How is the economy affecting you? - Page 2

BlackLS · 24-02-2009, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackers10

I was made redundant back at the end of October.. had 2 job offers evaporate before my employment commenced as contracts didn't carry the tonnage they expected
and now i just got a job at Bevchain Logistics which i think is pretty safe money as they are the main distributor for beer and other alcoholic beverages to QLD and northern NSW and NT... and everybody wants a few coldies in the arvo to wash away a hard days work no matter what the economic climate.. just means they drink a cheaper brew..
just makes it hard because im trying to get into the logistics industry and sadly.. its a funny one to get a foot in at the best of times

Beer consumption has actually increased during these hard times.

Spudz27 · 24-02-2009, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X000BOSS

As a very few of you know, im a pawnbroker. business has been booming at the moment. never ever had it this good. i think it just goes to show that things are hard out there for many people at the moment.

I can understand why very few people knew. Not to be rude but my dealings in the past is you guys prey on the poor. You buy at prices that are a joke but people in need just5 say o.k then whack 50 sometimes 70% on items. I realise you have to make money as well but sometimes it is a joke the markup you guys put on things.

An example. I had an ipod touch 2nd gen 16gb. Cost me 416 was 1 week old. It turned out it wasn't usuefull for what I needed and I decided to upgrade to a laptop. Before I put it on Ebay I figured I would see what the local place would give. They wanted to pay me $60. I just laughed and walked off. You think they would pay $60 then sell it for oh I dunno $400. How is that fair on people?

Mind you every place is different i guess.

_CRUZ_ · 24-02-2009, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackLS

Beer consumption has actually increased during these hard times.

lool.

Wait till the other job losses hit hard. If you are rich or debt free it wont effect you quite as much, but for alot of others times are tough.

blueoval · 24-02-2009, 02:54 PM

I own a Building Design/Drafting Company in Adelaide.

Ive only been in business since July 08. We started off well. Its been slow going, and there were times when we wondered if we would be able to eat for the week, as the business has been taking up all our funds.

The economy of late has made investors and builders think more now. Projects that were in the process of going ahead are now on hold till further notice, or the proposed dwellings of 2 storey town houses are now reduced to smaller single storey residences. Material choices are also in question. Everyone is looking for ways to save money to maximise profit.

One thing that gets me is the builders NOT paying when the account is due. I understand that money might be tight for some, but sadly builder's think that because the owner hasn't paid them, then they shouldnt pay the guys they asked to do work for them. WRONG! The responsibility for paying your tradies etc is on YOU as the builder. You dont go to macca's and buy and hambuger and not pay for it till after you've eaten it. Why should a trade who has done work for you be any different?

Another thing happened last week too, was we had a part time employee whom we had doing some overflow work we gave him due to his recently being fired from his previous place of work. He was a mate, we knew him well. He call us up late on Friday, saying the place who we do work for has offered him a full time position in another department of that company. Well we thought, thats good to hear as their work has been a little quiet but has still been good for us. We can still provide them with a drafting service like before. My business partner has a meeting with the manager of the company we do work for, and finds out they no longer need OUR services since they are employing on the guy whom we were paying to do the work in the first place!!!! Man are we p!ssed. Not only did we lose an employee, but also a major contract in work that was worth up to 40k a year in workload. What gets me with this was that the guy we had, never told us he was taking over our work. This all has been happening on the sly. Only to give us 1 hours notice of him resigning.

I understand that times are tough, and this company is taking ot the middle man, but I feel the ex-employee should have notified us of this arrangement prior to cut us loose like that.

One thing we didn't do and we admit to it, was we didn't have a written contract or disclosure form stating he cannot take any work from us due to conflict of interest. It was stupid on our part, and we have been burnt for it, but it doesnt make it right from a mates point of view trying to help his family out when times got tough for him.

So no more favors for anyone anymore. Time to keep friends/family separate from work.

Anyway, thats my rant.

But yes I feel for all those who are working for a boss.

grey_esp · 24-02-2009, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by russxr67

These are the some of the pricks in the trade that make it difficult for me to score jobs and usually the nett result is one that is of poor quality.

