New P plate laws....

[wheels260]

But couldn't the same be said when your referring to those passengers driving around instead of being in the same car? Because if those passengers in the car would be egging the person on behind the wheel what would they be doing in there own car?

[XCSEDAN]

Originally Posted by XR6_661

Are taxis not public transport?

try catching a taxi from my joint you will be waiting for 5 hours and they still wont show EVEN IF you have booked them.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by wheels260

But couldn't the same be said when your referring to those passengers driving around instead of being in the same car? Because if those passengers in the car would be egging the person on behind the wheel what would they be doing in there own car?

You're assuming 2 things: teenages a) behave the same way when in groups as when they're by themselves (peer group pressure) and b) they'd drive while intoxicated....

[Auslandau]

Sticking up for P platers this time! Knee jerk reaction once again because it sounds like a good thing rather than it really is.

Your 1 mate in the seat next to you can be just as good at being the peer pressure as a group in the back!

Having your mates following, 2 in each car can be great fun for sure! Yeah no peer pressure there!

Rules that look good but are yet to be proven.

Originally Posted by 4v Man

Again no.. you're assuming every P Plater is an idiot behind the wheel arent you? or every P Plater is only interested in racing around at night..
Drunk or boisterous passengers in a car driven by an inexperienced driver is a recipe for disaster.

Of course its a problem but even One drunk passenger is also a major problem so if this law works, as those in power MUST say it does, take it to the extreme where no passengers are aloud.



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[Buddy 1]

Great Rule as it will stop cars full of teenagers getting killed in one accident.

And while they are at it raise the age a person can start to drive to 18 because 16 is just way to young (still kids).

And no you younger members will not understand until you are older though even some older people never really Mature :

[daniel_rossy]

Originally Posted by auslandau

Sticking up for P platers this time! Knee jerk reaction once again because it sounds like a good thing rather than it really is.

Your 1 mate in the seat next to you can be just as good at being the peer pressure as a group in the back!

Having your mates following, 2 in each car can be great fun for sure! Yeah no peer pressure there!

Rules that look good but are yet to be proven.



Of course its a problem but even One drunk passenger is also a major problem so if this law works, as those in power MUST say it does, take it to the extreme where no passengers are aloud.

It would be a hard call for the government to make, but at the end of the day it is about saving lives. I know the whole designated driver rule has basically been thrown out the window here, kids are going to start drinking and driving in retrospect, The question is would people rather see a car load of hoons or 4 cars with drunk drivers.......

[XCSEDAN]

Originally Posted by Buddy 1

Great Rule as it will stop cars full of teenagers getting killed in one accident.

And while they are at it raise the age a person can start to drive to 18 because 16 is just way to young (still kids).

And no you younger members will not understand until you are older though even some older people never really Mature :

you are kidding right??? you really think its a good idea to possibly tripple number of p-platers on the road???

maybe i should finish off what i started when i was coming up for ideas for P-plater license stages????

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by daniel_rossy

It would be a hard call for the government to make, but at the end of the day it is about saving lives. I know the whole designated driver rule has basically been thrown out the window here, kids are going to start drinking and driving in retrospect, The question is would people rather see a car load of hoons or 4 cars with drunk drivers.......

That's a stupid scenario..... Who here would seriously drink drive over catching a cab? :
Spliting a cab fare 4 ways would probably come out about the same as 4 lots of petrol/running costs for the night....

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by XCSEDAN

you are kidding right??? you really think its a good idea to possibly tripple number of p-platers on the road???

Are you calling for P Plate driver curfews as well??????

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by daniel_rossy

It would be a hard call for the government to make, but at the end of the day it is about saving lives. I know the whole designated driver rule has basically been thrown out the window here, kids are going to start drinking and driving in retrospect, The question is would people rather see a car load of hoons or 4 cars with drunk drivers.......

