EPA (NSW) Defect Notice -Excess Exhaust Noise

[muzzzza]

Hi Guys

Found a surprise in the mailbox last week.

Would you belieive it, a defect notice for exhaust noise. No fine yet.

First, no explanation of who, how, where it was measured.

Second, exhaust system is total stock. 2003 Turbo

After ringing I found out...
Detected by an EPA officer near where I work.

How? not with sophisticated equipment...
He could hear it from inside his car when the radio was on low.
Very technical, hey!
Mind you they said he is a very senior officer & knows a lot about cars. What a load of BS.

Rang Ford, they cant even tell me what the noise level should be based on their testing just say it complies with ADR.

Now I'm expected to prove my innocence by having the car tested at the EPA Yagoona. I thought it was innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

If it is proven excessive, Ford have a lot of cars out there to be worried about.

Has anyone there had any experiences like this with the NSW EPA? Your feedback would be appreciated.

Cheers,

[AC]

Geez...

If that happened to you with a stock exhaust, then i better becareful :

I dont exactly have a stocky system on the XC :

[Stav]

Has bureacracy gone mad.Ask them to reimburse you for your time and petrol.If they have the right to do this well you exercise your legal rights.

[stretch]

They have got to be joking dont they? That would be the biggest load of sh#t I have ever heard of before.

How could some joker be sitting in his car and say that? I would be straight down there and proving them wrong,(if my exhaust was standard) and I would be asking them to make sure the joker him self was there.

But saying that I have not got a quiet car myself and I would more than likely go over :

But I hope you get it sorted out and prove them wrong.

[geckoGT]

At least if it doesn't pass it is fords problem! Experienced officer! Bah! not if he thinks a stock exhaust is too loud. If it goes under I would lodge a complaint because the guy is fishing!

[AC]

Hey if he's wrong... I'd be asking for his job to be terminated.

Then throw on the legal belt and take them for wasting your time ;)

[BOSS 540]

Originally Posted by 2ndOwner

Hey if he's wrong... I'd be asking for his job to be terminated.

Then throw on the legal belt and take them for wasting your time ;)

For sure, if you are in the right / legal, go straight to his superior and lodge a complaint & get some legal advice.
Good luck.

[AUIII XR8 MAN]

Sorry to hear that this has happen. All i can say is that the guy is a ****er trying to throw his weight around trying to make himself feel like a big man. If your stock exhaust is found to be over the limit than I would be asking for every other XR6T rego in the state to be tested then they can have a little chat with Ford for selling cars with stock exhaust that are to loud for the EPA limit. If it's under the limit than i would making a big fuss about been called in.

[TE50pilot]

Mate before you go down to the EPA I would take it to an exhaust place and get them to do a noise check just for your peace of mind. The meter should be placed level to the exhaust at about I think 1 metre away but offset to the side. A gooe exhaust place should know the requirements for testing and should know your allowed noise level. They will want to rev the car out to 2/3 the rev range e.g 6000rpm redline rev to 4000rpm. Do not allow them to blip the accelerator it should be taken up to the revs smoothly and released smoothly. Then if and when you pass the noise level test at the EPA get the aholes name and complain.
I got done about 10 years ago before on the spot fines and such and got a fine of about $1200 after having to go to court. Tip: If you go to court don't call the EPA guy a cowboy in court and don't say to the magistrate " I can't help it if your new Commadore sounds like a vacumn cleaner" they don't like it for some reason they get real serious in court.

[XR8Chic]

Why does this not suprise me??

Are you sure you didnt cut the guy off in traffic?? or maybe you beat him in a traffic light drag? One of my mates works for the RTA and whenever he gets REALLY ****ed off on the road he makes arrangements for them to get dragged over the pits. (The guy he told me about was a P Plater doing burnouts, and kicking up rocks on his car)

Oh - and dont expect any compensation for time and expenses.
RTA made a stuff up on the rego for my old ute (listed it as a 96 model instead of a 97). Even though I had the previous rego papers with the correct year on it, I still had to get a blue slip.

[AC]

He might just be a Ford hater, looking to get some back for the Red Army.

Or as XR8Chic said...
You might have rubbed him the wrong way and he's making things up.

Even in that event and they are proven wrong you could legally take it futher for abuse of power.

Or then again he might just be a power tripper. :rolleyes:

I got hit with a fair bit of power tripping when i had the RX7.
My collection of White RBT Sticks is evidence of that...
Now that i got a "Real Car" i dont get them anymore :yeees:

[jmc-007]

Police state here it comes.

:the_finge


Fight these cowboys. Cmon if it is stock like you say then what is the problem.

Was there anyother cars around.

Whayt annoys me is they dont harrase these POS old VH/VK commodores with home made systems or those rise boxes.

Everytime you do something with the car. (to do with the fine) write down the total Kms and Time and hand and put down how much it cost you.

then ask the EPA for your time back in money.

[Quadcams]

You got to be joking, my last car was a AUXR8III ute I recieved a letter from the EPA but I had a full system hurricane hedders 2 1/2" duals one set of mufflers at front and yes it wasn't quiet 98db on backoff(sounded awsome though) put resonator on back and came in at 94db on backoff failed again, changed front mufflers to baffled ones and it came in at 91db he eventually let me off. Mate when it was at 91db I can tell you that it was alot louder than a stock system on a XR6T. Maybe the inspector had the volume on his hearing aids turned up to loud lol.