Sadly,I have seen this scenario dozens of times. Product knowledge and skill takes years to aquire . There are no regulations in regards to tilers.Anyone who can mix a bucket a glue is an instant pro.
I hope your mate learnt a valuable lesson.

My shoe is on the other foot on this one. I dont mean to offend you mate, but over the past 5 or so years of the boom how much did you increase your rate by?

I got a quote to have some tiles laid a little over 12 months ago (maybe 18) $45/m which was about twice the price I could get laminate flooring laid for at the time, and was about the same price per/m as the tile itself.
I went and got some quotes a couple of weeks ago having saved the money and recently purchased the same tile (a fair bit cheaper on sale, but the retail price was still the same) quotes to have them laid now are $65/m (and i did get a quote from the same guy). Now my pay hasnt increased by 50% in the last 18 months. Fuel has gone down, interest rates are down, So how does that work?

Isnt the term "Cashed up bogan" born out of the boom and all these tradies who have been making a killing charging what ever that wanted because they could then going and blowing it on cars and boats and bikes etc.

All that aside, when it comes down to it, If it didnt cost so much to get things done, then more people could afford to do it. Then alot of tradies would still have a lot of work. I can appreciate what your saying about imported labour, and there is no way Im paying someone who cant even speak english to do anything on my place.

Im going to lay them myself. I can afford to make a lot of mistakes for $65/m

gazza414 · 24-02-2009, 03:54 PM

Our largest trading partner Japan just last week announced that their economy had contrated by 14% in the last month

there are hard times ahead.

look at the steel industry too...its almost at a standstill with reported stockpiles of 500,000 tonnes at Port Kembla. NSW as has been reported.

Look what Honda and Vauxhall has done to their workforce in the UK.

we are going to be looking at a very different situation in 6 to 9mths as the fallout continues I'd suggest for the majority of working folks.... and many have had to put retirement plans on hold as investments collapse.

uranium_death · 24-02-2009, 03:55 PM

The economy affects me everyday.

gazza414 · 24-02-2009, 03:56 PM

Its great to hear some are doing better than most... those who are in the public service arent aware there is a financial crisis.

Those like me who work for large multi national companies know all too well.

ILLaViTaR · 24-02-2009, 04:15 PM

It's great.

19yr old only asset and worry is a car. $950 coming, the other package that families received earlier on.

Thanks to the economy crashing LPG prices are cheaper than ever.

I love this crisis!

X000BOSS · 24-02-2009, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EDfutura25

I can understand why very few people knew. Not to be rude but my dealings in the past is you guys prey on the poor. You buy at prices that are a joke but people in need just5 say o.k then whack 50 sometimes 70% on items. I realise you have to make money as well but sometimes it is a joke the markup you guys put on things.

An example. I had an ipod touch 2nd gen 16gb. Cost me 416 was 1 week old. It turned out it wasn't usuefull for what I needed and I decided to upgrade to a laptop. Before I put it on Ebay I figured I would see what the local place would give. They wanted to pay me $60. I just laughed and walked off. You think they would pay $60 then sell it for oh I dunno $400. How is that fair on people?

Mind you every place is different i guess.

what makes you understand? sounds like you dont understand much at all. as a matter of fact we are actually helping people. but wont bother explaining to you how. probably wouldnt understand anyway. and just for some info, pawnbroking isnt just about buying your crappy useless ipod then onselling it.

actually you are wrong. 70% profit margin is nowhere near enough

- its not just you but alot of other ignorant people like you think the same as you. you pay $416 for something a week ago and think it is still worth $400. WAKEY WAKEY!!.

Fev · 24-02-2009, 04:27 PM

My company's Board has just announced we will not get any (anyone - even ceo etc) bonus's - which is quite bad - the bonus's run on a KPI kind of system and everyone was working really hard to get the best bonus they could (225% of the base bonus which is 5k) and a lot of people had already based their budgets and bills around it..
kinda sucks for our department since we're almost floating the company atm...

so yeh - just gonna have to save a bit harder now...

mr smith · 24-02-2009, 04:34 PM

Working a lot harder now, lots of people where I work have been put off over the last few months. A constant cloud over the future, nearly everyone I talk to at work and outside of work are worried and I've seen plenty of people who thought they were safe get a real surprise when they are given the boot.