NO! Its an the absolutley easy way out for the g'ment. The easiest simplest way to show that they care and are doing something about it. Does not matter if its right or wrong or will save 1 life. The g'ments response is "Phew, fixed that little problem!" It just sounds bloody good!

So you are saying that 2 cars with 2 drunk drivers is better than 1 with 4? Are you saying that 4 21 year old drunk drivers in a car doesnt happen?



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[XCSEDAN]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Are you calling for P Plate driver curfews as well??????

no, i'm calling for a propper plan of action that works, and shows some actual god damn effort been put in.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by XCSEDAN

no, i'm calling for a propper plan of action that works, and shows some actual god damn effort been put in.

Effort? what are you suggesting? How do you know what effort goes into these ideas? Everyone grizzles, complains and criticises but nobody seems to come up with any half decent or intelligent suggestions other than the even more useless "more driver training" line that gets thrown about every now and then without any obvious thought..
"More driver training" is probably the weakest suggestion ive heard... there's mountains of driver ed courses avaliable to all of us all the time... The problem is not driver training, its really come down to putting in laws to protect the innocent (and stupid) from the stupid...
In effect removing as much opportunity to stuff up as possible...

[dom_105]

Was totally against this idea, but if some sort of restriction was to be put in place then this would be the one to do.

Hopefully, it dosen't cause more problems than it fixes, with more inexperienced P-platers on the road at night. I guess we will soon find out.

Looks like I got my license just in time, I get off my P's on September 30.

[blk_frmnt]

It's laws like this that make me unfurl my australian flag and start belting out the national anthem, I just love living in a free country.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Effort? what are you suggesting? How do you know what effort goes into these ideas? Everyone grizzles, complains and criticises but nobody seems to come up with any half decent or intelligent suggestions other than the even more useless "more driver training" line that gets thrown about every now and then without any obvious thought.....

Are you saying this is well thought out though? Would have taken a whole 10 minutes to come up with it really.

Originally Posted by 4Vman

"More driver training" is probably the weakest suggestion ive heard... there's mountains of driver ed courses avaliable to all of us all the time... The problem is not driver training, its really come down to putting in laws to protect the innocent (and stupid) from the stupid...
In effect removing as much opportunity to stuff up as possible...

Nothing wrong with pushing this barrow though. Yep heaps of courses around but voluntary. Yes it would cost the g'ment $$$ which would horrify them to bits. It is ALL about driver responsibility and training which is hard to teach and is to do with experience but proper training helps more than this. Laws against stupidity dont work. Stupid people break laws. No stupid people ....... no laws required. Nothing, even all the laws in the land stop stupid people! Officer: "Why did you break the law son?" Answer: "Because I was stupid."



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[daniel_rossy]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

That's a stupid scenario..... Who here would seriously drink drive over catching a cab? :
Spliting a cab fare 4 ways would probably come out about the same as 4 lots of petrol/running costs for the night....

Well where i come from there arent cabs that run 24 hours or the ability to catch public transport.

[daniel_rossy]

Originally Posted by auslandau

NO! Its an the absolutley easy way out for the g'ment. The easiest simplest way to show that they care and are doing something about it. Does not matter if its right or wrong or will save 1 life. The g'ments response is "Phew, fixed that little problem!" It just sounds bloody good!

So you are saying that 2 cars with 2 drunk drivers is better than 1 with 4? Are you saying that 4 21 year old drunk drivers in a car doesnt happen?

No im saying that
Two Cars= 1(passenger)+1(Driver) Who both ocupants have been drinking
or
One Car=4(Passengers)+1(Driver) where 1 is sober and the rest are drunk.
Which one would you rather drive past?
Personally i would prefer the 2nd option.

