The problem with Holden sales

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by P6LTD351

I can't understand people that play tight on prices when they are already investing so much on a new car. If you can afford $36990 on a new car, what's another $5000 or $10000? I would never buy a car on price only. That's a lot of money to spend only to be stuck with something that you didn't really want.

That statement seems kinda odd considering your list of cars in your signature.

[apolloxbgt]

Originally Posted by csv8

Captiva Series 1 was Daewoo. Series 2 was the change over from Daewoo to GM and the MY16 is GM platform with Aussie design imput. I bought on price, so do most people,unless they have $$$$ to spare. Comparable SUV's are $10k plus more. Kuga Titanium is $50k and the tech pack is a $1300 option,(should be included in Titanium) whats in the tech pack is standard on the LTZ!!Its value for the money, projector headlights, LED tail lights, 2.2 diesel not the 2.0 diesel, heated leather seats, keyless entry, 8 way electric drivers seat, its a 7 seater, seats fold to flat to the floor, not fold to the side as Toyota, 2cnd row recline.etc etc I know 4 people with either the Series 1 or Series 2 and had no problems. Yes, there can problems with any car. Ford's CVT was an outstanding success !!!! Territory ball joints,I will see if my choice was good or not....and for us ole farts, getting in is easier, just step in, easy on the joints...

The platform has not changed since 2006 when it was released.
They've extensively updated the gadgets and restyled it twice,but make no mistake it is still a deawoo.

What's the saying about lipstick on a pig?

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by csv8

Captiva Series 1 was Daewoo. Series 2 was the change over from Daewoo to GM and the MY16 is GM platform with Aussie design imput. I bought on price, so do most people,unless they have $$$$ to spare.

I think you're one model year too early in claiming it's a GM platform with some Aussie HB pencil involvement..

[au2000]

Originally Posted by Qwerty321

Go out and have a look. How many of the VFs on the roads these days are actually V8s? I know in NZ almost 80% of the commo's I see here are V6s. Plus, V6 Twin Turbo? SIGN ME UP!!!! I've still got high hopes for the Mondeo 2.7TT V6 AWD, I imagine it'll lag slightly behind the Insignia in performance, but if current Mondeo (and ford in general) styling trends are anything to go by, the new Mondeo will be one heck of a looker.

Also to the guy below who said that younger buyers don't idolise the V8 he's 100% bang on. I mean I love V8s, who doesn't, but I never grew up owning one, I grew up in a family with 1.8L or 2L 4 bangers, like literally everyone else this generation. I understand the appeal of a V8 RWD, but tbh AWD is far superior to RWD and most of us have never actually owned a V8, so we can't miss what we never had. Honestly, I do wish I was born in the 50s and grew up in a period where gas was cheap, the economy was great and running a big V8 was very affordable. Today however, I'd prefer to not have fuel expenditure rivalling the annual budget of a small African nation.

in NZ i dont doubt your opinion, however in oz there is a fair take up of V8 SS commodores & that's without local hwy partol unit sales as well.
in my work carpark the majority of commodores as V8's & you have to remember our fuel price here is about $2 cheaper than in NZ.

It still amazes me here how many of the holden fans dont know there will be no v8 or rwd platform come 2017, most have heard the commodore is staying & have focused on the name only.. there will be some very shocked holden fans come 2017.

[P6LTD351]

Originally Posted by nstg8a

That statement seems kinda odd considering your list of cars in your signature.

Can I ask why it seems odd? Is it because I haven't bought a new car? If it is, why does that preclude me from talking about others who do?

[Dr Terry]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

I think you're one model year too early in claiming it's a GM platform with some Aussie HB pencil involvement..

Agreed, the Captiva from 2006 to now has been based on the one platform, with several updates & powertrain changes. However those who call it a 'Daewoo' are wide of the mark.

Daewoo as an independent car maker ceased to be in 2001 when they basically went broke & the remains were purchased by GM & reorganised. A similar fate befell Kia which was taken up by Hyundai around the same time.

