Downgrading the V8 :(

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

I never realised the ST's were so expensive, i understand they are a hot hatch but $38,000 is a lot of money when you can get a brand new FG turbo for $33,000 now

ST is a better equipped car though.

[Grobbo]

Originally Posted by Professor Farnsworth

they're a different type of fun for sure, but i find they have to be manual to do that - our Rio is no sports hatch but it does 0-100 in 8.8 which for a N/A 1.6 is pretty damn good. It's a 6 speed manual and a lot of fun to throw around. In auto i just find them a bit laborious and boring. Add a turbo and that gets better but i still want a manual in a small car. Having said that, jump in my AU and i absolutely love just trundling around at low suburban speeds or highway speed and just laying back enjoying the ambience. The XRT on the other hand is a rip snorter which is always fun but at the same time is very well mannered and comfortable on the highway too.

which ever way you choose, it's all good.

Yeah there doesn't seem to be any fun auto hot hatches really, I've driven the latest Clio RS and didn't find it that much fun at all really.

A manual Swift Sport was heaps more fun.

I think there will be some fun little auto hot hatches coming out soon tho - the way things are going with dual clutchers and whatnot.

[Professor Farnsworth]

Originally Posted by fordomatic

I never realised the ST's were so expensive, i understand they are a hot hatch but $38,000 is a lot of money when you can get a brand new FG turbo for $33,000 now

show me an invoice where anyone gets a new FG2 Turbo for 33K driveaway lol - Mine was optioned up, auto, leather, full size spare, metallic paint, tank of fuel, free 15k service, 5 year warranty etc and i got it really cheap with some heavy bargaining but it certainly wasn't 33 driveaway.

Originally Posted by Grobbo

Yeah there doesn't seem to be any fun auto hot hatches really

i found the Polo GTi fun with its 7 speed DSG - was a bit rough with that transmission to be honest, when starting off etc but the car as a whole was a hoot - but i can't think of many others. Veloster Turbo is ok to drive but i barely fit in it and i'm only 5ft11 and it's a bit too wide in my opinion

[Grobbo]

I'd be very surprised if you're still considering the ecko sport after having driven both. It is kinda fun with that little 1 litre triple, but the ST is in a different ball park.

[Grobbo]

Originally Posted by Professor Farnsworth

show me an invoice where anyone gets a new FG2 Turbo for 33K driveaway lol - Mine was optioned up, auto, leather, full size spare, metallic paint, tank of fuel, free 15k service, 5 year warranty etc and i got it really cheap with some heavy bargaining but it certainly wasn't 33 driveaway.



i found the Polo GTi fun with its 7 speed DSG - was a bit rough with that transmission to be honest, when starting off etc but the car as a whole was a hoot - but i can't think of many others

Maybe he was looking at non turbo prices - $33,990 driveaway in Manual atm...

Even a pov pack 13 plated manual turbo is $38,490, I don't think any dealer would need to rip up thousands and thousands to get rid of one.

Oh yeah I forgot about the Polo. Haven't really caned one properly but I'd be a little worried about the DSG sh*tting itself if I owned one.

With any hot hatch tho I always find myself missing RWD... :-)

[Smoke Pursuit]

Low km XT Ecoboost... Put some big wheels, lower it, G6 tail lights and woolaaaaaaah.

Quick car with great economy and room! Just dont get white.

[jpblue1000]

have a look here for real world cost of car ownership for new cars purchased on credit.

http://www.racq.com.au/motoring/cars...ing_costs_2013

Example Fietsa 1.6 47.91 cents per Km vs falcon 4.0 6 speed 88.16 cents per Km.
takes into account purchase price interest, running costs and insurances etc all explained in the document.

average 400 Km per week makes a very substantial saving per week in the smaller car!

JP

[SensationFG8]

The RACQ fact thing doesn't take into account when you crack the sads with the small car and have to upgrade again.

I went from an XR6T to an Astra to save money for a house, the astra lasted about 2 years before I had to get the XR8.

[MickyB]

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

The RACQ fact thing doesn't take into account when you crack the sads with the small car and have to upgrade again.

