Special order better ride height Falcon?

[stang65]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Should buy a 2011 Grand Cherokee.
They have adjustable air suspension, have many great standard features and are as cheap as a Falcon.
The previous diesel and V8 petrol could tow 3500Kgs as well. So I don't see that getting any worse with the 2011 model.

Your Joking, you work for Jeep do you?
Off topic don`t you think.

[JC]

Originally Posted by FalconBrian

Thankyou all for your sugestions and help.


Yes my dealer suggested a Territory but he said that the Falcon will have better highway mileage as it has more gears in the auto. He did not mention a diesel but it is a very small petrol station dealership so they probably pull the wool over him. He also talked about the Rangers and second hand Pajero he has in the back.

But we are set on a car and not a 4wd though so I will ask about the XT springs in a G6E. One of the Ag reps out here once told me his dad can do a country pack suspension on a calais which is popular out here. But I am sure the Falcon is the go, three years ago when I visited Sydney all the taxis in the city are Falcons like when I was younger, so I know it wont stuff me around on the road.

The Territory is not a 4WD like your toyota utes were. It is pretty much a Falcon on steroids - it has similar steering and feel as a falcon, but is higher up, both in terms of seating position, and ground clearance (and roo strike height for that matter). the Territory is the most car like SUV on the market - others don't come close. If you drove a G6E and then a territory ghia, you would see the similarities, and apart from a difference in height, I don't think you'd find a lot of difference in the way they drive. And the AWD variant gets the same 6 speed the G6E would get; the 4 speed in the RWD is still pretty good, and is basically the more tried and tested gearbox of the 2 anyway.

Fuel usage in a Territory can be high, but towing a van you should get under 20l/100km (or roughly 400km to a tank), but I wouldn't expect much better than that from a G6E or an XT either.

Good luck with your quest, your trip and retirement!

[EgoFG]

I believe that the G6E is considered "Sport Luxury".
The G6 is Luxury (but not quite as luxury as the G6E)

The G6 will have a higher ride height. - if resale is not a big issue, then a G6 optioned up with all the Luxury improvements you can get might be a better option for you.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by EgoFG

I believe that the G6E is considered "Sport Luxury".
The G6 is Luxury (but not quite as luxury as the G6E)

The G6 will have a higher ride height. - if resale is not a big issue, then a G6 optioned up with all the Luxury improvements you can get might be a better option for you.

I get rental Falcon G6 often and they are way too low to the ground as it is, I dont think the G6E could be any lower?

Im suprised they dont make the XT suspension standard on the G6 and G6E, as these would appeal to older people or people who would tow. I mean whats the point of having the XR range if your just going to slap sports suspension on the luxury models. Low sales of G6 and G6E shows this strategy doesnt work.

Likewise I think the R6 ute should have the stock suspension height and optional column shift, for private buyers who want a ute as practical as the base ute but with alloys, coloured coded bumpers etc. The R6 ute which comes with lowered sports suspension is pointless as people will just buy the XR6 ute.

Seriously I think Falcon product planners simply dont think things through or they are 15 years old.

[Peter B - CV8]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Should buy a 2011 Grand Cherokee.
They have adjustable air suspension, have many great standard features and are as cheap as a Falcon.
The previous diesel and V8 petrol could tow 3500Kgs as well. So I don't see that getting any worse with the 2011 model.

The OP sounds like he's in a fairly remote part of the world. Don't know that having a Jeep would be such a good idea (servicing/breakdown/parts etc). His local garage seems to also be a Ford dealer - so he isn't exactly deluged with choices.........

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Brazen

The R6 ute which comes with lowered sports suspension is pointless as people will just buy the XR6 ute.

Actually you can buy the R6 Cab chassis that has one ton setup.

[fairBA]

Originally Posted by FalconBrian

Hello, my granddaughter is helping me write this.

drag its guts on a two-cent coin.

I

What's a two-cent coin?



.

[Sox]

Originally Posted by FalconBrian

Hello, my granddaughter is helping me write this.

I am hoping one of you can help me with a special order. I am wanting to buy a white Falcon G6E with heavy duty tow pack. But I have had a look at a new Falcon in the yard and it looks like it will drag its guts on a two-cent coin.

Is there someone at Ford I can speak to about getting higher suspension. My mate is a Ford dealer out here in a very small country town and he thinks that I will have to go aftermarket. But I dont want a brand new car to be fiddled with ideally. If anyone knows someone to talk to on the phone that would be appreciated.