And no, its not just 'Phew i have fixed that little problem', It is a big issue that had to be addressed and the government saw that this was the best option to reduce the road tole and they dont take the easy way out on saving lives. So what, some young 18 year olds may kick up a fuss, but at the end of the day its about saving lives and making sure that kids come home at night. The government isnt just doing this so we get angry and all worked up so they can have a laugh, i have to agree its not the best aproach, but it is only for one year and personally i would prefer to see my mates with one passenger than to see a carload of mates get killed for hooning and showing off.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by auslandau

Are you saying this is well thought out though? Would have taken a whole 10 minutes to come up with it really.



Nothing wrong with pushing this barrow though. Yep heaps of courses around but voluntary. Yes it would cost the g'ment $$$ which would horrify them to bits. It is ALL about driver responsibility and training which is hard to teach and is to do with experience but proper training helps more than this. Laws against stupidity dont work. Stupid people break laws. No stupid people ....... no laws required. Nothing, even all the laws in the land stop stupid people! Officer: "Why did you break the law son?" Answer: "Because I was stupid."

Im not saying its the best idea, but im not going to critisise without knowing all the facts either.

I agree there's nothing wrong with pushing the awareness of driver training, but lets face it, you can teach them all the skills in the world but if they push the envelope too far it won't mean squat... and you're right, stupid people will do stupid things regardless of how well they're trained.
Lets be honest here, with the exception of being an innocent 3rd party victim how many young people that die on our roads were obeying the road rules, speed limits or just common sense? my guess is very few if any... cars don't just run off the road into stationary objects for no reason.

[jcxr]

My 2 bobs worth, lower age of start of " L" s , Increase legal drinking age to 20, this gives larger span of hopefully alcohol free driving. The passenger limitation has some merit, but cant see it working. Restricts the 18 year old that may have to p/u siblings from school etc. As a driver of 44 years on the road Ive seen a lot of what if scenarios by numerous governments that have failed, and this will also be in that same catagory. Licence gradings should increase when advanced driving courses have been under taken, and insurance premiums graded on the same criteria. It would be a win win situation for all parties.

[Buddy 1]

Originally Posted by XCSEDAN

no, i'm calling for a propper plan of action that works, and shows some actual god damn effort been put in.

I already told you what would help or work as you put it, move the age for getting L Plates to 18 as below that most young people are to Immature & I will add the Age to be able to Drink or enter licensed premises should be 21 as it is in America, I mean what is the use of the Milestone age of 21 anymore anyway as you can already do everything lol

Yes I am looking at this from an older person perspective & also as the Father of a 17 yo & yes I would have hated the Law changes I am suggesting when I was 17 etc however as you get older you see things more clearly & realise letting 16 year olds drive vehicles is just wrong.

Of course you younger people will say all sorts of things including well I need transport to get to school or work, well what did you do when you were 15 or 14 to get around & not all people even at 25 or older have a drivers license (a friend of my Wifes is an example) as he lived in Sydney & just did not need one.

In the Country use your Parents or friends Parents or Buses as you did before you could drive lol

As for the 1 passenger rule it should be only 1 passenger no matter what age of passenger until you are off P's however 1 Passenger can rev you up to do silly things just as easy as 4 though if you do crash are only 2 bodies instead of 5.

[sleekism]

Originally Posted by auslandau

Sticking up for P platers this time! Knee jerk reaction once again because it sounds like a good thing rather than it really is.

Your 1 mate in the seat next to you can be just as good at being the peer pressure as a group in the back!

Having your mates following, 2 in each car can be great fun for sure! Yeah no peer pressure there!

Rules that look good but are yet to be proven.



Of course its a problem but even One drunk passenger is also a major problem so if this law works, as those in power MUST say it does, take it to the extreme where no passengers are aloud.

Completely agree.

I have only done stupid stuff when there is a couple of other p plater cars around. Couple of mates with Commos and Falcons and you are asking for trouble.

When I'm deso I'm not doing anything stupid because I'm too busy trying to get home and crack a beer myself. Not to mention it's pretty hard to rip a good burnout with three big fat mates in the back.

