Car Detailing - What products are your go to?

[DFB FGXR6]

For this post, I'm covering two alkaline-leaning soaps within the Koch Chemie lineup. One is simply stunning, one is somewhat underwhelming.

Koch Chemie Auto Shampoo AS

I tried Auto Shampoo a few years ago when the brilliant GSF had been out of stock for several months. My thinking was, if GSF was so good, then AS would surely follow suit. Wrong.

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...ehicle-shampoo

Auto Shampoo is a mild alkaline soap with a pH of 9.0, which sits in the middle of the neutral GSF and the pH 12.0 Super Foam. This higher pH means it will clean better than GSF, but without the stripping ability of something like Super Foam. Despite claims otherwise, this is not a high foaming soap, no matter the dilution.

In use, while slick and offering good cleaning ability, Auto Shampoo is not a WOW product. The subdued lemon scent is pretty forgettable, slickness is fine, suds are fine, overall...................it's just fine. I get the feeling that the original intent for this soap was for use in commercial car washes applied via the spray gun. The higher pH and cleaning ability, and the low foaming ability support this belief.



How To Use -

Auto Shampoo can be foamed or used in a bucket, but its far better used for bucket washing.

1. Fill you bucket with water, then add 100ml of AS, then agitate with a blast from your hose to foam it up.

2. Wash the vehicle as usual, working top to bottom and rinsing out your wash media in the bucket between sections.

3. Rinse thoroughly.



Usage Tips -

- Koch Chemie Suggest a 150:1 dilution for bucket washing.

- If you are going to foam Auto Shampoo, skip straight to the 5:1 ratio, which would be about 160ml of soap to 840ml of water.

- Auto Shampoo will produce a very thin film when foamed.

- I've found it a great soap for your wheel bucket, the higher alkalinity certainly helps.

- Avoid using in direct sunlight, or on hot surfaces. Avoid letting it dry on the surface.



Koch Chemie Active Foam AF

Like Auto Shampoo, Active Foam at pH 9.5 is a nice middle ground in terms of pH and cleaning ability. Unlike Auto Foam, this soap actually foams, it would want to considering the name.

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...active-foam-af

Active Foam can be used as a pre-wash snow foam or used for contact washing. It's strong enough to deal with road grime and bugs, but without being a sledgehammer. However, unlike Auto Shampoo, it can put a dent in your wax or sealant. On a coating, it will act as a deep cleanser and rejuvenator.

Active Foam is one of those products that instantly proved to be a winner. Foam quality is excellent, as is its cleaning ability on wheels and as a pre-soak prior to contact washing. And the scent, ooohhhh the scent. A quick whiff of the bottle reveals a somewhat strange, but pleasant aroma. But once you start foaming it, the sandalwood scent spices the air and lingers for hours after use. It's so addictive! And the scent makes Active Foam somewhat unique, most decon/high pH soaps are unscented. I know fragrance doesn't have any practical benefit, but it certainly adds to the overall user experience and makes you enjoy the task more.



How To Use -

I've been using Active Foam as a mid-strength wheel cleaner and as a pre-wash snow foam. The following is for use as a pre-wash...............

1. For foam cannons, add 100ml of Active Foam to 900ml of water.

2. Foam the vehicle, allow to soak for as long as possible to break down dirt, grime and bugs.

3. Rinse thoroughly.

4a. Re-foam with a pH neutral soap for the contact wash. Or.............

4b. Re-foam with Active Foam for a deeper clean/decon wash.

5. Rinse, then dry.



Usage Notes -

- Koch Chemie recommend a 300:1 ratio for bucket washing, which would be 50ml to 15-litres of water.

- For foam cannons, KCx suggest a dilution ratio between 20:1 down to 7:1. I've found it very capable at 10:1.

- Don't allow this product to dry on the surface and preferably avoid direct sunlight.

- I've been mixing Active Foam to make a 500ml solution (50ml to 450ml of water). This is enough soap to clean four wheels/tyres/wheel arches, then enough to foam a dual-cab Ranger. This way you aren't left with soap sitting in your foam cannon and losing its foaming ability.

- If you want to mix up a full foam cannon, consider using demineralized water to ensure stability while stored.



Final Thoughts -

As mentioned at the beginning, one of these soaps is a winner, and one is a midfield contender.

Auto Shampoo does nothing wrong, other than not foaming well, but it doesn't excel at anything either. Active Foam on the other hand is a winner across the board. It's a product that nails the job title while providing an exceptional user experience. Highly recommended!

[DFB FGXR6]

Koch Chemie Insect & Dirt Remover

Koch Chemie Insect & Dirt Remover is a ready-to-use product for the safe and effective removal of bugs and baked on road film. Designed to penetrate and break down contamination, it can used on all exterior surfaces. With a pH of about 10.5, it's certainly got some kick to it, but not as harsh as some degreasers and all-purpose cleaners. Koch Chemie also suggest it can be used to remove oil and grease build up on engine bays.

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...y-to-use-spray

I'm gonna be honest here, of all the bug removers I've tried, they're all mostly the same. This refers to both the chemical aroma and how they function. I know this doesn't apply to the chemical itself, but I've found the bottle and sprayer KCx supply with this product to be vastly superior to most on the market, which in effect makes it easier to use. I don't use a lot of bug remover, so I haven't put one in a fancy spray bottle, meaning I use what is supplied.



How To Use -

Like any product being used to deal with a tough job, let the chemical do the work.................that's why you are using it.

1. Spray affected areas generously.

2. Allow product to soak for as long as possible without drying on the surface.

3. Rinse thoroughly, a pressure washer is your friend here.

In most cases, if you have healthy protection on the vehicle, most bugs will be removed using the above. However, if some have remained, you may want to reapply and agitate with a towel or bug sponge.



Usage Notes -

- I tend to use these products as a pre-soak, allowing them to dwell for a short period before foaming over the top with a pre-wash soap. These two combined usually remove all bug remnants, making the following contact wash safer and easier.

- Avoid using in strong sunlight or on hot surfaces.

- Being an alkaline product, it can degrade waxes and sealants. You would ideally follow with an appropriate drying aid to top up the protection removed.

- These products are generally designed to work safely within the pH tolerances of a ceramic coating.



Final Thoughts -

As I said earlier, bug removers are a much of a muchness.................to an extent. Any of the offerings from the likes of Carpro, Gyeon, Gtechniq and Koch Chemie are going to be well worth having on hand, especially in summer. I've found these pro-grade products far more effective than the rubbish sold at Supercheap, which I found no better than soapy water.

[DFB FGXR6]

Koch Chemie All-round Quick Shine, Quick & Shine, Quick Finish and Finish Spray Exterior

Koch Chemie offers four different quick detailers in their current lineup, of which it’s hard to know what the difference between them is. From the product descriptions, they all sound identical, but digging deeper reveals where each one sits.

All-round Quick Shine, Quick & Shine QS –

These two are the same product, verified by the MSDS. All-round Quick Shine is from the blue bottle consumer range, while QS is from the white bottle professional range. You would expect the larger 1-litre pro bottle to cost more, but it's actually $5 cheaper. Go figure.

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...quick-detailer
https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...quick-detailer

This is another product I had overlooked, mainly because I was already stocked with quick detailers and happy with my selection, Meguiar’s Last Touch and P&S Paint Gloss. All-round Quick Shine was a product I won in a monthly giveaway and ended up pleasantly surprised by it. Most quick detailers are idiot proof to use, All-round Quick Shine is no different, just spray on and wipe off, job done. The great thing about this type of product is how they boost gloss and slickness without overdosing the paint with protection. It took me a while, but I’ve become quite fond of its scent, one used across many KCx products.



Quick Finish –

This is the silicone-oil free version of All-round Quick Shine and QS. I’m guessing this would be aimed at the body shop industry, a competitor to Meguiar’s Final Inspection of P&S Paint Gloss C51. Like the two above, Quick Finish will leave behind some very mild protection, most likely removed at the next wash.

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...e-finish-spray

I found Quick Finish to just as easy to use, but it doesn't quite reach the same slickness and gloss as QS.



Finish Spray Exterior FSE –

This version is somewhat unique in that it’s a combination quick detailer and mineral remover. I really have no use for this so have never bothered to order it. From what I can tell, you’d use this as a drying aid to neutralize high TDS water after washing.

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...erspot-remover



How To Use –

All three of these are used like any quick detailer, so I’ll let the following cover each product.

1. Wash the vehicle as usual.

2. You can apply prior to towel drying, or after using a blower to remove the bulk of the water. Three to four sprays per panel.

3. Wipe with the panel with a drying towel, flip or use a second towel and wipe till streak free.



Usage Notes –

- You will need to order a sprayer for each of these, except the blue bottle All-round Quick Shine.

- All four can be used on ceramic coatings.

- With the exception of FSE, you can use these as interior detailers as well. In this regard, they are excellent on glossy trims.