Each new platform after that time had progressively less Daewoo DNA. By the time that the Captiva was introduced any Daewoo involvement had long ceased. I believe that the last Daewoo was the Holden Viva

OK, it was now GM Korea using some of the old design staff, but it was GM who controlled things. To my knowledge all the engines & gearboxes were international GM offerings, like Ecotec motors & GM Powertrain (Turbo-Hydro) transmissions. The Diesel engines for example are basically VM Motori, also used by many European car manufacturers. The current petrol V6 is essentially the same SIDI engine as seen in Commodores & is manufacturers in Melbourne. The earlier Captiva's V6 was the Alloytec unit, also built in Melbourne.

Dr Terry

[apolloxbgt]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

Agreed, the Captiva from 2006 to now has been based on the one platform, with several updates & powertrain changes. However those who call it a 'Daewoo' are wide of the mark.

Daewoo as an independent car maker ceased to be in 2001 when they basically went broke & the remains were purchased by GM & reorganised. A similar fate befell Kia which was taken up by Hyundai around the same time.

Each new platform after that time had progressively less Daewoo DNA. By the time that the Captiva was introduced any Daewoo involvement had long ceased. I believe that the last Daewoo was the Holden Viva

OK, it was now GM Korea using some of the old design staff, but it was GM who controlled things. To my knowledge all the engines & gearboxes were international GM offerings, like Ecotec motors & GM Powertrain (Turbo-Hydro) transmissions. The Diesel engines for example are basically VM Motori, also used by many European car manufacturers. The current petrol V6 is essentially the same SIDI engine as seen in Commodores & is manufacturers in Melbourne. The earlier Captiva's V6 was the Alloytec unit, also built in Melbourne.

Dr Terry

From wickipedia:
"The Chevrolet Captiva is a sport utility vehicle (SUV) that was developed by the South Korean manufacturer Daewoo, and has been sold by Chevrolet since 2006."

Deawoo used gm supplied engines all the way through,usually from Australia.
The long and short of how gm came to own them was that deawoo couldn't afford to pay for the engines that holden had been supplying them, so when the poop hit the fan gm were the biggest creditors and took them over rather than just taking a bath on them.

[Mercury Bullet]

Originally Posted by csv8

In 3 weeks driven 1,500kms, average 9.1l/100kms. Holden claim 8.5l/100kms..Impressive!!..No rattles , nothing has failed.

So you live in the bush, drive a diesel and it still can't match let alone beat the manufacturers figures?

My XR8 has done 4,500km, the manufacturer claim is 13.7/100 and I'm getting 10.8/100.

My dealer has a diesel Territory on the floor for $40k, a whole 3 grand more. I know which of those two will last longer and be the better car.

[csv8]

Mercury Bullet..is it a Titanium?? More like a TX or demo TS...Check the Captiva LTZ specs!!! It is value for the $$$$$. Wont have to worry about collapsing ball joints !!!! LOL...

[SumoDog68]

This reflects wider issue in car buying criteria for non enthusiasts . Gadget count is supposed to equal a better car. Yes it does have a camera (which is of a poor quality ) , high number of speakers ,parking sensors , keyless entry without start button but suspension tune is awful , steering horrible and engine is noisy and loves a drink . Captiva is a gadget special that fails on main criteria which is the way it drives , not to mention build quality. . Captiva sells against smaller competitors like CX5 ,X-Trail or RAV4 as a value proposition - it absolutely has no hope against Territory ,Kluger or Sorrento.
It is also probably the most recalled car on the market.
https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/i.../itemId/952863

[brismike]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

A Captiva and an Accent sitting beside each other on your driveway? Dude, I think you're on the wrong forum...

Wonder what you would say about me. We have got a 2014 FPV GT, a 2014 smart car and a 2015 Holden Barina Spark.

The Barina is a pleasure to drive, it has now got 4500 trouble free k's on the clock and we have got free servicing until 2020.

The smart car is my daily and it us just a bag of fun to drive with flappy paddle gear shifts and I get 4.5 litres per 100ks out of it.

The GT is just *********g awesome to drive lol.

Cheers Mike

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by brismike

Wonder what you would say about me. We have got a 2014 FPV GT, a 2014 smart car and a 2015 Holden Barina Spark.

The Barina is a pleasure to drive, it has now got 4500 trouble free k's on the clock and we have got free servicing until 2020.

The smart car is my daily and it us just a bag of fun to drive with flappy paddle gear shifts and I get 4.5 litres per 100ks out of it.

The GT is just *********g awesome to drive lol.

