LS3 for final Commodore

[johnydep]

Originally Posted by Boza

To me it honestly does has the same twitchy feel to the steering I feel like I'm always correcting the car.

I have driven a lot of commodores from vb-vl and honestly to me the steering is all the same even going into a nice sweeping bend they don't feel as planted as a falcon going into a corner or bend i feel like I need to yannk on the wheel a few times where as in a falcon i Just point the car into the corner and it feels way more planted and smoother.

...

Sorry, I really have no idea what you're on about. I have also driven many commodores. The VF is amazing, compared to any other Commodore.

The VL was a shocker, the only thing it had going for it was it's smallish size & weight. The live axle rear did it no favours, the weak monocoque structure would flex & twist (early models would crack along the floor pan), the steering wheel was off centre, the two piece tail shaft caused whipping. The thing was a dog compared to models from the naughties.

The VF is in a different league. The structure is stiffer, the suspension modern, the rear independent, the steering electric...

http://www.holden.com.au/worldrecordute

[LoudPipes]

Originally Posted by Boza

...... But I love ls2 &ls3 engine's would love to stuff one into something ......

The LS2 is the performance version of the LS1 and both are boat anchors compared to the current LS offerings.
Their cathedral heads are so restrictive compared to the modern port design and costs a packet to get a decent flow and then still can’t match the newer L98’s and LS3 onwards for easy horsepower.

Originally Posted by Boza

Love the ls engine's not so much the chassis there in have driven a few late model commodores and not impressed at all with the handling feels very twitchy and I feel i'm always correcting the wheel slightly I learned to drive in my uncles vl and to me it the ride is way better and tighter in late model commodores but they handle the same as that vl did.

In regard to the VL – VF comparison, I don’t know how the new Commodore handles as I’ve never driven one but they can’t be too bad otherwise the internet would be full of interesting comments supporting your opinion.
When offering a way out there comment, sometimes a little bit of sanity is needed.

[Falcman0o7]

So when ford down size thier V8 again and put out even more power does that mean holden will have to goto a 9.9 litre V8 to catch up ? LOL

[Alan D Segal]

Originally Posted by LoudPipes

[SIZE=3]In regard to the VL – VF comparison, I don’t know how the new Commodore handles as I’ve never driven one but they can’t be too bad otherwise the internet would be full of interesting comments supporting your opinion.

I have driven a VF SV6. Nothing wrong with it, but I only spent an hour in it (which sounds like an hour more than others here).

The VF feels a lot better than the VE, and the VE was a huge improvement over the VZ in my opinion. Just like the other VT-VZ cars were better than the VN-VS ones.

It is called progress, and upgrading the cars.

I think the Falcons feel a little better than the commodore - slightly. They also feel a lot better after about 100,000km, when commodores start feeling their age more IMHO.

[1TUFFUTE]

So is this a Holden ignoring hsv and going for a last ditch effort at taking xr8 sales? Maybe they've broken rank NOW to seal in the sales before people snap up an xr8. Funny move rom holden

[Dave R]

Holden sell almost as many V8s per month as Ford has allocated for 2 years worth of FGX. Doubt they care.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

Holden sell almost as many V8s per month as Ford has allocated for 2 years worth of FGX. Doubt they care.

Yeah but the overall numbers still aren't sustainable so the more the better you'd think. Only thing that makes sense why they'd weirdly announce this so early. Unless I'm missing something.....

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

Holden sell almost as many V8s per month as Ford has allocated for 2 years worth of FGX. Doubt they care.

Holden might not care about XR8 in terms of sales however performance inferiority (SS vs XR8) is something they care massively about or the reputation that might spread. There hasn't been a Falcon V8 since 2010 and Holden has done nothing engine wise, come the XR8 and Holden reply by stepping on HSV toes, they care alright.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Holden might not care about XR8 in terms of sales however performance inferiority (SS vs XR8) is something they care massively about or the reputation that might spread. There hasn't been a Falcon V8 since 2010 and Holden has done nothing engine wise, come the XR8 and Holden reply by stepping on HSV toes, they care alright.

Yeah that's probably one of the big missing links right there. A 270kw SS vs a 335 supercharged xr8. And with holdens biggest draw card always seeming to be their v8, they won't want to have to rely on v6 sales if they loose some 8 sales. Even if it's just the bragging rights of the engine, and not the superior overall car!

[Dave R]

There was talk a while back of HSV dropping the entry level Clubsport, I'd say this is the result. As far as performance inferiority concerns, Holden have been happy to get smoked by XR6 Turbos for years, in fact after the 270kw FG turbo (more like 320kw let's be honest) and 290kw XR8 were launched, Holden responded by making their V8 even less potent with the AFM tech. So I dunno. They'd really have to put an LSA in the SS for it to be competitive with the new XR8. After 8 years of the same engine the base 6.2 had to come sooner or later, after all that's what they've been fitting to the Chevrolet export versions since 2013, which again follows the trend- the exports get the good stuff like the 6.2, paddle shifters, more airbags, cooled seats (not just heated) etc, and as in the past, Holden slowly drip feeds it into the Commodore range.

[PepeLePew]

I love marketers where the current HSV and possibly new SS LS3 comes up 5Nm and 5Kw more in the paper war over the 335......not knocking Holden there, just normal marketing behavior. Are we really that much a bunch of sheep that it matters (referring to the human race)? I guess for many they're probably right.

[Uwish]

The LS3 is a great engine. Yes it is no S/C 5ltr but for an N/A engine it is great.
Cam / exhaust / CAI and a mafless tune will see 350rwkw. More than enough to light up the rears for a bit of fun.
Also the VF is a better alround car than the Falcon. ( I am still looking at buying a FGX xr8 )
although my sticking point is the interior of the FGX...FFS surely they could have put a new style steering wheel???