- Avoid using on hot surfaces, especially FSE.



Final Thoughts -

Unless you are dealing with hard water, I'd probably rule out FSE from this quartet. I'd also rule out the silicone-oil free Quick Finish as doesn't reach the same gloss and slickness levels of the All-round Quick & Shine and Quick Shine. Choosing between those two, the 1-litre bottle of Quick Shine makes the most sense.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And that finishes the review of the Koch Chemie product line I have sampled so far. I haven't used any of the pad and polishing compound range, of which some are highly regarded. Despite Waxit (and others) offering a healthy selection of the KCx lineup, they are only the tip of the iceberg. The KCx range is massive, with a lot of similar products that can do similar things, I'm sure there is some Germanic logic behind it all. They have also recently introduced a marine and RV line.

In the near future, I'm looking forward to use RRW rinse-less wash, and will get a chance to use Reactivation Shampoo when I get around to coating the Wildtrak in the Autumn. I also want to try the relatively new Alkali Wheel Cleaner.

[DFB FGXR6]

WANT!!

[prydey]

For anyone else like me who wasn't sure on the correct way to pronounce koch chemie....

Here's a short clip to explain
https://youtu.be/mgc2VH48pqU?si=ckDvEUX2mYpc0FOF

[Trendseeker]

Originally Posted by prydey

For anyone else like me who wasn't sure on the correct way to pronounce koch chemie....

Here's a short clip to explain
https://youtu.be/mgc2VH48pqU?si=ckDvEUX2mYpc0FOF

Thanks, I didn’t know the correct way to pronounce it, but I’ll probably fall back to saying “cock chemee”, just like I incorrectly call that excellent German car a “porsh”.

[bangm001]

Why are the small Shinemate polishers so pricey!!

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by bangm001

Why are the small Shinemate polishers so pricey!!

Because you are paying for two batteries and a charger as well. If you think that EB212 is expensive..........................

ShineMate EB212 Skin - $299.95
ShineMate EB212 Kit - $549.98


Rupes HLR-75 Kit (inc 2 batteries/charger) - $879.90
Rupes HLR-75 Delux Kit - $1,209.00

Mirka AROP-B Skin - $1037.00
Mirka AROP-B Kit - $1690.00

Now, unquestionably the best machine of those is the Mirka................it would bloody well want to be for that price. But having used the HLR-75, I'm glad I didn't buy one as its rough as guts, super grindy. From what I have seen, this new ShineMate approaches the butter smoothness of the Mirka, but at a fraction of the price. Seems like a bargain to me.

For those that haven't seen the Mirka, its suuuuuper smooth. From what I can gather, its so pricy because they have made it direct drive and use software to control the movement.

This video shows the difference in smoothness between the Rupes and the Mirka. If the ShineMate can get close to that smoothness, well................

[bangm001]

Do Shine-mate have powered (plug in) smaller polishers?

Found this one:

https://www.waxit.com.au/products/sh..._fid=004d4211b

and this one which is slightly smaller and maybe better for my needs:
https://www.waxit.com.au/products/sh..._fid=004d4211b

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by bangm001

Do Shine-mate have powered (plug in) smaller polishers?

Found this one:

https://www.waxit.com.au/products/sh..._fid=004d4211b

and this one which is slightly smaller and maybe better for my needs:
https://www.waxit.com.au/products/sh..._fid=004d4211b

This one is a rotary machine, which isn't as user-friendly.
https://www.waxit.com.au/products/sh..._fid=004d4211b

This is one is dual action, and the one I would recommend of the two.
https://www.waxit.com.au/products/sh..._fid=004d4211b

[DFB FGXR6]

Ok guys, this time it's me who has a question to ask.

For those who use a pressure washer and foam cannon when cleaning your car, do you use the 2-bucket method? As in, using one bucket with soap and water, and one with only water. Dunk the mitt into the wash solution, clean a section, then dunk in the rinse bucket, repeat.

[CyberWasp]

No as I think I am getting lazy.
I tend to flip the microfiber mitt, mid panel and use both sides to compensate.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Ok guys, this time it's me who has a question to ask.

For those who use a pressure washer and foam cannon when cleaning your car, do you use the 2-bucket method? As in, using one bucket with soap and water, and one with only water. Dunk the mitt into the wash solution, clean a section, then dunk in the rinse bucket, repeat.

image

If I'm pressed for time and the car isn't very dirty then I skip the wash bucket and just have a rinse bucket. Then I just foam up one side with the cannon, sponge it down, then rinse.