I went from an XR6T to an Astra to save money for a house, the astra lasted about 2 years before I had to get the XR8.

This is exactly why I think there needs to be more than the running cost argument to make a decision like this. If I traded my XR6T on a bog stock auto Fiesta then I'm sure I would be hating it, the key is to trade to something you actually enjoy driving.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by Professor Farnsworth

If you're a real v8 lover, you'll become sad very quickly if you sell your v8 for a 4 banger. Yeah you'll save fuel but big whoop. Also that AU doing 18L/100 on the highway lol, mine does 10.

In Queensland, rego slaps you hard too, not to mention insurance.

The days of "V8s are the only way to go" are long long gone. The only people who are sad about losing a V8 are usually those who get off solely on an exhaust note alone, and who don't know the benefits of a smaller lighter car with a well sorted chassis and adequate (or, with todays hot hatch fours, usually more than adequate) power delivery.

[xisled]

With the situation you are in, you may think you will be better off but IMO you won't be.

You have 2 years left on your current car, you want to jump into a 7 year contract. Maybe in the short time you will be worse off, but after 2 more years the loan will be gone and your running costs will be lower than a new loan. Lock yourself in for 7 more years and you will be paying off your car until 2021.

Pay off the XR8, once paid off save the loan repayments you would be paying on a new car for 5 years and you will have a nice amount in the bank, and you will be way out in front.

[SumoDog68]

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

The RACQ fact thing doesn't take into account when you crack the sads with the small car and have to upgrade again.

I went from an XR6T to an Astra to save money for a house, the astra lasted about 2 years before I had to get the XR8.

Yeah those V4 Astras are no fun :-)

[Professor Farnsworth]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

The days of "V8s are the only way to go" are long long gone. The only people who are sad about losing a V8 are usually those who get off solely on an exhaust note alone, and who don't know the benefits of a smaller lighter car with a well sorted chassis and adequate (or, with todays hot hatch fours, usually more than adequate) power delivery.

Well I don't fit into your generalisation. I have our Rio for that reason, it has good economy and handles like a go kart. I have the AU for ambience and a beautiful cruiser and I have the XRT for hoots. What does that make me, aside from broke?

[LeadFoot81]

Originally Posted by fobzee

The only other thing - I loved the way the ST drives. But the interior is a bit average, and its a bit of a girls car. My mates/gf would give me such a hard time lol

Do you pick a car based on what other people think, or on what you think? Pick the car that's right for you, not for them.

A lot of people would consider a Falcon XR8 a car for bogans, or a tarted up taxi. Would that make you want to sell yours?

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

The RACQ fact thing doesn't take into account when you crack the sads with the small car and have to upgrade again.

I went from an XR6T to an Astra to save money for a house, the astra lasted about 2 years before I had to get the XR8.

True that.
Over 4 years ago I bought a 4 cylinder small SUV because I thought it would be pretty cheap to run and still reasonably practical, especially for folding down the back seats and throwing my bike in the back.
I had it for 1.5 years but I wanted a new car after 6 months.
It was fine, but it just wasn't very fun.
Traded it for a V8 sedan, even though it was less practical for bikes.


Never really regretted buying the V8, but I regret buying the softroader.
Even thought the V8 was an early model 300c and therefore a expensive, unreliable, POS.

I do miss having a V8, but no where near as much as I thought I would.
I'd love to get another V8 one day, but probably not as a daily drive. Got paying over $100 for 350kms.

I'd say only trade in for a small 4 banger if you really want one. Not just because fuel will be a little cheaper.
No point spending money on one if you will hate it and want to sell it in a year or 2.

[Jack91]

In the real world, are smaller cars really THAT much better on fuel? I'm a leadfoot, so bigger more powerful cars suit my driving style better. I wonder how you will go expecting the small car to cut in traffic or merge into a freeway like the XR8 does, I'd be surprised if they still do the 0.0000000001 litres per km that the TV says. I doubt it. But I agree with rego and insurance.

[JC]

No point me commenting- I currently own 3 x V8s, and love each of them, with my favourite being the GTE. I had tried Ford 6s, even a Mitsu 380, and the thing I've come to realise is that I am prepared to pay to have the V8......