ILLaViTaR · 24-02-2009, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gazza414

Its great to hear some are doing better than most... those who are in the public service arent aware there is a financial crisis.

Those like me who work for large multi national companies know all too well.

That's because they don't own their own business and keep borrowing money to expand their already wealthy business and their greed then have it come back on them and put them up creek.

My father is a public servant earns a lot less than the bloke next door who got his window business inherited from his parents. Dad is constantly working and it's a stressful job he's seemed more depressed and overworked than ever before. The bloke next door is home half the time twiddling his thumbs. My boss is taking holidays on a monthly basis (pizza shop owner) does probably a 10th of the work my father does but he earns 4 times the amount too and has his WRX claimed on his business!!!
The bloke next door also owns a BMW and a Holden Grange, gets new ones every year. WONDER WHY! Dad can't do that!

I love how people who drop out in year 10 take a 4 year apprenticeship whilst still getting an income through their education hang on public servants. While people like my dad had to be poor through their education.
It's even worse nowadays Uni can be 10k per year.

My mates a carpet layer, my age getting an FG ute off his fathers business.
My father couldn't afford a car for me (I was broke), so he gave me the old family car.

People need to wake up and get over the non working public servant stereotype. It's really the other way around.

MrEL · 24-02-2009, 04:53 PM

I work for an electricity supply company and the axe has fallen in the way of overtime. It will be minimal to none from now on.
Will cost a lot of us in the vacinity of 30 to 60 K a year.
We are all pretty upset and annoyed but as I said to one of the guys having a big blowup about it today, we should consider ourselves lucky that at the moment we still have what a lot of other people dont now. We still at this time have a weekly pay cheque.

Green X · 24-02-2009, 05:02 PM

I'm a Mechy Fitter, currently working on the Boddington Goldmine expansion, I'm living in a 4 star hotel in the CBD payed for by Newmont, and get taken to work every night by coach!! Loving it.

But yes things have got tight if you are looking for work, ATM it's not what you know it's who you know that's going to get you on a job.

We basically lost 80% of owe contracts overnight, I'm just in save mode now so if i need to sit around for 3-4 months looking for work in the future i can.

even thou things i tight ATM i hope allot of the Chinese Bids to buy into the WA mining sector don't go thou, i think we would be worse of in the long run. Having the people your selling minerals to owning big chunks of the mining company selling it don't make sense to me!!

russxr67 · 24-02-2009, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grey_esp

My shoe is on the other foot on this one. I dont mean to offend you mate, but over the past 5 or so years of the boom how much did you increase your rate by?

I got a quote to have some tiles laid a little over 12 months ago (maybe 18) $45/m which was about twice the price I could get laminate flooring laid for at the time, and was about the same price per/m as the tile itself.
I went and got some quotes a couple of weeks ago having saved the money and recently purchased the same tile (a fair bit cheaper on sale, but the retail price was still the same) quotes to have them laid now are $65/m (and i did get a quote from the same guy). Now my pay hasnt increased by 50% in the last 18 months. Fuel has gone down, interest rates are down, So how does that work?

Isnt the term "Cashed up bogan" born out of the boom and all these tradies who have been making a killing charging what ever that wanted because they could then going and blowing it on cars and boats and bikes etc.

All that aside, when it comes down to it, If it didnt cost so much to get things done, then more people could afford to do it. Then alot of tradies would still have a lot of work. I can appreciate what your saying about imported labour, and there is no way Im paying someone who cant even speak english to do anything on my place.

Im going to lay them myself. I can afford to make a lot of mistakes for $65/m

I'm guessing the tiles in question were of a rectified nature or polished porcelain ?? What size were they? It does make a difference to the price.

BTW,laminate flooring is crap. It costs $20 per m2 for a reason.Scratch it and it's ruined.