If I have time or if the car hasn't been done for a while then it's the full 3 bucket method plus full foam up and rinse down first.

[DFB FGXR6]

Koch Chemie Rapid Rinse-less Wash RRW

Over the last 12 – 18months, it seems as if a new rinse-less wash hits the market every week! Where once it was a choice between Optimum No Rinse, McKee’s N-914 or Carpro ECH20, just about every brand is going down this path, even Bowden’s have one now. And so, now Koch Chemie have a player in this segment, Rapid Rinse-less Wash RRW.

https://www.waxit.com.au/products/ko...r&_ss=e&_v=1.0

RRW was released in the US early last year but has only just now gone on sale in Australia. From what I can tell, RRW was created with heavy input from The Rag Company. In early testing, it was said to be on aggressive side, which led to KCx dialing back some of its cleaning ability. Still, looking at the specs and after hearing some feedback on the product, I would say RRW is one of the stronger cleaning rinse-less washes on the market.

As seems to be the current trend, RRW is a surfactant-polymer hybrid and contains Si02 to boost gloss and slickness. With a pH of 4.0, RRW has an acid leaning formulation, which would explain its higher cleaning capabilities. But that number raises to about 8.0 when diluted, which is where the claim of preserving existing waxes, sealants and coatings comes from.



How To Use –

The basic concept of rinse-less washing is that you rinse less. I say this because there are multiple ways to perform a rinse-less wash. Some will pre-rinse before starting, some will go straight to the wash, some will compromise and pre-treat the surface with the same dilution ratio mixed in the bucket and then commence the wash. Some will use a singular wash pad/sponge, some will use multiple towels/pads. The end result is the same, it’s how you got there that differs. Again, I say this because the following “Garry Dean”/Multiple Towel Method is how I rinse-less wash, but its not the be-all-end-all………………………….

1. Mix up your bucket solution. RRW is mixed at the same 256:1 as most other rinse-less washes on the market. I like to mix up 10-litres as it gives me plenty of solution to fill up my sprayer for the pre-soak. To 10-litres of water, add 40ml of RRW and stir with your hand to mix.



2. From this bucket solution, fill up your sprayer, in my case an iK Multi Pro 2 pump action sprayer. You can then add your towels to the bucket, in this case TRC Eagle Edgeless 500's.



3. I like to pre-treat the whole vehicle in one go, although if it’s a hot day, you may want to break the vehicle into sections. I particularly target areas with bugs and horizontal surfaces. The pre-soak starts breaking down and encapsulating the dirt/dust/bugs ect. Even though you don’t have lots of soap and water in play, it’s this encapsulation that makes rinse-less safe.



4. Take a towel out of your bucket and ring out till just dripping. Then fold the towel in half, and in half again. This gives you eight towel sides.



5. Working in sections, wipe in straight lines, swapping/folding to a new side of the towel as you go. This multiple towel method means a used towel never re-enters the bucket, which means your cleaning solution never becomes dirty. As you work around the car, grab a fresh towel as needed.



6. You can then dry the car as you finish a section, or like me, I go around and dry once I’m finished washing the whole car. You can use a drying aid, but quite often these rinse-less products are highly slick, so you don’t always need more lubrication. In my case, I paired RRW with QS, it would have been rude not to.





Usage Notes -

- I pick my mark with rinse-less. I know it can be used on heavily soiled vehicles, but my limit is a dusty vehicle with or without very mild wet road film. Outside of that, I’m using soap.

- Just because this wash method is called rinse-less, that doesn’t mean you can’t pre-rinse the car. Compared to a soap, you are not rinsing off the residue afterwards, rather you go straight to the drying process.

- If you struggle with dilution ratios like me, then the following website makes it easy – https://www.omnicalculator.com/every...dilution-ratio

- Mixing up your solution using warm water can be beneficial, but not crucial. I like using warm water for winter washing, if nothing more than to keep my hands warm.

- Depending on the size of the car, you will use about 1.5 – 2.0-litres of pre-soak solution. That’s why I mix up 10-litres.

- Specific to RRW, Koch Chemie stress not using this product in direct sunlight, presumably because of the acidic pH value. I would also avoid letting it dry on the vehicle.

- Because of its extra cleaning ability, I probably wouldn't use RRW for interior cleaning, clay lubricant or quick detailer duties. If you are buying a rinse-less for versatility, I'd probably favor ONR or N914.

- RRW has quite a nice floral scent, which will perfume your working area before, during and after the wash.