There's no way i could've afforded a new GTE, not even a new GS, but a great deal on a 2.5 year old GTE was there for the waiting and I couldn't be happier (I think a new one would cause me feelings of guilt.....).

So, having said that, have you tried a 2 year old Kuga? Smallish, practical, soft roadish and at 2 years old will still have some warranty, but will already have copped the largest part of the depreciation - no pint spending $40k when $20k will do the same job.

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by SgtBourne

That'd be the focus ST, not the Fiesta ST.

woops didn't realise that mate, i also meant 38 for the xr6t brand new not 33. i have done some research tonight on the ST as im looking to offload the XR6T and get back into a V8. I need to get the MRS a car she is happy with as the T is her daily right now. The ST sure did well on the reviews and it seems to have a lot better tech than the falcon as well. Will go and have a look at one this weekend.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

In Queensland, rego slaps you hard too, not to mention insurance.

The days of "V8s are the only way to go" are long long gone. The only people who are sad about losing a V8 are usually those who get off solely on an exhaust note alone, and who don't know the benefits of a smaller lighter car with a well sorted chassis and adequate (or, with todays hot hatch fours, usually more than adequate) power delivery.

you have a V8 because you want a V8

dont have hipster beard and put poofy products in your hair

[XR Martin]

I dont get how you are better off selling an older V8 that has mostly finished depreciating to buy a brand new car that will lose 40% of its value it 3 years.
Fiesta ST will cost you $12k in depreciation. (redbook valuation at 60% after three years)

I dont know what your V8 averages in consumption, but lets say worse case is 15l/100km. Thats about 23c/km.
A Fiesta ST worse case maybe 8L/100km? Or 12.3c/km

Over a year (20,000km?), the XR8 will cost $4600 to fuel up, the Fiesta $2500.

But the Fiesta has lost over $4000 in that year in value, the Falcon maybe $1000?

So the Falcon is $1000 ahead so far.

Are you borrowing money for the Fiesta? Also think about the greater amount of interest you will be paying.

Dunno how much extra V8 rego is, but lets say $500?

I imagine insurance would be similar?

Servicing? Falcon should be cheaper as its not under warranty so you can do it yourself.


How exactly are you better off with a new car again?

[EB#]

As mentioned by a few others, I would tend to agree that a brand new car (of any sort) under finance is not really a 'money saver' at all. A 'modified' brand new car with a voided factory warranty will depreciate even faster.

I would suggest to the OP that if the priority is to save money, then an option would be to off-load the V8 and get out of the finance cycle altogether if possible. An older stock standard Falcon (worth say $4-6k?) , owned outright, would be a cheaper proposition than a brand newy. Maintenance costs on an older car?.... still way cheaper than a brand new one's interest and depreciation I would say. Certainly not as snazzy as a new ST (yes, that would be a lot of fun!), but it would save you money.

[LeadFoot81]

Originally Posted by DAVO_XR

In the real world, are smaller cars really THAT much better on fuel? I'm a leadfoot, so bigger more powerful cars suit my driving style better. I wonder how you will go expecting the small car to cut in traffic or merge into a freeway like the XR8 does, I'd be surprised if they still do the 0.0000000001 litres per km that the TV says. I doubt it. But I agree with rego and insurance.

Mate, I've actually done what the OP is considering, and gone from an XR8 to a Fiesta ST and the small car DOES cut in traffic and merge onto the freeway like the XR8 does and STILL uses half the fuel.

Forget the 'Buzz boxes are slow' thing, those days are long gone.

[CyberWasp]

Money and common sense go out the window sometimes when it comes to cars.
Like all of the people here on the forum, over the years we have all had a string of nice cars that we have owned and have sold to move on to other cars. Years later you think damn, i wish I had that car back and you regret the fact that you sold it.
This makes no sense but if you can afford to keep the XR8, Polish and clean her up, and keep her for a weekend cruiser and buy the ST for a daily driver. I guess the main thing is if you have a garage or shed to keep it in.
Like I say it makes no sense. It is the most expensive way. But in a few years you will miss the XR8 and long for it back, and you will never find one in the condition of the one you have now. You only live once and how do you put a price on happiness.