Sam_Boss260 · 24-02-2009, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fev

My company's Board has just announced we will not get any (anyone - even ceo etc) bonus's - which is quite bad - the bonus's run on a KPI kind of system and everyone was working really hard to get the best bonus they could (225% of the base bonus which is 5k) and a lot of people had already based their budgets and bills around it..
kinda sucks for our department since we're almost floating the company atm...

so yeh - just gonna have to save a bit harder now...

yep, that is exactly what has happened to me. Board has said "no" to bonuses, and we put off 8 people last December, so we have to work harder for less $$$. Go figure.

So to those you aren't effected, or those that don't have a family to support, all the power to you !

MrEL · 24-02-2009, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

I love how people who drop out in year 10 take a 4 year apprenticeship whilst still getting an income through their education hang on public servants. While people like my dad had to be poor through their education.
It's even worse nowadays Uni can be 10k per year.

People need to wake up and get over the non working public servant stereotype. It's really the other way around.

What a load of crap! I work in the public sector as a tradie and while I do appreciate what you are saying about people in the public sector being stereo typed as non working is not right and wrong , I take serious offence to being called a Year 10 drop out. Yes I left school at the end of year 10 and did my electrical apprenticeship. I cut my teeth doing the crap jobs and working my way up through the ranks.
To be basically called a year 10 drop out is insulting. As far as stereo typing I have actually found that the vast majority of people calling us bludgers and telling us how to do our jobs , then start raving on about their university education and how great they are.
As far as being paid through our education do you honestly believe that tradies had or have it easy? I was 16 earning $ 225 a week if I worked a Saturday. Out of that I paid TAFE fees , text books , tools , full adult rate of tax , no concession on medicine , rego , public transport etc.
I also did not get the option to roll that all over into a HECS debt that I could pay off when I was earning some decent coin. It all had to be paid up front pass or fail.
Tradies do not have it as easy as you seem to think and make out.
Your fathers hard earnt university education that he is broke after doing would not be worth much if he did not have the electricity available to run his computer , the water available to fill his coffee mug , a door or a window of his office to close , or if he had to crap in the corner because there was no toilet.
Yeah us tradies are just dumb year 10 drop outs the world can do without hey.

As far as people getting to do not much , take a stack of holidays from work and claim a WRX or a Grange through work being non working bums well think of this.
It is them that puts their **** on the line if the business falls over. They run the risk of loosing everything. You get to go home at the end of your job at the pizza shop and not worry about the place safe with your pay. You odnt have to worry about finding the money for the bills , paying the staff that you still need there even if business has dropped 30% etc.
To be able to have a few more holidays and claim some cars through tax is more then fair.
Without them you wouldnt have the job at the pizza shop or the boss to hang crap on because he is successfull and doesnt have to be hands on now.
Maybe if you Dad left the security of his public servents job , took the risk and put the extra hard yards in to run his own business with his university education maybe he could afford to buy you a car and you could work in the business and get to take lots of holidays and not do a lot of work!
There is a lot of stereotyping and generalising in the thread. Mainly coming from your post. Maybe you are just bitter that you are not one of the rich ones.

gazza414 · 24-02-2009, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gazza414

Its great to hear some are doing better than most... those who are in the public service arent aware there is a financial crisis.

Those like me who work for large multi national companies know all too well.

For those that may have read something else into this post about the public service

It is interesting to speak with my friends who are public servants and they arent aware of any hardships nor redundancies in the workplace due to the economic crisis.. the public service is still short of staff.

Unlike for most who work in the private sector ,where there is the constant chat about downturn, no bonuses this year, retrenchments, redundancies, customers disappearing, orders just not there etc.

hope this clears things up.

rodderz · 24-02-2009, 05:53 PM

If anyone does the hard yards throughout their learning time then takes the punt on starting their own business and getting rewarded for their labour, good on them. It doesnt matter if they are a tradie or an accounting firm. They have started from scratch, decided they could earn a quid doing it for themselves and gone out and done it. There' nothing stopping anyone from doing it. Tradies may be seen as being a ripoff but there's a lot of overheads before you make a dollar. A lot of tradies you have to make $35/hr before you see a cent.

10 years ago I was mixing mud in a barrow and getting yelled at by the boss, and had to work my way through the ranks. After a while I thought that I could work elsewhere to progress, or start my own business. Glad I decided to go out on my own now, a heap of work and worries...but freedom at the same time.

**buggerlugs** · 24-02-2009, 06:42 PM

I service Earthmoving and Transport Business's and I'm hearing of layoffs on a daily basis. This has been going on since late October early November last year. And have been told that we haven't seen the worst of it yet. Easily my quietest month in 5 years , this month............

**ebxr8240** · 24-02-2009, 06:45 PM

It takes all sorts to make the world go around..
One thing that gets people out.. Is they buy or build a house way outside there income esp when times are good.. That goes with other expenses too..

Its the people etc that didn't get get themselves into too much dept, that will make a killing in hard times..

ryanstev · 24-02-2009, 06:56 PM

The economy is doing quite well for me at the moment.

I work on an IT help desk, 80 people or so work here, I am about 10th for stats, so if there were any redundancies I should be safe.

I've also just bought a house for very cheap considering the area and the fact it's a 4 bedroom, modern, etc, and the mortgage is less than I currently pay for rent.

Ghiadude · 24-02-2009, 07:32 PM

I work for a large multinational in the port kembla (wollongong) area we have lost 40 blokes and overtime has dried up, lots of other companies are cutting staff and theyre talking about leaving the newly relined No 5 blast furnace cold(unlit) until at least september. Contractors are losing jobs as Bluescope steel (mill owner)uses its own production staff to do the jobs we used to because they arent producing steel. The stockpiles of steel slabs and raw ore are everywhere they can find a space for it. On a positive note the reline is going ahead and represents a 400million dollar investment - not something you would do if you want to close a steel mill. I think the worst is still to come but it cant last forever. Time will tell.

ps interesting read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_1980s_recession

Spudz27 · 24-02-2009, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X000BOSS

what makes you understand? sounds like you dont understand much at all. as a matter of fact we are actually helping people. but wont bother explaining to you how. probably wouldnt understand anyway. and just for some info, pawnbroking isnt just about buying your crappy useless ipod then onselling it.

actually you are wrong. 70% profit margin is nowhere near enough

- its not just you but alot of other ignorant people like you think the same as you. you pay $416 for something a week ago and think it is still worth $400. WAKEY WAKEY!!.

Well people on Ebay figured it was still worth $400. And we could argue all night as you are in the industry and I have been taken for a ride by it when I was in a bad situation. Put it this way mate, I have seen first hand a product I sold while in a bit of a rut, which I was given $30 for, after the whole period of 2 weeks or whatever it is before you put an item on for show, that same item was on sale for $180. You want to tell me how that is fair and helping me out. You (not you personally) pay me **** all and tell me it is because it is not worth anything, yet there is a 600% markup on it.

ILLaViTaR · 24-02-2009, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrEL

What a load of crap! I work in the public sector as a tradie and while I do appreciate what you are saying about people in the public sector being stereo typed as non working is not right and wrong , I take serious offence to being called a Year 10 drop out. Yes I left school at the end of year 10 and did my electrical apprenticeship. I cut my teeth doing the crap jobs and working my way up through the ranks.
To be basically called a year 10 drop out is insulting. As far as stereo typing I have actually found that the vast majority of people calling us bludgers and telling us how to do our jobs , then start raving on about their university education and how great they are.
As far as being paid through our education do you honestly believe that tradies had or have it easy? I was 16 earning $ 225 a week if I worked a Saturday. Out of that I paid TAFE fees , text books , tools , full adult rate of tax , no concession on medicine , rego , public transport etc.
I also did not get the option to roll that all over into a HECS debt that I could pay off when I was earning some decent coin. It all had to be paid up front pass or fail.
Tradies do not have it as easy as you seem to think and make out.
Your fathers hard earnt university education that he is broke after doing would not be worth much if he did not have the electricity available to run his computer , the water available to fill his coffee mug , a door or a window of his office to close , or if he had to crap in the corner because there was no toilet.
Yeah us tradies are just dumb year 10 drop outs the world can do without hey.