Final Thoughts -

Rinse-less wash products keep getting better and better, of which I think the most pronounced progress has been with the ease of drying. Some of the older products would end up being pushed around by the towel, whereas these newer options are easily absorbed into the towel without streaking or excessive effort.

RRW is certainly from the new school, it's easy to work with, offers excellent cleaning ability and smells great. If cleaning power is a key requirement, RRW is your product. If ultimate gloss, slickness and lubrication are your requirements, I'd probably still favor products like P&S Absolute, Gyeon EcoWash and ADS Hero.

[prydey]

I use rinseless on my caravan, as I've mentioned before. On my last wash a few weeks back, using Ech20, I did lament that the cleaning power wasn't quite good enough to get rid of the little pollen spots etc without some serious elbow grease. Something a little stronger would be good to try.

I also have Ech20 mixed 1:15 in a spray bottle that I use as a drying aid/post wash wipe down. I went over the van with this about a week later and was pretty impressed with how it came up.

It's great that there are so many different methods and versatile products around these days.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Koch Chemie Rapid Rinse-less Wash RRW

Over the last 12 – 18months, it seems as if a new rinse-less wash hits the market every week! Where once it was a choice between Optimum No Rinse, McKee’s N-914 or Carpro ECH20, just about every brand is going down this path, even Bowden’s have one now. And so, now Koch Chemie have a player in this segment, Rapid Rinse-less Wash RRW.

https://www.waxit.com.au/products/ko...r&_ss=e&_v=1.0

RRW was released in the US early last year but has only just now gone on sale in Australia. From what I can tell, RRW was created with heavy input from The Rag Company. In early testing, it was said to be on aggressive side, which led to KCx dialing back some of its cleaning ability. Still, looking at the specs and after hearing some feedback on the product, I would say RRW is one of the stronger cleaning rinse-less washes on the market.

As seems to be the current trend, RRW is a surfactant-polymer hybrid and contains Si02 to boost gloss and slickness. With a pH of 4.0, RRW has an acid leaning formulation, which would explain its higher cleaning capabilities. But that number raises to about 8.0 when diluted, which is where the claim of preserving existing waxes, sealants and coatings comes from.

image

How To Use –

The basic concept of rinse-less washing is that you rinse less. I say this because there are multiple ways to perform a rinse-less wash. Some will pre-rinse before starting, some will go straight to the wash, some will compromise and pre-treat the surface with the same dilution ratio mixed in the bucket and then commence the wash. Some will use a singular wash pad/sponge, some will use multiple towels/pads. The end result is the same, it’s how you got there that differs. Again, I say this because the following “Garry Dean”/Multiple Towel Method is how I rinse-less wash, but its not the be-all-end-all………………………….

1. Mix up your bucket solution. RRW is mixed at the same 256:1 as most other rinse-less washes on the market. I like to mix up 10-litres as it gives me plenty of solution to fill up my sprayer for the pre-soak. To 10-litres of water, add 40ml of RRW and stir with your hand to mix.

image

2. From this bucket solution, fill up your sprayer, in my case an iK Multi Pro 2 pump action sprayer. You can then add your towels to the bucket, in this case TRC Eagle Edgeless 500's.

image

3. I like to pre-treat the whole vehicle in one go, although if it’s a hot day, you may want to break the vehicle into sections. I particularly target areas with bugs and horizontal surfaces. The pre-soak starts breaking down and encapsulating the dirt/dust/bugs ect. Even though you don’t have lots of soap and water in play, it’s this encapsulation that makes rinse-less safe.

image

4. Take a towel out of your bucket and ring out till just dripping. Then fold the towel in half, and in half again. This gives you eight towel sides.

image

5. Working in sections, wipe in straight lines, swapping/folding to a new side of the towel as you go. This multiple towel method means a used towel never re-enters the bucket, which means your cleaning solution never becomes dirty. As you work around the car, grab a fresh towel as needed.

image

6. You can then dry the car as you finish a section, or like me, I go around and dry once I’m finished washing the whole car. You can use a drying aid, but quite often these rinse-less products are highly slick, so you don’t always need more lubrication. In my case, I paired RRW with QS, it would have been rude not to.

image

image

Usage Notes -

- I pick my mark with rinse-less. I know it can be used on heavily soiled vehicles, but my limit is a dusty vehicle with or without very mild wet road film. Outside of that, I’m using soap.

- Just because this wash method is called rinse-less, that doesn’t mean you can’t pre-rinse the car. Compared to a soap, you are not rinsing off the residue afterwards, rather you go straight to the drying process.

