumulative.
A person can be almost dead from (CO2) asphyxiation, give them fresh air (or better yet Oxygen) and the CO2 can be completely flushed form their body in minutes. Not so with CO. I recall a case where a suicidee was pulled from their car still alive and semi-concious, and died despite being given Oxygen because the body could not flush the CO. At least not fast enough to overcome the damage being done.

To explain it another way, asphyxiation from CO2 is dependent on the level of CO2 in the air being breathed. I'm sure we have all been in plenty of high CO2 rooms (crowded, poorly ventilated) and at most you get tired and maybe a headache, and as soon as you get outside you perk back up. But with CO you need only a small level present, and it is the length of exposure that builds up the level in your blood.

Plus as others have said, it is odourless and not irritant, There are nastier gases out there, but they mostly stink and will irritate your lungs causing coughing. You would literally NEVER notice CO.

[mik]

Air currents are unpredictable things, many years ago i was driving skip trucks , someone had turfed a bean bag and it was ruptured , i had my window down and air currents where sucking the little white beans into my ACCO drivers window from the 10 m bin behind me at speed , so the exhaust gases could have come in from anywhere.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

Have driven my car for years with a definite exhaust leak, can smell unburnt gases in the cabin if car is on boost or under heavy load. Haven't passed out or passed away from the fumes yet? Are some more tolerant to CO than others ?

And you haven't fixed it...why...?

You're not "more tolerant"...you're just very very very lucky. And remember that other, smaller people in your car (if you have kids or carry kids) will be even less "tolerant" to it because of body size.
Recall the horrifying news stories from many years back of people who thought thier kids were just asleep in the back of their people mover (when people movers like the Tarago, etc, were popular) and got to the end of their road trip to find their kids either dead or needing hospitalization with brain damage from exhaust sneaking in through bad rear hatch seals...

Fix your exhaust...please...there's just zero excuse...

Originally Posted by XR Martin

Does the Fiesta ST have one of those sound tubes that route exhaust noise into the cabin?
Maybe that caused it when combined with the exhaust leak?

I remember the first time I saw a tech article on a car fitted with those "sound tubes"...I think a Ferrari...and my immediate thought was "What sort of stupid idea is that?? Can't you see the possibility of exhaust fumes entering when things start to wear a bit??"

[scoupedy]

Stupid deaths Darwin award nominee don't mod your exhaust if you can't get it to seal properly.