As far as people getting to do not much , take a stack of holidays from work and claim a WRX or a Grange through work being non working bums well think of this.
It is them that puts their **** on the line if the business falls over. They run the risk of loosing everything. You get to go home at the end of your job at the pizza shop and not worry about the place safe with your pay. You odnt have to worry about finding the money for the bills , paying the staff that you still need there even if business has dropped 30% etc.
To be able to have a few more holidays and claim some cars through tax is more then fair.
Without them you wouldnt have the job at the pizza shop or the boss to hang crap on because he is successfull and doesnt have to be hands on now.
Maybe if you Dad left the security of his public servents job , took the risk and put the extra hard yards in to run his own business with his university education maybe he could afford to buy you a car and you could work in the business and get to take lots of holidays and not do a lot of work!
There is a lot of stereotyping and generalising in the thread. Mainly coming from your post. Maybe you are just bitter that you are not one of the rich ones.

I'd like to approach key statements from your post:

"I cut my teeth doing the crap jobs and working my way up through the ranks."

Oh god how ignorant
What do you think 4 years of study, exams and stress is? You're basically arguing that physical work is a lot worse than mental work. I'd argue otherwise, people are capable of doing almost anything physical in the industry, it's a lot harder to comprehend what they throw you at uni.
Not only do you spend full time hours at Uni, you study almost as much in your own time. Which is a lot more than your stupid Saturday.
Ftr I'm a tafe student not Uni.
I also mentioned apprenticeships not TAFE. You know the one where the government has a rebate for their tools and there's also another perk they receive. While Uni students struggle to afford books and transport.
Speaking of transport these blokes throw a ladder on their roof and get money back on their car!

"As far as being paid through our education do you honestly believe that tradies had or have it easy? I was 16 earning $ 225 a week if I worked a Saturday. Out of that I paid TAFE fees , text books , tools , full adult rate of tax , no concession on medicine , rego , public transport etc."

Most Uni students are even older (19+) and don't even have $225 a week and still have to get books, no concession , UNI FEES which are 10k per year, no concession, we don't get health care cards, it depends on your parents income. Not only that 19 no money while all your tradie mates go out to the pub drinking beer and you have to resort to goon. Plus you don't buy new books and many other things you've mentioned every one of the 52 weeks in the year. Not saying you have it easy but Uni students clearly have it harder.

"It is them that puts their **** on the line if the business falls over. They run the risk of loosing everything. You get to go home at the end of your job at the pizza shop and not worry about the place safe with your pay."

So you've never heard of redundancy then?
Pffft it's the other way round. They're their own boss they're far more secure in their job than any employee. I've been threatened to be fired numerous times along with many others in my work, not only at this job either.

My father took a year to get back into the workforce after countless job applications and finally got back into the workforce, it was the worst year of his life.
My uncle however owned a building business. He's a carpenter, his accountant stole millions and caused him to declare bankruptcy, lost everything. 5 years later (suspension period of his license), got his builders license back, started another business and is in the money again, just purchased an $800 000 cruiser. He just payed the money off with all the assets he had obtained from the business in the first place. He doesn't fraud tax unlike god knows how many other people either.
I've also discussed it with my boss at work, he was doing mechanical engineering and I was impressed at how at his age he was taking up a massive risk with the loan for his store/the franchise, he said the risks are incredibly minimal and there are all sorts of things to pull you out of the deep water if you get stuck in it. And what the bills they claim back from their tax??? Oh god.

"Without them you wouldnt have the job at the pizza shop or the boss to hang crap on because he is successfull and doesnt have to be hands on now."

Ah the good old praise businesses for supplying jobs argument. That's all I hear, if they didn't have to employ you they wouldn't, generally the already wealthy owner cuts employee costs as low as he can. My work is an example.
Most of those low wage hospitality jobs aren't far off your "back breaking apprenticeship days".
Nike supplied jobs to people in Asia too ya know.

There's bugger all risk, population is constantly growing there's demand for many trades. The only time something bad has happened to them is now and of course that's a terrible terrible thing.