- If you struggle with dilution ratios like me, then the following website makes it easy – https://www.omnicalculator.com/every...dilution-ratio

- Mixing up your solution using warm water can be beneficial, but not crucial. I like using warm water for winter washing, if nothing more than to keep my hands warm.

- Depending on the size of the car, you will use about 1.5 – 2.0-litres of pre-soak solution. That’s why I mix up 10-litres.

- Specific to RRW, Koch Chemie stress not using this product in direct sunlight, presumably because of the acidic pH value. I would also avoid letting it dry on the vehicle.

- Because of its extra cleaning ability, I probably wouldn't use RRW for interior cleaning, clay lubricant or quick detailer duties. If you are buying a rinse-less for versatility, I'd probably favor ONR or N914.

- RRW has quite a nice floral scent, which will perfume your working area before, during and after the wash.

image

Final Thoughts -

Rinse-less wash products keep getting better and better, of which I think the most pronounced progress has been with the ease of drying. Some of the older products would end up being pushed around by the towel, whereas these newer options are easily absorbed into the towel without streaking or excessive effort.

RRW is certainly from the new school, it's easy to work with, offers excellent cleaning ability and smells great. If cleaning power is a key requirement, RRW is your product. If ultimate gloss, slickness and lubrication are your requirements, I'd probably still favor products like P&S Absolute, Gyeon EcoWash and ADS Hero.

I had someone question the pH of this product moving from 4.0 to 8.0 under dilution. My initial research came across the following video, hone in on the 4-min mark -

Neat - pH 4.0
256:1 - pH 8.0



I have since measured this myself using 256:1 and neat -

Neat - pH 4.7
256:1 - pH 7.47





One thing I have learned with detailing chemicals and pH readings.................they don't always play out as you would expect. I've had some very strange readings over the years, well outside what you would think.

[DFB FGXR6]

For anyone in the market for a new pressure washer, or want to improve the useability of an existing machine, I posted an updated thread on the topic in the Car Care section earlier today..............

https://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11503237

[The Pad King]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Ok guys, this time it's me who has a question to ask.

For those who use a pressure washer and foam cannon when cleaning your car, do you use the 2-bucket method? As in, using one bucket with soap and water, and one with only water. Dunk the mitt into the wash solution, clean a section, then dunk in the rinse bucket, repeat.

image

Whether you use a foam cannon, detail keg or battery operated or manual pump pack to apply rinseless or shampoo the two bucket method has been obsolete for a decade in pro circles as it's like bathing vs showering - it is self contaminating and despite what anyone says grit separators do not work at all or anywhere near like they should. To clean a mitt or towel high pressure rinsing it or using several instead of one is faster and safer.

A better option is to high pressure rinse your wash mitt or towel and reuse or for maximum efficiency (for pro's especially) or use more of them and change after every panel or two - this equals less marring/swirls over time

Two bucket method vs pressure rinsing a wash mitt/towel is like comparing a bath vs a shower - the bath is self contaminating the shower isn't.

But as I always say - if you like to do it a certain way go ahead as it's your life your choice - there are many ways to do this but from my testing and that of someone I know well, bucket washing with shampoo has passed it's use by date. never putting the mitt back in the bucket again is the absolute safest way to bucket wash if you were too. That's what I do with rinseless

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by The Pad King

Whether you use a foam cannon, detail keg or battery operated or manual pump pack to apply rinseless or shampoo the two bucket method has been obsolete for a decade in pro circles as it's like bathing vs showering - it is self contaminating and despite what anyone says grit separators do not work at all or anywhere near like they should. To clean a mitt or towel high pressure rinsing it or using several instead of one is faster and safer.

A better option is to high pressure rinse your wash mitt or towel and reuse or for maximum efficiency (for pro's especially) or use more of them and change after every panel or two - this equals less marring/swirls over time

Two bucket method vs pressure rinsing a wash mitt/towel is like comparing a bath vs a shower - the bath is self contaminating the shower isn't.

But as I always say - if you like to do it a certain way go ahead as it's your life your choice - there are many ways to do this but from my testing and that of someone I know well, bucket washing with shampoo has passed it's use by date. never putting the mitt back in the bucket again is the absolute safest way to bucket wash if you were too. That's what I do with rinseless

That's kinda where I was going with that question.

This is where I was going with that question.

Going back a number of years, I went and bought several buckets with matching grit guards because I was led to believe that if you aren't using the two-bucket method, you are not washing safely. I went on to start using the 2BM, because that's what I'm supposed to do...............................