He says all the old blokes like me get scared off from how low they are which is a shame as I had an XF in the 80s and it was a ripper car. He said Ford sometimes do special orders but he didnt sound sure of what to do.

also is it normal for new Falcons to be so low? or is it an option like a S pack?

thank you for answering my questions.

The height won't be of any issue, I tow regularly with 2 different AU Falcons, both of which sit on superlow springs.

What you need is a - Weight Distribution Hitch, or WDH for short.
Hayman Reese do these, as do a couple other mobs.

In short, they transfer part of the ball weight (which normally makes the rear sag, and the front rise) over the front axle, restoring steering and braking ability at the same time as raising the rear.

These are pretty much indispensable with any ball weight above 60-70kg, as they improve pitching & diving and sway resistance.

You will need to know the ball weight or nose weight of your caravan so you can purchase the right unit.

Take a gander here and you should find what you need -

http://www.haymanreese.com.au/produc...ionsystems.htm

...

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by stang65

Your Joking, you work for Jeep do you?
Off topic don`t you think.

Of course I don't work for them.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Sox

The height won't be of any issue, I tow regularly with 2 different AU Falcons, both of which sit on superlow springs.

What you need is a - Weight Distribution Hitch, or WDH for short.
Hayman Reese do these, as do a couple other mobs.

In short, they transfer part of the ball weight (which normally makes the rear sag, and the front rise) over the front axle, restoring steering and braking ability at the same time as raising the rear.

These are pretty much indispensable with any ball weight above 60-70kg, as they improve pitching & diving and sway resistance.

You will need to know the ball weight or nose weight of your caravan so you can purchase the right unit.

Take a gander here and you should find what you need -

http://www.haymanreese.com.au/produc...ionsystems.htm

...

Very good ....... and is what I have been trying to say. Also I reiterate, Ford install these with a warranty. The G6E with 2 tonne of van on the back does not move 3mm and drives very well. If a 75 year old bloke (not me) can drive it around Australia I am sure anyone could. I do not see it as an issue unless you are going off road ......

[FalconBrian]

Thankyou all for the replies,

Spent the day at the dealer and went through all bloody options. We chatted about the different things we could do. We talked about the Territory and I dont think its what we after it uses a lot more fuel on the highway due to gearing, weight and air resistance and the 4wd runs all wheels constantly. My dealer says the latest Falcon can get in the 8 litre range per 100km in the Territory its hard to get under 10 so I have crossed it off, but please put me in my place if I am wrong about this fact.

Pointless story I suppose but more chatting we found out a dealer a few hours away actually started making a rural suspension kit when the Falcon RT ute was cancelled a couple of years back. the RT ute was a big seller out here, even my dealer said in his little store half of all Falcons he sold were RT utes. But it is made for utes and wont suit the G6E and they dont sell the kit as the Ford factory would not authorise it anyway. So a big dead end after 2 hours calling around!

In the end I think I have decided to buy the G6E and have the XT springs put in as they are factory parts. So thankyou for all the help in with the suspension. I would consider Pedders but it was going to be a big drama where I am and I want to have everything done at the one place. So if the boss gives the nod I can order it so that the springs will arrive soon and then they will put them in when the Falcon arrives

We found out today the G6E has a rear television camera so I can hook the van right up to the towbar. So dont need the mrs anymore this car keeps getting better and better!!

Please give any advice or your thinking you all seem to know a lot more about this than this galah

[Road_Warrior]

Aah yes, the RTV ute. A great product killed off for no apparent reason. How's about those ute sales volumes now Ford, now that you've killed off all your niche vehicles! Morons.

Anyway, enjoy your new ride Brian, hopefully it will give you many years of enjoyment.

[deesun]

Originally Posted by FalconBrian

We found out today the G6E has a rear television camera so I can hook the van right up to the towbar. So dont need the mrs anymore this car keeps getting better and better!!

Please give any advice or your thinking you all seem to know a lot more about this than this galah

My little bit of advice is not let the Mrs see that post.

Also stay in touch when you are out on your jaunt to wherever and tell us where you went and what you saw and how all those numnuts driving big gas guzzling 4wd's just to pull a van when you can do it in style in a G6E. Have fun.

[stang65]

Spent the day at the dealer and went through all bloody options. We chatted about the different things we could do. We talked about the Territory and I dont think its what we after it uses a lot more fuel on the highway due to gearing, weight and air resistance and the 4wd runs all wheels constantly. My dealer says the latest Falcon can get in the 8 litre range per 100km in the Territory its hard to get under 10 so I have crossed it off, but please put me in my place if I am wrong about this fact.

Did you discuss the rwd territory?