[Alan D Segal]

Originally Posted by PepeLePew

Are we really that much a bunch of sheep that it matters (referring to the human race)? I guess for many they're probably right.

Yes it does. That's why they do it - because it works for a lot of people.

[Bossxr8]

Ford may be looking into something for the XR6 Turbo if SS goes to an LS3. Not sure how serious it is or wether it will even happen but if the rumours are true it may. Don't get your hopes up though.

[johnydep]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Ford may be looking into something for the XR6 Turbo if SS goes to an LS3. Not sure how serious it is or wether it will even happen but if the rumours are true it may. Don't get your hopes up though.

It's called a Mustang

[outback_ute]

I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but it is probably just because the 6-litre is going out of production in the USA. I think the 6.2 has replaced it in most things now except perhaps the HD pickups. The only alternative would be to get them to run off a batch as Ford did with the Windsor to see out the AU's, and I'm not sure I would want to buy (or sell with a warranty) a car with an engine that has been sitting around for 2 years.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by PepeLePew

I don't understand the timing here. Do HSV owners buy between now and then knowing the LS3 will be offered in the bargain SS and the HSV have a bigger better faster transplant? Does it encourage purchase of the 6L SS now given the horizon has been advertised? Oh hang on, we've had those arguments about values 'freefalling' lately......

I get the idea, and it's a good thing for SS buyers. But I don't get why now except to tempt any brand neutrals not to buy XR8?

I think it was supposed to be inside baseball and small talk between the journalist and the Holden staff. Said journalist then did the dirty on them and wrote it up. Holden certainly had no intention of announcing anything formally at this point. Journalist now on S*** list but plenty of clicks for the story.

That said its not hard to figure out it would happen. Base LS3 for final Redline. Upper spec LS3 and all the fruit for Clubsport. Mildly tweaked GTS with all the fruit for final swansong.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by XBGTFGGTP

Correct, Holden scared of the XR8 stealing sales from them. Trying to get people to Holdon until upgraded SS available.

Miami against LS3, not even worth mentioning

Holden are scared of a finite stockpile of Ford V8's and matching automatics. Ok.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Holden might not care about XR8 in terms of sales however performance inferiority (SS vs XR8) is something they care massively about or the reputation that might spread. There hasn't been a Falcon V8 since 2010 and Holden has done nothing engine wise, come the XR8 and Holden reply by stepping on HSV toes, they care alright.

Now we are in 2016 and the Redline is in its final swan song. How do you get someone who purchased a VE SS or even a VF Redline in 2013/14 to take one more go at upgrading to the latest and last Redline?

You put the 6.2 litre in it.

Standard Holden up-selling and they are bloody good at it. They have been doing it since the Commodores original launch and they will keep on doing it right up to the final one that rolls down the line at Elizabeth.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Now we are in 2016 and the Redline is in its final swan song. How do you get someone who purchased a VE SS or even a VF Redline in 2013/14 to take one more go at upgrading to the latest and last Redline?

You put the 6.2 litre in it.

Standard Holden up-selling and they are bloody good at it. They have been doing it since the Commodores original launch and they will keep on doing it right up to the final one that rolls down the line at Elizabeth.

And most obviously shown in the VT-VZ days. SS power went from 220, 225, 235, 245, 250 then 260kw in that period, on a almost yearly update.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Yeah but the overall numbers still aren't sustainable so the more the better you'd think. Only thing that makes sense why they'd weirdly announce this so early. Unless I'm missing something.....

Holden haven't announced anything. A journalist leaked a private conversation.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Holden haven't announced anything. A journalist leaked a private conversation.

Yeah I saw someone mentioned that. That explains the obvious weirdness of the timing then!
I spose it now means they may loose some sales from those holding off till the last edition, but sell more of them in the end!

Stupid media hacks!

[brismike]

Aren't Commodores for people who can't reverse park? I prefer to use my steering wheel when I'm reverse parking my GT lol.

[Alan D Segal]

Originally Posted by brismike

Aren't Commodores for people who can't reverse park?

That's 90% of the population mate. Big target market.

[MITCHAY]

I'm sure all the XR8s will be sold before this even happens, if it happens.

They would probably trying to get repeat business on the VF SS and maybe tempt people away from the XR6T.

[Chopped]

Might delay some from jumping ship into an XR8 and also may tempt series 1 VF owners into upgrading in 2016.
Pretty clever really.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by brismike

Aren't Commodores for people who can't reverse park? I prefer to use my steering wheel when I'm reverse parking my GT lol.

If you own a GT, you shouldn't be parking, you should be "momentarily stationary" and that's only to refuel.

[FGX-351]

After doing the 100m sprint & stop in the FGX XR8 yesterday, for the duration of Ford driver James' right foot being to the floor I forgot all about "gadgets", "features" & just about my own name.
If Ford can ramp up the production of the XR8 and dealers have cars available for test drives I believe the XR8 will be very competetive with the current & future LS3 SS Commodores.

[SadistikEvil]

If holdon crummiedore sales are so good why are they constantly up **** creek year after year... They sell spares at an highly inflated rate like every other brand and if there is so many of them out there the company should be booming just on parts alone from breakdowns. Just saying is all. Working in the automotive industry since 15 years old in several different areas you tend to notice mostly holdens of all types in for repair more than any other vehicle brand out there, fact.

[johneee]

I personally don't like the feel of commodores or how they drive, they just feel like transportation to me, and I actually think my mum's stock territory drives better but that may just be me.