So far according to you employees put in no hard yards, have jobs as secure as a flag pole and breezed through uni copying things down off a whiteboard.
You try and remember what mm spanner undid that bolt while I try and remember how many electrons are in 1 coloumb.

ckugler · 24-02-2009, 08:26 PM

I am a self employed roofing contractor in the ACT and I am the busiest I have ever been. The one good thing going for me is our public servants. They dont get laid off or get pay cuts and they are the ones still spending the money. Yes they are more careful and get a few more quotes for their work, and they try to get you with the old 'how much for cash' trick, but I have learnt to weed out the ones that are genuine and basically offer a better quality service than many other competitors. Many of my customers are through word of mouth, and these only come when you are doing something right. Believe me, because there is no licensing or regulatory system in the ACT for roofers, there are heaps of kids and generally unqualified people quoting for the same jobs, and yes a lot of the time they win the job because of the customers that are strapped and just want the cheapest price. Thankfully there are plenty of people with money who still care about quality, and most of my customers are this type. Things are definately tighter but if I keep my smarts and stick with the values I have always traded by, and dont cut my prices ridiculously just to win more work, I think in the long run more work will come my way. I have 2 guys employed and dont want to let them down either, its not just me.
I do feel for all you others doing it tough though. Things will get better, we just need to turn the public perception from this media induced panic, to a more optimistic way of thinking, this will definately help.

Bucknaked · 24-02-2009, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckugler

I am a self employed roofing contractor in the ACT and I am the busiest I have ever been. The one good thing going for me is our public servants. They dont get laid off or get pay cuts and they are the ones still spending the money. Yes they are more careful and get a few more quotes for their work, and they try to get you with the old 'how much for cash' trick, but I have learnt to weed out the ones that are genuine and basically offer a better quality service than many other competitors. Many of my customers are through word of mouth, and these only come when you are doing something right. Believe me, because there is no licensing or regulatory system in the ACT for roofers, there are heaps of kids and generally unqualified people quoting for the same jobs, and yes a lot of the time they win the job because of the customers that are strapped and just want the cheapest price. Thankfully there are plenty of people with money who still care about quality, and most of my customers are this type. Things are definately tighter but if I keep my smarts and stick with the values I have always traded by, and dont cut my prices ridiculously just to win more work, I think in the long run more work will come my way. I have 2 guys employed and dont want to let them down either, its not just me.
I do feel for all you others doing it tough though. Things will get better, we just need to turn the public perception from this media induced panic, to a more optimistic way of thinking, this will definately help.

A guy at work is looking to have work done on his roof. If you send me details via PM, I can pass them on to him. I think he's at Holt. Apparently his roof leaks when it rains. Something to do with the cement. I dunno, but it goes something like that.

MrEL · 24-02-2009, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

I'd like to approach key statements from your post:

"I cut my teeth doing the crap jobs and working my way up through the ranks."

Oh god how ignorant
What do you think 4 years of study, exams and stress is? You're basically arguing that physical work is a lot worse than mental work. I'd argue otherwise, people are capable of doing almost anything physical in the industry, it's a lot harder to comprehend what they throw you at uni.
Not only do you spend full time hours at Uni, you study almost as much in your own time. Which is a lot more than your stupid Saturday.
Ftr I'm a tafe student not Uni.
I also mentioned apprenticeships not TAFE. You know the one where the government has a rebate for their tools and there's also another perk they receive. While Uni students struggle to afford books and transport.
Speaking of transport these blokes throw a ladder on their roof and get money back on their car!

"As far as being paid through our education do you honestly believe that tradies had or have it easy? I was 16 earning $ 225 a week if I worked a Saturday. Out of that I paid TAFE fees , text books , tools , full adult rate of tax , no concession on medicine , rego , public transport etc."

Most Uni students are even older (19+) and don't even have $225 a week and still have to get books, no concession , UNI FEES which are 10k per year, no concession, we don't get health care cards, it depends on your parents income. Not only that 19 no money while all your tradie mates go out to the pub drinking beer and you have to resort to goon. Plus you don't buy new books and many other things you've mentioned every one of the 52 weeks in the year. Not saying you have it easy but Uni students clearly have it harder.

"It is them that puts their **** on the line if the business falls over. They run the risk of loosing everything. You get to go home at the end of your job at the pizza shop and not worry about the place safe with your pay."

So you've never heard of redundancy then?
Pffft it's the other way round. They're their own boss they're far more secure in their job than any employee. I've been threatened to be fired numerous times along with many others in my work, not only at this job either.

My father took a year to get back into the workforce after countless job applications and finally got back into the workforce, it was the worst year of his life.
My uncle however owned a building business. He's a carpenter, his accountant stole millions and caused him to declare bankruptcy, lost everything. 5 years later (suspension period of his license), got his builders license back, started another business and is in the money again, just purchased an $800 000 cruiser. He just payed the money off with all the assets he had obtained from the business in the first place. He doesn't fraud tax unlike god knows how many other people either.
I've also discussed it with my boss at work, he was doing mechanical engineering and I was impressed at how at his age he was taking up a massive risk with the loan for his store/the franchise, he said the risks are incredibly minimal and there are all sorts of things to pull you out of the deep water if you get stuck in it. And what the bills they claim back from their tax??? Oh god.

"Without them you wouldnt have the job at the pizza shop or the boss to hang crap on because he is successfull and doesnt have to be hands on now."

Ah the good old praise businesses for supplying jobs argument. That's all I hear, if they didn't have to employ you they wouldn't, generally the already wealthy owner cuts employee costs as low as he can. My work is an example.
Most of those low wage hospitality jobs aren't far off your "back breaking apprenticeship days".
Nike supplied jobs to people in Asia too ya know.

There's bugger all risk, population is constantly growing there's demand for many trades. The only time something bad has happened to them is now and of course that's a terrible terrible thing.

So far according to you employees put in no hard yards, have jobs as secure as a flag pole and breezed through uni copying things down off a whiteboard.
You try and remember what mm spanner undid that bolt while I try and remember how many electrons are in 1 coloumb.

Mate you have your hand on it so tight the heads going purple from the grip. You really think you are better and the world owes you something hey?
You think a trade course is all manual labour? You have no idea. You dont mention the studying for hours thats involved , the assignments and the sheer amount of work you do in your own time to get ahead and be the best you can.
Nah I didnt buy new books every week. It was every 4 to be exact generally around $300 at a time to cover the corse corriculum , australian standards , texts etc.
Then the supply and maintainance of technical tools.
I never got a cent to tie a ladder to my car. I never tied one to it. Did not ever get a cent to travel to tech or anything , never got paid to carry my tools was never entitled to it.
We never got any form of government grant or concession for tools. The $800 current apprentices get is really a drop in a bucket and covers the mere basics. I got a $4.50 a week tool allowance. Pity back then I had to have around $12K worth of tools to door my job. Yep paid them off during my apprenticeship while adding to the kit anytime I could afford it. Currently have around $40k worth of tools built up.
A 19 year old bloke should be able to have a few schooners at the pub. They should be a 3rd possibly 4th year apprentice starting to earn some money. They learnt to stand on their own two feet early and got on with things.
By your attitude you really seem to honestly believe you are better then anyone else and the world owes you something because you are so hard done by. With that attitude Id sack you too.
Yeah it helps to remember what mm spanner goes on to what bolt when you mechanically and electrially design , fabricate and commission a machine yourself from scratch as a 4th year.
Also have a pretty good idea of what is thrown at you at uni. I pretty much covered that when I was doing my Associate Diaploma or Electrical Engineering and alos again as I was doing my Diaploma in adult education and training.
Not saying Im smarter then you or any dumber but people dont give tradies the recoginaiton they deserve. There is a load more to it then the stubbies with the **** cheeks hanging out and the schooner and meat pie for smoko that a lot of people who are uneducated in the real world want to believe.

GT0132 · 24-02-2009, 10:35 PM

Going OK so far...CFO for a corporate law firm....Some property & litigation work has dropped off, but our insurance and employment law areas are booming...Had 2 job offers since mid January which i turned down...Interest rates are tumbling so looking at buying another property...Petrols down as are airfares so heading overseas in April with my kids for a well earned holiday.

Downside - (1) my super fund has lost 30% of it's value and (2) the second hand market for B series V8's took a tumble immediately after I bought mine