But what do you notice about the last image above? That I'm washing in the sun? No not that, but probably avoid doing that. That the car is covered in foamy soap. Correct.

Where am I going with this? Why do I need that extra bucket with soap and water in it when I've already delivered soap directly onto the vehicle. My reasoning here being I achieved maximum soap coverage and therefore maximum lubrication. I therefore only require one bucket with water to rinse the wash pad between sections.



With this one-bucket method, I am washing just as safely as I would with another bucket to fill, lug around and empty. With how widespread foam cannons have become, I just can't grasp why you would bother using the two-bucket method. The exception to this would be if you don't have access to a foam cannon/pressure washer, then yep, 1000% do the two-bucket method.

(For clarity, I do have a separate bucket for wheels.)

What gets me "passionate" about this topic is how a certain subset of the detailing community refuse to see the reasoning behind not doing the 2BM, as if you are breaking the rules. I even had one tell me that I am in fact using the two-bucket method..........................I mean, how? A foam cannon is not a bucket.

[The Pad King]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

That's kinda where I was going with that question.

This is where I was going with that question.

Going back a number of years, I went and bought several buckets with matching grit guards because I was led to believe that if you aren't using the two-bucket method, you are not washing safely. I went on to start using the 2BM, because that's what I'm supposed to do...............................

image

image

image

But what do you notice about the last image above? That I'm washing in the sun? No not that, but probably avoid doing that. That the car is covered in foamy soap. Correct.

Where am I going with this? Why do I need that extra bucket with soap and water in it when I've already delivered soap directly onto the vehicle. My reasoning here being I achieved maximum soap coverage and therefore maximum lubrication. I therefore only require one bucket with water to rinse the wash pad between sections.

image

With this one-bucket method, I am washing just as safely as I would with another bucket to fill, lug around and empty. With how widespread foam cannons have become, I just can't grasp why you would bother using the two-bucket method. The exception to this would be if you don't have access to a foam cannon/pressure washer, then yep, 1000% do the two-bucket method.

(For clarity, I do have a separate bucket for wheels.)

What gets me "passionate" about this topic is how a certain subset of the detailing community refuse to see the reasoning behind not doing the 2BM, as if you are breaking the rules. I even had one tell me that I am in fact using the two-bucket method..........................I mean, how? A foam cannon is not a bucket.

Yep well said. I've been a user of the zero bucket wash method but am about 95% rinseless to clean all three of my cars. If their dusty or worse then of course a rinseless pre soak then low or high pressure rinse is what I do - sometimes I'll use shampoo but rarely.
In two and a half years of doing rinseless washing which has been mostly pre soak, rinse, reapply rinseless and dry there is only light marring/swirls present on my black Toyota 86 GTS and a gold pad and polish can remove those no problem.

I'm not a snow foam user at present but would like to have that later this year but would never use a snow foam product - it's just not necessary for my cars that have every surface coated. but certainly agree that it has it's place especially with muddy cars, wheel arches, wheels and tyres. even if it was designed initially to sell more soap
The lubrication provided from a foam cannon prior to hand washing is definitely superior to the older methods but I still advise pressure rinsing wash media and I like to use towels not mitts as they hold more shampoo

Adding rinseless to any car wash shampoo foam cannon or detail keg is something I've done before to soften water and add encapsulation capabilities and more lubrication

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by The Pad King

Yep well said. I've been a user of the zero bucket wash method but am about 95% rinseless to clean all three of my cars. If their dusty or worse then of course a rinseless pre soak then low or high pressure rinse is what I do - sometimes I'll use shampoo but rarely.
In two and a half years of doing rinseless washing which has been mostly pre soak, rinse, reapply rinseless and dry there is only light marring/swirls present on my black Toyota 86 GTS and a gold pad and polish can remove those no problem.

I'm not a snow foam user at present but would like to have that later this year but would never use a snow foam product - it's just not necessary for my cars that have every surface coated. but certainly agree that it has it's place especially with muddy cars, wheel arches, wheels and tyres. even if it was designed initially to sell more soap
The lubrication provided from a foam cannon prior to hand washing is definitely superior to the older methods but I still advise pressure rinsing wash media and I like to use towels not mitts as they hold more shampoo

Adding rinse-less to any car wash shampoo foam cannon or detail keg is something I've done before to soften water and add encapsulation capabilities and more lubrication

Do you multiple towel rinse-less wash, or one of those sponges?

I'm still relatively new to rinse-less and threshold for it is pretty low. But I do enjoy it, and for garage queens, rinse-less is arguably the perfect solution, especially for older cars where rustproofing wasn't a priority and preservation is key.