[prydey]

rwd territory only gets 4sp 'box. g6e will be 6sp. depending on the weight and size of the van, the falcon should cope ok.

unless you are planning on off roading, the ground clearance in a falcon is plenty.

as for changing springs to xt springs, bear in mind, they are a lot softer than the g6e springs, so i would recommend some firmer shock absorbers to counter that. xt's are very softly sprung.

did you look at g6's rather than g6e? not sure, but i reckon the std g6 has the same ride height as the xt.

[daz82]

Tell your dealer from me they are idiots. The AWD on the Territory does not run constantly it only kicks in when in slipery conditions. With a 2000Kg caravan a Territory will use about 1 - 2 Litres\100Km more fuel. I have tested both.

My advice for you is to either buy a current Territory with AWD to get the 6-speed automatic or wait for the new one and get the new diesel engine.

I have driven and towed with a G6E and it does sit a little low at the back, the Terriroty is a much more comfortable vehicle to drive in my opinion and does not feel like a 4WD ute at all. (i Currently drive a Ford Ranger)

[stang65]

Daz83 I beleive your incorrect in this case the AWD is constant , your thinking of the craptiva which is called awd on demand.

[Raptor]

Originally Posted by daz82

Tell your dealer from me they are idiots. The AWD on the Territory does not run constantly it only kicks in when in slipery conditions. With a 2000Kg caravan a Territory will use about 1 - 2 Litres\100Km more fuel. I have tested both.....

No daz you are wrong and the dealer is correct.

The Territory AWD system is a 'full-time' system and not an 'on-demand' system as found in most FWD based AWD's. That is drive is sent to both the front and the back all the time (torque biased to the rear in about a 62:38 ratio from memory). However, as the centre diff/transfer case or neither the front or rear diff have any form of conventional LSD or locking mechansim traction is controlled by the electronics via the application of brakes (similar to ABS in reverse).

The fuel penalty of the Territory compared to a Falcon is a result of the extra weight, extra frontal area (wind resistance), extra rolling resistance of the larger tyres as well as the extra inertia/drag from the front driveline (AWD models only) and the differences in gearing between the models.

Personally neither would be my first choice if towing a van was the top priority.

However, if it's just a bit of extra ground clearance that's desired and you can make use of the extra functionality the Territory body configuration offers I think the fuel penalty is a small price to pay because it's still a great drivers car.

[JC]

G6E with XT suspension and Weight Distribution Hitch would be the way to go. I would not expect the G6E to achieve 8l/100km towing - double it and you'd be close.

[EB#]

Just an additional note on rear springs.....

https://www.fordforums.com.au/photos/data/2937/s1.jpg[/IMG]

Here is a comparison pic of some rear springs. The red ones are aftermarket (Pedders)
and the black ones are stock Ford. Disregarding the heights, note that the
aftermarket ones have a thicker gauge, more coils and an increased spring rate.

Pedders or any other aftermarket brand spring are easy enough to order on
the phone, freight deliver and install with a local mechanic.... No dramas.
That's what I did on my BA.

[deesun]

Pedders are the ones with the experience. Thats the way i would go if you don't want the Terri. Anyone can install too.

[XRtowcar]

I tow a 18ft van with a BA XR6 and dont have any drama's with clearence.
Think your G6 would be ok without any spring additions and would suggest trying the van on it before you change the srpings.
Weight distributing hitch is a must as suggested.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by EB92

Just an additional note on rear springs.....



Here is a comparison pic of some rear springs. The red ones are aftermarket (Pedders)
and the black ones are stock Ford. Disregarding the heights, note that the
aftermarket ones have a thicker gauge, more coils and an increased spring rate.

Pedders or any other aftermarket brand spring are easy enough to order on
the phone, freight deliver and install with a local mechanic.... No dramas.
That's what I did on my BA.

do the factory ones have plastic coating like pedders. thats probably the only difference in the thickness. also, if the steel is the same guage, more coils = softer spring. the shorter the length of steel, the harder it is to bend.

[EB#]

Originally Posted by prydey

do the factory ones have plastic coating like pedders. thats probably the only difference in the thickness. also, if the steel is the same guage, more coils = softer spring. the shorter the length of steel, the harder it is to bend.

Pretty sure the pedders springs are powdercoated...(?)
I'm not too up to speed on spring dynamics but whichever way the logic
works I have run aftermarket springs and shocks in two of my Fords and
both times they made the factory gear seem pretty ordinary in comparison.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by fairBA

What's a two-cent coin?

.

You must be a youngin. Prior to the 5c being the smallest coin available there was also a 1 and 2 cent coin.

Don't know how many years they have been out of circulation for? (20??) but if you had some in your wallet they would look like this:



The 1c was slightly smaller than the 5c coin and the 2c was slightly smaller than the 10c coin.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by EB92

Pretty sure the pedders springs are powdercoated...(?)
I'm not too up to speed on spring dynamics but whichever way the logic
works I have run aftermarket springs and shocks in two of my Fords and
both times they made the factory gear seem pretty ordinary in comparison.

have you ever changed the springs without changing the ride height? generally the reason most people change springs is to change the ride height. generally they will be less coils if the guage is the same.

compare the std height springs to xr6 springs. unloaded, they are about 150mm difference in height, but once in the car only alter the ride height about 15mm. the std springs are veeeeery looooong with many coils and are extremely soft.

if i was the OP and putting xt springs in my G6E, i would definitely be pairing them with some decent firmer shock absorbers, otherwise, even though the ride height is raised marginally, the car will still squat down just as low when a caravan is hitched up due to the softness of the xt springs.

personally, i would leave the G6E as is, and see how it goes. the OP might find, as with others on here, that it will cope just fine how it is.

[EB#]

Originally Posted by prydey

....if i was the OP and putting xt springs in my G6E, i would definitely be pairing them with some decent firmer shock absorbers, otherwise, even though the ride height is raised marginally, the car will still squat down just as low when a caravan is hitched up due to the softness of the xt springs....

Agree with all that......

However, I was just wondering why one would even bother changing over to an XT spring,
when an aftermarket one would surely offer a better selection for increased
ride height options and a better performer for loads/towing ? I spoze a
better towing or heavy duty spring would offer a slightly firmer or harsher ride for unladen driving ?
Maybe the OP didn't want that ?

I'd hazard a guess also that maybe the OP got scared off by pedders and their usual
guff of "OK here's some springs, and by the way you need all this other gear too.....$$$$"..... ?


Anyway.. to the OP. Hope you get it all sorted to your satisfaction.
All the best with the new Ford, I'm sure you will enjoy it !

[SpoolMan]

Originally Posted by FalconBrian

Hello, my granddaughter is helping me write this.

I am hoping one of you can help me with a special order. I am wanting to buy a white Falcon G6E with heavy duty tow pack. But I have had a look at a new Falcon in the yard and it looks like it will drag its guts on a two-cent coin.

Is there someone at Ford I can speak to about getting higher suspension. My mate is a Ford dealer out here in a very small country town and he thinks that I will have to go aftermarket. But I dont want a brand new car to be fiddled with ideally. If anyone knows someone to talk to on the phone that would be appreciated.

He says all the old blokes like me get scared off from how low they are which is a shame as I had an XF in the 80s and it was a ripper car. He said Ford sometimes do special orders but he didnt sound sure of what to do.

also is it normal for new Falcons to be so low? or is it an option like a S pack?

thank you for answering my questions.

This thread posted yesterday may be of interest to you.
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11321739

[xtremerus]

I think the OP is confused between ride height and load capability.
They are two different things.
The XT springs may have the height [unloaded] BUT will drag on that 2 cent piece when loaded.
After market HD rear springs would be the go, as others have suggested.
my 2 cents worth.[not scratched]

[FalconBrian]

thankyou for all the advice especially in the suspension and diesel and the territory. Im typing this myself so excuse the stupid spelling and punctuation. I know its all boring this message but seeing as you have taken time out to write to me. its the least I can do to write back.

People have been mentioning diesel and the territory. We really dont want diesel, petrol is much more enjoyable to drive for what we are after. We are also certain Falcon or something similar is the best option, we know that most 4wds are pretty rubbish to tour in and tow so they are out. Once again the Territory is out, but only because of personal preference, everyone goes on about how good it is so its probably foolishness on my part but Im . We will only be towing the van once or twice a year so the rest of the year the car will be living on highway and dirt roads around here.

On saturday I went and visited a Holden dealer and they can fit a higher suspension to a Calais through the dealer. What changes everything was that the Calais comes in station wagon. We think we would prefer a wagon when travelling and you cant buy a G6E in wagon I think? So a bit confused now. We do have a couple of 4wd utes on the property in case we need more space for something. So a wagon is a want but not a necessity.

In the end we will probably go for the G6E as its much cheaper than the Holden and I prefer the engine. We will probably order the G6E and not stuff around with the suspension until after I get it in case I realise that Pedders would be a better option. One things for sure the car needs to be at normal height it is too low for our liking, but the rest of the car is perfect also they are doing very good deals so its coming out a lot cheaper than we thought it would be.

Does anyone have an opinon on the Calais station wagon? I know this is a Ford place so I expect to be called a mug for even thinking about it.