[SensationFG8]

Originally Posted by LeadFoot81

Mate, I've actually done what the OP is considering, and gone from an XR8 to a Fiesta ST and the small car DOES cut in traffic and merge onto the freeway like the XR8 does and STILL uses half the fuel.

Forget the 'Buzz boxes are slow' thing, those days are long gone.

Yep I've done it too and hated the buzz box. Probably doesn't help I dislike fwd and the look of the hatches. If you regret the downgrade it will cost you more than keeping the 8.

Clearly some people love the zippy little fwd hatches and some don't, you need to work out what sort of person you are.

Bear in mind too the more powerful hatches will chew a fair amount of fuel too, especially with spirited driving.

[Grobbo]

I had a Swift Sport for a while and man that thing used to put a smile on my face. I love RWD more than anything but a decent hot hatch can still be epic fun - especially when you can move the tail around a bit. The ST is WAY better than the Swift Sport too.

However, hot hatches really do encourage you to cane it everywhere - they're actually more of a hoon car than a V8. At least in a V8 you can sit back and cruise a bit and still enjoy the ride...

One thing I will say in favour of the Fiesta tho - it's small enough to chuck around and have some fun at sane speeds, once the FWD hatches get a bit bigger - ie Renault Megane 265, Focus ST, Astra OPC et al... You really have to be flying through the hills or on a deserted back road to really enjoy them. At anything below 60 km/h they just have too much grunt for the front wheels...

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

ST is a better equipped car though.

Agreed there 100% Shame falcons never got any of the stuff that imported Fords got

[XtRmn8]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Low km XT Ecoboost... Put some big wheels, lower it, G6 tail lights and woolaaaaaaah.

Quick car with great economy and room! Just dont get white.

I agree with the above.

If downgrading to save on fuel, insurance, rego and/or to get out of a bad loan than a 4cly Falcon is a good option IMO. Most people don't realise how dirt cheap EcoBoost Falcons can be had for.

How about $15990 for 2012 XT with 39000kms? http://www.carsales.com.au/dealer/de.../?Cr=0&sdmvc=1

Or maybe splash out an extra $2k and get a G6 EcoBoost.

[LeadFoot81]

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Yep I've done it too and hated the buzz box. Probably doesn't help I dislike fwd and the look of the hatches. If you regret the downgrade it will cost you more than keeping the 8.

Clearly some people love the zippy little fwd hatches and some don't, you need to work out what sort of person you are.

Bear in mind too the more powerful hatches will chew a fair amount of fuel too, especially with spirited driving.

So you don't like FWD or the look of hatches AND you bought an ASTRA?

At least you came to your senses and got rid of it!

Agree with your other points though.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by LeadFoot81

Mate, I've actually done what the OP is considering, and gone from an XR8 to a Fiesta ST and the small car DOES cut in traffic and merge onto the freeway like the XR8 does and STILL uses half the fuel.
My old man did the same, went from BF2 XR8 to a Focus ST. He loves it, he's not tech savvy but he loves how the ST drives (far quicker and better handling than the XR8). Best for him over the long term he is saving in terms of fuel, used to be around 16l/100km average for the Falcon now in the Focus he is doing 8.2 l/100km.

Forget the 'Buzz boxes are slow' thing, those days are long gone.

I too did the same thing.
Went from a XR8 to Focus XR5T. Best decision i ever made.
More fun, saved a ton in fuel costs, insurance and general maintenance too. Over the long term I have saved a lot more.

Funny how people talk of initial costs with new cars, depreciation, etc. Did many of these people consider that when they changed over their V8s and other Falcons within 3 years?
When are you supposed to buy a new car? You never make money out of a car but there comes a time when the current one is just costing more to run than it is worth.

To the OP, don't listen to what others have to say. Go, do your sums, drive the cars you want if it all adds up then go for it. Let us know how you go.
Goodluck.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Bear in mind too the more powerful hatches will chew a fair amount of fuel too, especially with spirited driving.

Haha, not even close to the truth.