But....................I really like using soap too, more so than rinse-less. I think its a combination of things, from the act of foaming, the highly lubricated feel, the smell of the soap.

[The Pad King]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Do you multiple towel rinse-less wash, or one of those sponges?

I'm still relatively new to rinse-less and threshold for it is pretty low. But I do enjoy it, and for garage queens, rinse-less is arguably the perfect solution, especially for older cars where rustproofing wasn't a priority and preservation is key.

But....................I really like using soap too, more so than rinse-less. I think its a combination of things, from the act of foaming, the highly lubricated feel, the smell of the soap.

Yes I can certainly understand - soap does feel lubricating but it actually isn't really as lubricating as you think.
suds are just air bubbles that collapse under the lightest pressure but soap does have grime lifting and emulsifying action but they leave a film behind that attracts dirt/grime faster but certainly still a good option

I use probably six to twelve towels to do a rinseless wash - one per each panel or two but I've always been a six to twelve with pads and towels - more washing but safer. each to their own of course

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

WANT!!

Been away for a couple weeks and only just watched this.

I'm totally buying one, that review was great, really showed why it could be so useful.

I'll also only need the skin as have batteries already. Next sale, i'll buy one.

[The Pad King]

the mirka knock off I'm guessing

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by The Pad King

the mirka knock off I'm guessing

100%, but why would you buy a Mirka for $1700 when you can buy this for $300.

I would recommend watching the video from 19:50. I agree with his thoughts 100 times over. A lot of pro's knock them. The best professional detailer in Canberra that is, imo, one of the best in Australia uses them on $5000 details, so they are doing something right.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

100%, but why would you buy a Mirka for $1700 when you can buy this for $300.

I would recommend watching the video from 19:50. I agree with his thoughts 100 times over. A lot of pro's knock them. The best professional detailer in Canberra that is, imo, one of the best in Australia uses them on $5000 details, so they are doing something right.

Here's the thing, when I was at Waxit last year for a class, I was the only "enthusiast" in the group, the rest (including Sandro) were professionals. None of them had nice things to say about Rupes.................you know, the brand primarily aimed at professionals. I was also the only one with Rupes machines in the fleet. Hmmmm.......................

On the other hand, all of them had ShineMates, all of them had problems with Rupes from a reliability and quality point of view, and from a financial point of view too. When you pay a significant price premium for a product or tool, you kind of expect a certain level of reliability and after sales support. To quote someone in the game, "support the businesses that support your business." Well, these guys are being let down by poor quality, poor aftersales support and are expected to pay an extremely high price premium for that privilege? Rupes should be leading the industry, but they have fallen behind. The HLR75 I found alarmingly bad, the quality issues with the new HLR15 and 21 are well documented, the iBrid is well overdue for an update and overpriced.

The ShineMate brand may be assembled in China, and there may be some copy-cat going on, but it's nowhere near the level of Maxshine and the others. Unlike Rupes, ShineMate ARE innovating, launching new product quickly and efficiently. ShineMate have been making battery powered machines longer than most, at one point it was a choice between the grossly overpriced Flex machines, or the ShineMate EB range. Way before the Milwaukee machines, and way way way before Rupes followed. The difference I see with ShineMate is the team behind them, unlike the other faceless Chinese companies peddling cheap and nasty garbage.

I hate saying the above, I'm brand snob and like the idea of owning the best. I have three Rupes machines, I love the brand..................but they are not innovating and are charging a premium for it. And that is a great shame because its hard to recapture burnt customers.

The Mirka copy? Well, it was always going to happen considering the outrageous price they ask for it. The Mirca is undoubtably better, but not three times better. And now that a brand like ShineMate has come along and made something very similar and almost of smooth, well the flood gates have been opened. Who would buy the Mirka at that silly price now?

[FTE217]

Shinemate does the job for me got 2 and now I'll have 3 like fordo, once a sale is on or I'll just get it upon next waxit order, $300 is easy compared to rupes over priced product.

[fordomatic]

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...42171131789401

Turns out I bought it quicker than I thought I would, $247, bargain.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

https://www.waxit.com.au/collections...42171131789401

Turns out I bought it quicker than I thought I would, $247, bargain.

You already have the battery and charger system, so yep, $250 is a bargain.

I need to hear your thoughts at some point.

[FTE217]

Onya Fordo.
I started compiling my online shop earlier today - waiting in my cart I’ll end up buying it as well.


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