Cheers Mike

Well I'm just a fan of anything even vaugly unique and/or well engineered. The Barina meets neither criteria and is a good example of motoring mediocrity. Your other two cars I would say do meet the criteria on some level and make sense to me as choices an enthusiast would make. A captiva and any Hyundai though? No self respecting enthusiast would ever choose to own such prime examples of automotive banality.

[danzvtil]

I love it when motoring enthusiasts get so bent out of shape when another motorist isn't an enthusiast, and doesn't think about cars the way they think they should. Of course it means the non enthusiast must have questionable morals/sexuality/outlook on life.....

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

I love it when motoring enthusiasts get so bent out of shape when another motorist isn't an enthusiast, and doesn't think about cars the way they think they should. Of course it means the non enthusiast must have questionable morals/sexuality/outlook on life.....

Not sure what you're getting at or if that was a dig at me, but I'll just say feel like I have a pretty good understanding on what the average motorist looks for/needs out of a car. I think the blindingly obvious point to make however, is that average motorists don't usually participate in car-orientated internet forums....

[danzvtil]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

Not sure what you're getting at or if that was a dig at me, but I'll just say feel like I have a pretty good understanding on what the average motorist looks for/needs out of a car. I think the blindingly obvious point to make however, is that average motorists don't usually participate in car-orientated internet forums....

No mate, just a general observation.

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

No mate, just a general observation.

Oh good, I must admit I have made similar observations myself.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by P6LTD351

I can't understand people that play tight on prices when they are already investing so much on a new car. If you can afford $36990 on a new car, what's another $5000 or $10000? I would never buy a car on price only. That's a lot of money to spend only to be stuck with something that you didn't really want.

Agreed. Unfortunately, a lot of people are cheapskates who aren't prepared to pay more for a better product.

[Dr Terry]

Originally Posted by apolloxbgt

From wickipedia:
"The Chevrolet Captiva is a sport utility vehicle (SUV) that was developed by the South Korean manufacturer Daewoo, and has been sold by Chevrolet since 2006."

Typical Wikipedia inaccuracy ! It was Daewoo in name only. Daewoo as a company ceased in 2001 when GM took over.

This means essentially that the line :-

"The Chevrolet Captiva is a sport utility vehicle (SUV) that was developed by the South Korean manufacturer Daewoo" should read :-

"The Chevrolet Captiva is a sport utility vehicle (SUV) that was developed by the South Korean manufacturer GM Korea, formally known as Daewoo.

Put simply the Captiva platform had no connection with the Daewoo of old.

Dr Terry

[csv8]

Sumodog 68..Quote..This reflects wider issue in car buying criteria for non enthusiasts . Gadget count is supposed to equal a better car. Yes it does have a camera (which is of a poor quality ) mine has a sharp image , high number of speakers ,parking sensors , keyless entry without start button but suspension tune is awful(its a SUV !! not a luxo barge) , steering horrible and engine is noisy (the diesel is quiet, yes I know its a diesel but its not intrusive, radio is on volume 7) and loves a drink ( mine is averaging 9.1l/100kms) . Captiva is a gadget special that fails on main criteria which is the way it drives , not to mention build quality. . Captiva sells against smaller competitors like CX5 ,X-Trail or RAV4 as a value proposition - it absolutely has no hope against Territory ,Kluger or Sorrento.My comment : Everyone compares the MY16 Captiva with previous models, its a different vehicle. Go check one out, take it for a drive, you will be suprised, I was..and its great for us oldies to get in and out of.
It is also probably the most recalled car on the market.(JEEP is the most recalled)https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/i.../itemId/952865

[Bossxr8]

You aren't going to win this argument. It's a heap of ****.

Only bought by tightarses and idiots who think it's built in Australia cause Holden mate.

[apolloxbgt]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

Typical Wikipedia inaccuracy ! It was Daewoo in name only. Daewoo as a company ceased in 2001 when GM took over.

This means essentially that the line :-

"The Chevrolet Captiva is a sport utility vehicle (SUV) that was developed by the South Korean manufacturer Daewoo" should read :-

"The Chevrolet Captiva is a sport utility vehicle (SUV) that was developed by the South Korean manufacturer GM Korea, formally known as Daewoo.

Put simply the Captiva platform had no connection with the Daewoo of old.