[4.9 EF Futura]

Take it to the EPA for its test. If it fails then I think your Ford dealer has some explaining to do - and some costs to reimburse you for.

Maybe take it to them before hand. If they are satisfied the exhaust system is stock then they should be able to put their hand on their heart and tell you it's ADR compliant.

Sounds like someone had a day at the office...

[FPV GT]

Yep XR8Chic got it right......

Dont expect reimbursement or the like. The RTA is an authourity to themselves.
My car is on the system as gold. The delaer made the stuff in the registration, RTA wants a blueslip and a change of details form...equals about $55.


If your exhaust is legal, act normal and do not say anything that may agitate them...... and move on....Its not worht the hassle of them picking on something else........... harrasssment,,,,,,,aint such word with ADR enforcement.

Regards

Paul

[Mechan1k]

Well the EPA and RTA are 2 different things.
I used to work for the RTA at one point ... and used to fly past the EPA station near Lidcombe (in a previous loud small car) ... I eventually got a letter in the mail ... I knew it was coming though ... cos it was may fault.

Well the little Corolla made 110dB on back-off ... oops ... I had a spare stock exhaust system ready to put on ... replaced it with that ... had it tested ... passed.

Was asked by the tester why i was called in ... I said I had no idea ... just had a letter in the mail.

They won't re-imburse you though ... even though i worked for the RTA ... I couldn't even get out of the test. It dodn't bother me though, because they cannot test you for at least 6 months after the test anyway ... i reverted back to my loud exhaust. I got another letter ... I called the EPA and informed them I just had a "Loudness" test and passed (gave them the receipt number) ... they cancelled it and let me go.

Also ... it's not just the authorities that dob you in ... any person from the public can call the EPA and dob you in for any sort of pollution ... as long as they have your numberplate ... they can dob you in.

I would go to your preferred Ford Dealer, have them inspect the car and provide you with a letter advising that all exhaust components on the vehicle are stock and hence, pass the ADR for noise emissions as per the homologation for that vehicle. Ask if they can get the certification number for your model and include it in the letter.

Next I would get a solicitor to write a letter to the EPA, providing the letter as proof of evidence that your vehicle is legal by default. As part of the letter, your solicitor will know how the document must be worded so that a full response is generated from the EPA as to how they wish to proceed.

If they then wish to proceed and won't let it rest, you then need another sent letter to the EPA by your solicitor requiring the name of the inspector who generated the complaint. It is your right to know who you will be fighting in court so that they can be sumonsed.

Take the vehicle to an inspection station seperate to where the inspector works so as to get a totally unbiased report. Once it has passed you then start legal action.

At no time do you ask for specifics and fine detail until it goes to court. Don't throw down your hand before you have to. Once you have this clown before a magistrate your solicitor can then question him as to the day, date and time, the colour of your car, what the car was doing at the time of the alleged offence, what measuring device was utilised in the measurement and how was it calibrated, and to provide proof of the calibration, etc, etc.

Basically, you let them hang themselves and then pull them completely apart in court where facts are facts. Personal judgement, thoughts, and feelings compared to "his radio" means squat when looking at pieces of legislation and because someone "thought" or "felt" like something wasn't right ends up with them being in poo with the legal system.

You can go them for harrassment, loss of income in the time you have had to devote to preparing and fighting the baseless accusation, costs in court, and compensation limited to the expense directly involved with the test, including motor vehicle allowance per km for travel (as per the federal guidelines for motor vehicles).

I once had a mate who was pulled over by a highway patrol cop who said his car was a rolling defect. Knowing his rights, he made them impound his car and formally charge him with the offences at the station. The seargant tried to back pedal on behalf of the HP cop but my mate was too ****ed with them and went through with it. The car HAD to be fully inspected by the RTA and a report tended to the courts (it passed with flying colours). The magistrate had the HP cop suspended from duty for 1 month and ordered a formal apology in writing be provided, as well as all costs reimbursed.

What it comes down to is how much you just want it to go away Vs how much you want to stick a red hot poker up this bozo.

Good luck in what ever you decide. Sorry for the long post...

My $0.02
Oz

[miss_k]

i know someone who has ventured out a few times with you guys. has a pursuit ute. was once s/c but got defected off the road. My other half had to bring the car back to stock. to the point where everything was as it was when it left the factory.

it still failed. eventually, it came down to ford having to do some investigating and they did admit liability. the cam in the car was the reason why the defects weren't clearable. ford replaced the cam ith an ltd cam and the car passed first go.

we were informed if the car had not had any modifications made to it at all, that there would have been no cost to rectify the problem, but because ford knew it had been previously supercharged even though it went back into the servic centre factory, the cam and the labour had to be paid for.

pretty sucky really.

[2kool4u]

tell them where they can stick their fine man, they can't give you a defect notice without properly testing your car,..........can they?

[Tickford]

Update?

[AUIII XR8 MAN]

Yes the car was just over the limit but becuase it was stock they let it go.

[Orbit]

what limit was it over?
emmisions?
sound?
if sound what was the limit as stated and how much was it over?