I was watching Sunrise this morning and some Vicroads bloke reckoned it would save 100 lives a year. What a load of crock!! He also said it would reduce the road toll by approximately 3%.

"Statistics are often simply made up, 27% of people know that!"

[vanman_75]

raise learner age would be going backwards , earlier would be better we need a combination of all the ideas more training, more parental guidence and responsibility . i think in general kids are let run wild . with no responsibility and noone to stop them. it is getting worse and i dont think any laws will change the growing bad trends.

[GORDZ]

i reckon the p plate passenger law is a joke. all i can see coming from this is people not displaying p plates and getting fined for it. doesn't worry me, but what about the younger people trying to be responsible and being the designated driver? these laws might look better if we had some public transport infrastructure that actually worked, but this is silly.

[Professor Farnsworth]

look in all seriousness, we're all bound by certain laws... in the end, what is whinging about it going to do ? it's a LAW now, there's not much getting out of it. Just wear it for 12 months, and then it's gone. Not a huge deal.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by mrcrackers

look in all seriousness, we're all bound by certain laws... in the end, what is whinging about it going to do ? it's a LAW now, there's not much getting out of it. Just wear it for 12 months, and then it's gone. Not a huge deal.

Whinging will do nothing but at least places like is an out let for peoples opinions that otherwise have no where else to voice. It is just something that gets my back up immensly. Its the way g'ments and councils make laws ONLY to make themselves look like they are doing the right thing when in fact they are not getting to guts of the issues.

There are so many rules and regulations being introduced at the moment that are just so hit and miss with no thought. It is just a band aid solution that looks good on the surface and the majority just go along blindly saying "Oh that wil fix it!". If it drops accidents and fatalities by less than 1% it will be well worth it and I just hope it has an impact ......



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[daniel_rossy]

Originally Posted by jcxr

My 2 bobs worth, lower age of start of " L" s , Increase legal drinking age to 20, this gives larger span of hopefully alcohol free driving. The passenger limitation has some merit, but cant see it working. Restricts the 18 year old that may have to p/u siblings from school etc. As a driver of 44 years on the road Ive seen a lot of what if scenarios by numerous governments that have failed, and this will also be in that same catagory. Licence gradings should increase when advanced driving courses have been under taken, and insurance premiums graded on the same criteria. It would be a win win situation for all parties.

Yes i agree your point. This is why in SA you can get your P's when your 16 and a half (correct me if im wrong), and legally allowed to drink at 18, because getting both these things at once is asking for trouble.

[Dezza]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

NO.... put more inexperienced drivers in positions where that can concentrate on driving without peer group pressure or distractions.
Limiting or reducing the time young drivers spend driving is counter productive to them gaining experience isnt it???? and totaly at ods with the message the govt is trying to get accross about gaining experience (in a safe and responsible manner) on the roads.

I'm still against it. Some might show off more with mates in the car, and crash, but that's a very small figure. I did crash on my p-plates. Was it peer pressure, or showing off? No, it was inexperience and carelessness. Why I'm against it, I used to always help my parents out by driving my sisters and brother around for them. It just wouldn't work with a passenger limit of one. While I'm now past that stage (23, and living away from home), I reckon the law is ridiculous.

[daniel_rossy]

Originally Posted by sleekism

Completely agree.

I have only done stupid stuff when there is a couple of other p plater cars around. Couple of mates with Commos and Falcons and you are asking for trouble.

When I'm deso I'm not doing anything stupid because I'm too busy trying to get home and crack a beer myself. Not to mention it's pretty hard to rip a good burnout with three big fat mates in the back.

I was watching Sunrise this morning and some Vicroads bloke reckoned it would save 100 lives a year. What a load of crock!! He also said it would reduce the road toll by approximately 3%.

"Statistics are often simply made up, 27% of people know that!"

haha, so true, like on chasers how they showed a reply video of Today tonight, they said too many teens were using illegal drugs, and at the end it said that 47% of youths are drug dealers. :hihi: