Undercover squeegee cops nab dozens of drivers on phones

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

I think people are missing the point

Window washing at the traffic lights is illegal and thus could be tested as a form of entrapment.

Test away, there are no entrapment laws in Aus.

[GO FURTHER]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

I think people are missing the point

Window washing at the traffic lights is illegal and thus could be tested as a form of entrapment.

Firstly, the police do not have to follow the road rules in the course of their duty if deemed necessary.
That's why they can park illegally on a nature strip with a radar gun and book you.

Secondly, by legal definition 'entrapment' or for it to be used as a line of defence, entrapment in Australia occurs in circumstances where a police officer or law enforcement agent has improperly induced or coerced a person to commit an offence.

The undercover squeegee cops, in this case, were simply using the tactic to get close enough to witness a person using their mobile phone while driving or the car was stationary in traffic (but not parked).

They did not coerce or induce the drivers to use their phones.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

I think people are missing the point

Window washing at the traffic lights is illegal and thus could be tested as a form of entrapment.

But I copped one at a set of lights many moons ago for touching the phone, copped it on the chin don't touch it all now.

Really need to be focussed on driving these days given how distracted other driver are because of phones in the car.

I don't think so. Probably its the same way undercover cops can buy or sell drugs as part of a police operation.

Entrapment might be if they knew your phone number through a number plate search, then called you at the lights to see if you answer. Well maybe.

[lucas2]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

Window washing at the traffic lights is illegal and thus could be tested as a form of entrapment.

The police claim that no windows were actually washed. In terms of entrapment, the police didn't coerce or force people to pick up their phones and start using them.

Personally, I'm not a fan of this tactic. Much akin to the unmarked cars displaying L plates and family stickers. I prefer transparency in these kinds of operations, a visible police presence and proper driver education over a quick fix (fine).

I think something like this can detract from the positivity of their efforts last week dealing with the terrorist.

[Tonz]

The police can do whatever they like in the execution of the duties.
Most of you are too young but many years ago a new hydroponic store opened up in Victoria, offering stupidly cheap prices and free delivery of goods purchased. A few weeks later said buyers received unannounced visits from Vic constabulary.

I love the guys, do whatever you can to catch idiots.

[cheap]

Wow the nanny state runs strong with some. Here I was thinking there was a bit of difference being stopped at the lights and tinkering with a phone V’s driving along at 100km/hr and tinkering with a phone - obviously some people see this as a capital crime no mater what.

So then I wondered if this might be another revenue raising scheme masquerading as road safety? Victoria is a tad broke.

[lucas2]

Originally Posted by Tonz

The police can do whatever they like in the execution of the duties.
Most of you are too young but many years ago a new hydroponic store opened up in Victoria, offering stupidly cheap prices and free delivery of goods purchased. A few weeks later said buyers received unannounced visits from Vic constabulary.

I love the guys, do whatever you can to catch idiots.

By that logic - HWP and Vicroads should be allowed to go visit all members unannounced from this forum and ensure their vehicles meet ADR and RWC standards.

I also generally like the police. However, I think there should be a clear line drawn to ensure public trust is maintained. Police shouldn't be allowed to do whatever they like during their duties - that's how a culture of corruption develops.

[Rallye Sport]

Not the first time they've used tactics like this. They used to send the young cadets to theft hotspot carparks. They'd hang around stretching in their yoga gear pretending to be park users whilst scoping for junky thieves doing over cars.
On another cop/ phone related subject, heading into work about 3:30am this morn, cop car, flashing lights, stopped in the left lane of the narrows bridge. Two coppers stopped for a selfie with the city in the background! Damn I need a dash cam.

[FG50T]

Originally Posted by cheap

Wow the nanny state runs strong with some. Here I was thinking there was a bit of difference being stopped at the lights and tinkering with a phone V’s driving along at 100km/hr and tinkering with a phone - obviously some people see this as a capital crime no mater what.

So then I wondered if this might be another revenue raising scheme masquerading as road safety? Victoria is a tad broke.

100% agree with you... Just a cash grab by Vicpol. Harmless enough to touch your phone at a red light and anyone that says otherwise have got to be joking. I can type an email and browse the internet on my nav screen in my car and that's not illegal and so much more distracting.

They would have been better off drug testing on that road anyway. They would have tripled their revenue.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by FG50T

I can type an email and browse the internet on my nav screen in my car and that's not illegal and so much more distracting.

Yep. Bizarre that in a nanny state such as ours, we don't have ADRs that deal with this stuff. I mean, you cant play a DVD on the main screen while the car is in motion, but when it comes to something like cancelling a warning screen, many systems require you to do that on the touchscreen, you cant cancel them via the wheel buttons/etc.

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by FG50T

100% agree with you... Just a cash grab by Vicpol. Harmless enough to touch your phone at a red light and anyone that says otherwise have got to be joking. I can type an email and browse the internet on my nav screen in my car and that's not illegal and so much more distracting.

Personally dont have a problem with people checking their phone at the lights so long as they move when the arrow is green. but do you really need to?
There's some things you cant do on your screen like check Calender's for appointment details, but checking FB for example is just not necessary.

curious though, what sort of NAV allows web browsing and emails?

[Olbucko]

Originally Posted by Warrenk

Confiscation won't stop most people as they will probably have a old one laying around somewhere. Just treat the mobile phone users who are using them while driving the same way they treat "hoon" drivers. Impound their car the same as the "hoon law". If they won't learn from their vehicle be impounded, just confiscate their car(or truck) after the 3rd or 4th infringement.

Warren

Not so simple for many people, they will have lost their sim card, settings and possibly their contacts, setting up a replacement phone is not easy for many people.
For a second offence the phone should be destroyed in front of them.

[LG17]

I don't have a problem with what they did.
Sometimes I wish I was one as I see the same people all the time on their phones.

[kmav23]

People need to use voice commands on their mobiles. I use Google to read my messages, send messages, navigate maps and turn on music etc. Great feature once you start using it.

Much better then being fined or causing an accident.

[kmav23]

Originally Posted by Olbucko

Not so simple for many people, they will have lost their sim card, settings and possibly their contacts, setting up a replacement phone is not easy for many people.
For a second offence the phone should be destroyed in front of them.

All data on phones are backed up on the cloud now and you just get a new sim card.

Larger fines, demerits and losing your licence is enough.

[GT450]

Obviously it's not enough as they keep offending!

[Mercury Bullet]

Originally Posted by GasOLane

Test away, there are no entrapment laws in Aus.

Correct.

But remember way back when speed cameras were first introduced and police operated them?

Camera cars were parked up with telecom, water board, sec, etc magnetic logos on them.

That was stopped as it was considered entrapment. More from public and political pressure than any law though.

This was in Melbourne.

[wodahs]

Originally Posted by FG50T

I can type an email and browse the internet on my nav screen in my car and that's not illegal and so much more distracting.

well no you cant
even if you can use you nav screen for them functions
as this is even covered under the Victorian (and other states) mobile phone rules
Navigation devices and GPS units
Hide

A driver’s aid such as a navigation device (including a GPS unit) can be in operation but it must be an integrated part of the vehicle design, or secured in a commercially designed holder, which is fixed to the vehicle. A driver is required to have proper control of a vehicle, the entering of address information in a GPS while a vehicle is moving would be contrary to this rule. Address information should only be entered while a vehicle is pulled over and parked.

it even covers smart watches amongst a wide rang of things

Smartwatches
Smartwatches linked to phones or other devices perform a range of functions. Some of these functions should not be used while driving because they are covered by the road rules that limit using mobile phones or visual display units. Drivers should therefore avoid using Smartwatches while driving.
When a Smartwatch is worn by a driver it should not be used while driving for making or receiving phone calls, navigation, music, text or video messaging, email or social media (e.g. Facebook and Twitter).
Text or video messaging, email, social media use or similar communications should not be undertaken regardless of whether the Smartwatch is worn by the driver or not.
Fully licensed drivers may still use a Smartwatch provided it is not worn, and used as either a:
driver’s aid (for example, as a navigation device)
music player
mobile phone to make or receive phone calls
Smartwatches can also be used if the driver does not touch anything on the Smartwatch (for example, making and receiving calls needs to be hands-free via Bluetooth or similar means), and that it is secured in a commercially designed mounting affixed to the vehicle.

[Guzz226]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I like immediate confiscation of Phone for say 30 days, an immediate control measure.

Could you imagine the melt down...........

Crush the phone on the spot. Instant justice.

[Beastie]

Today's society can't decide what's worse...

Crush the mobile or

Crush the car...

Stats or no stats...leave the mobile alone whilst in control of a car...

[73 4V XB]

Originally Posted by wodahs

well no you cant
even if you can use you nav screen for them functions
as this is even covered under the Victorian (and other states) mobile phone rules
Navigation devices and GPS units
Hide



it even covers smart watches amongst a wide rang of things

But a CB radio is ok
Here’s a linky for NSW.
https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/#.../div1/rule.300

[xxx000]

Originally Posted by 73 4V XB

But a CB radio is ok
Here’s a linky for NSW.
https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/#.../div1/rule.300

That's because CB radio is one way at a time communication

[wodahs]

Originally Posted by 73 4V XB

But a CB radio is ok
Here’s a linky for NSW.
https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/#.../div1/rule.300

yes I know as I had read the info for all states !
and you cant utilize it for any other purpose than as a CB radio
you cant check your email ~ face book , or even stare at it for a prolong period of time whilst trying to remember some ones number whilst inputting it of trying to find the name in you contacts
and sorry that it annoys you that this is the case but I don't write the rules we all have to abide by

and how ever if deemed they can still book you for use of the CB anyways under the dangerous driving law if they feel the need

they don't always make rules because of the "every one" situation but usually coz the DUMB and every one gets affected by the nock on of the rule

[Ben73]

When ever I have to stop I do the rear view mirror check. So often I see people grabbing 'something' as soon as they see a yellow light ahead. The same people continue looking down for a while after they start driving on a green. I bet those people say they only text at red lights because you know "its safe'

Mobile phone addiction is a real thing. Stop obsessing over it and it will be better for your health.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by wodahs

and how ever if deemed they can still book you for use of the CB anyways under the dangerous driving law if they feel the need

Like when you call them out

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

I think people are missing the point

Window washing at the traffic lights is illegal and thus could be tested as a form of entrapment.

But I copped one at a set of lights many moons ago for touching the phone, copped it on the chin don't touch it all now.

Really need to be focussed on driving these days given how distracted other driver are because of phones in the car.

I read another article on this, they weren't actually washing windows according to the Police Inspector at a news conference "...because that is illegal".

[wodahs]

Originally Posted by jaydee

I read another article on this, they weren't actually washing windows according to the Police Inspector at a news conference "...because that is illegal".

soooooo then !
they were loitering

[Trendseeker]

And breaking the rules for pedestrians...

https://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/safe...es/pedestrians

[GO FURTHER]

Originally Posted by Trendseeker

And breaking the rules for pedestrians...

https://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/safe...es/pedestrians

But police officers uniformed or not are allowed to stand in the middle of the road or at traffic lights in the course of duty.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

I have no sympathy for anyone getting caught using a mobile phone whilst driving. And I'm also not that bothered by the means that the police use to catch those who do use their phones. If you're not using your phone, then it makes no difference what technique they use.

This video that I posted a couple of years back should be a wakeup call for anyone who thinks they are ok using a phone whilst driving. Watch some of these people and see how far they travel with their eyes on their phone and not on the road. It is staggering! And remember, they knew they were being filmed....