Dr Terry

So the Korean arm of gm which is called deawoo and is a continuation of the company of the same name designed and engineered captiva's from the ground up, yet they are not a deawoo?
OK.

What do you think the lead time on a brand new body would be ( especially given they'd never built this type of car before), 5 years?
It was displayed in 04,released in 06, gm took over in 01.
Did they sack the entire company the day they took over and restaff them with thier own, or were the same engineers and design staff that oversaw the design of awesome cars like the kalos and nubira still on deck?
I think the reliability record and superb build quality of the captive answers that question.

Development of this lemon was all deawoo, gm themselves came out and said that the cruise was the first fully gm developed car to come out of sth korea.

[Spammy]

Who do you think has done a better job of selling imported product in the past?

Ford had Taurus, Probe, Cougar, Mondeo, Fiesta etc. Holden has had Jackaroo, Captiva, Barina Epica.

Not sure who gets my vote.

[Kieron]

Originally Posted by csv8

Sumodog 68..Quote..This reflects wider issue in car buying criteria for non enthusiasts . Gadget count is supposed to equal a better car. Yes it does have a camera (which is of a poor quality ) mine has a sharp image , high number of speakers ,parking sensors , keyless entry without start button but suspension tune is awful(its a SUV !! not a luxo barge) , steering horrible and engine is noisy (the diesel is quiet, yes I know its a diesel but its not intrusive, radio is on volume 7) and loves a drink ( mine is averaging 9.1l/100kms) . Captiva is a gadget special that fails on main criteria which is the way it drives , not to mention build quality. . Captiva sells against smaller competitors like CX5 ,X-Trail or RAV4 as a value proposition - it absolutely has no hope against Territory ,Kluger or Sorrento.My comment : Everyone compares the MY16 Captiva with previous models, its a different vehicle. Go check one out, take it for a drive, you will be suprised, I was..and its great for us oldies to get in and out of.
It is also probably the most recalled car on the market.(JEEP is the most recalled)https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/i.../itemId/952865

That's a little unfair, your comparing all Jeep models vs a single model Captiva. I have a MY15 Grand Cherokee diesel (Motori sourced like the Captiva) that hasn't had a single recall and it's economy is circa 8.4l/100 which is pretty decent for a big barge.

I'd say, just like the Falcon, the Captiva has been around for many years now and as time goes by, the issues get ironed out and what you have now will easily see you through 5+ years of reliable motoring.

[csv8]

Spammy you forgot Astra, Trax, Colorado 7, Malibu, Viva, Vectra. Cascada,

[jgmdat]

Originally Posted by csv8

Sumodog 68..Quote..This reflects wider issue in car buying criteria for non enthusiasts . Gadget count is supposed to equal a better car. Yes it does have a camera (which is of a poor quality ) mine has a sharp image , high number of speakers ,parking sensors , keyless entry without start button but suspension tune is awful(its a SUV !! not a luxo barge) , steering horrible and engine is noisy (the diesel is quiet, yes I know its a diesel but its not intrusive, radio is on volume 7) and loves a drink ( mine is averaging 9.1l/100kms) . Captiva is a gadget special that fails on main criteria which is the way it drives , not to mention build quality. . Captiva sells against smaller competitors like CX5 ,X-Trail or RAV4 as a value proposition - it absolutely has no hope against Territory ,Kluger or Sorrento.My comment : Everyone compares the MY16 Captiva with previous models, its a different vehicle. Go check one out, take it for a drive, you will be suprised, I was..and its great for us oldies to get in and out of.
It is also probably the most recalled car on the market.(JEEP is the most recalled)https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/i.../itemId/952865

Any chance you could take that truck and caravan in your avatar and head out somewhere with no internet and give us all a break for a while.

[Magee]

I have to throw my support behind CVS8 here. Whilst I consider myself a Ford man and my last 3 new cars have been Fords, AU Futra, BA XR6 and FG2 G6E we did buy for my wife a new Holden Captiva in 2008. I was against it but my wife loved it. It was good value for money and my thinking was wife is happy and since it is new with 3 warranty, Holden will have to fix any problems that come up. We sold it in 2014 after 60,00O trouble free Km. We enjoyed our Captiva and I sometimes actually miss it. But to avoid any life time ban on this Forum I promise not to buy another one.