The Club: Past, Present & Future

[Aaron_EF8]

I personally don't see how paying a membership fee will get rid of people who do burnouts on cruises. However i'm all for the paid membership thing, as soon as the club gets recognised by CAMS ;)

[FairmontEL]

im a relatively new member to eseries although i have been reading through the eseries forums for a long time. What attracted me to become a proper member was the large cruises and impressive number of different cars and heaps of active member who go to these cruises. I fear that with this introduction of paid membership the numbers of members and cruise numbers will dwindle. but what does my opinion matter :

[Rmyers]

I vote for Johns idea. I've noticed that people act up mostly on our friday night cruises etc, and we rarely get much "hooning" on Sunday afternoon cruises. My suggestion is that Sunday cruises can be free for all, and paid membership gets access to the more frequent friday/saturday night cruises.

One main reason I believe this would work is that we now get those people who go out on a friday night for a bit of spirited driving attendending our cruises, as they are basically just driving around looking for something to do. Making people pay for a night cruise will help sift out the trouble makers

We then make our Sunday afternoon cruises free as generally we are less likely attract the minority that like to cause trouble, and will give those unpaying members that are tuely interested in the club a chance to attend.

Hope that made sense :P That's my suggestion

[Damo]

I think it should stay how it is. Also Jack it would be good if you could actually make it to meets to get a real perspective of what goes on. Obviously I seem to be the minority going by the responses in this thread thus far, but it's just my opinion.

[FPVWEPN]

I feel club numbers will dwindle with paid membership!
Also what sort of $$$ are we talking here as a rough guide??

[FPVWEPN]

Originally Posted by Damo

I think it should stay how it is. Also Jack it would be good if you could actually make it to meets to get a real perspective of what goes on. Obviously I seem to be the minority going by the responses in this thread thus far, but it's just my opinion.

im with ya dude paying to go on a cruise is laughable as if rego, insurance, mods and petrol isn't enough !!!! lets keep it free if ya wana get rid of hoons just report their plates

[Psycho Chicken]

Originally Posted by CRUIZIN EB

i think the first thing that should be done, Is Get reps for all states that way we get more exposure to do all the ideas above

You say that, then go start your own forums? :yeees:

[Kryton]

im not a member but who would the fee be paid to and what would it go towards? who has a say that it is going towards something worth while and benifits everybody?
at the end of the day, most people have a mobile phone so pretty much anyone that is breaking the law could have their rego taken down and rang through to the police. if the club is as responsible as it claims, then the police should know what is going on before it starts. the police should also be aware that whilst there are members on the cruise, no unruley behavior will be permitted and will be directly reported to them (the police).
it is then up to the police to do something about it.

[mcflux]

I think I'll modify my vote now... Rymers' addition to John's idea gets my new vote.

Bring on a Sunday arvo cruise! I only work in the mornings so it'd be the best of both worlds for me :P

How about inviting an off-duty policeman who is a car enthusiast/forum member along? They'd be able to remember any d1ckhead drivers & their cars (if anyone plays up) so that next time they're on duty, they can nab 'em or at least make life difficult for them.

-Dave-

[Leah]

Im liking both Johns and Rmyers ideas. Paid membership with benefits for paid members only.

[EA2BA]

I think the paid membership that gets you subsidised entry and/or reserved spots (i.e car shows, drag days, dyno days, etc) on free to all events, and exclusive invites to some member only activities, that way membership can still be high, everyone is welcome as there would still be alot free to all events (with hooning laws in place), and member only events could be like a cruise and free BBQ or something, of course friends/family could be invited, but would have to pay a fee, and someone will have to vouch for them and be responsible for their actions.

Thats my thoughts

[Interceptor'85]

I think the ideas of EFFalcon and Rmyers stand strongly, and paid membership does have it's benefits.

Paid membership would mean organised food and drink etc. on big cruises too.

Membership wont stop hooning though...The idea of a members numberplate register would help.
If members had club cards with details on them (and plate rego) then there could be a manned sign in and the 'extras' that show up would be zoned out much easier.

[4.9 EF Futura]

OK, so i assume paid membership = registered club?

If this is the case then I only have two words: Vicarious liability

When a person is held responsible for the tort of another even though the person being held responsible may not have done anything wrong. This is often the case with employers who are held vicariously liable for the damages caused by their employees.

Meaning that members of the board of the club become personally liable for the actions of others.

Followed by another word to mitigate the risk of vicarious liability: indemnity.

I'd suggest the club takes the kiss approach - keep it simple. We have cruise organisers, yes? I would think that if the cruise organiser deems a member's behaviour unacceptable - he tells them politely to f*** off. If the driver in question disagrees with this opinion, then we have 20 or so club members who are more-then-likely willing to assist the cruise organiser in requesting the offending driver to leave and not to bother returning.

You cant regulate against stupidity - enforcement is your best option. Tell em to shove it up their jumper and report the plate to the authorities. You might get the occasional idiot but if the message gets out "dont screw around on our cruises" then you're gonna get the result you are looking for.

I would think that common sense is surely a preferable approach as opposed to checks and balances - the effectiveness of which would be questionable. On the negative - possibly even be detremental to the club?

I hate to be the kind of person to shoot down ideas, but member only cruises for example - from time to time i'm getting by on the bones of my a$$ and im sure plenty of other e-series members do as well - if there's a handful of 'good apples' who miss out on a cruise because they were a bit short to pay their subs for whatever reason - well that is going to detract from the cruise.

[Amber]

Ita a hard one.

Paid membership works in theory, but I think that's as far as it will go.

My concern is new people wanting to check out the club. What happens to them when it comes to joining a cruise? I know a few E-series blokes, but I'm yet to go on a E-series cruise. There is no way I'd get in a strangers car, simply because I wouldn't be 'allowed' to come on the cruise in my own car. And even if I did, does said stranger want 2 kids in the back of their pride making a big mess with the Wiggles blaring?

Paid membership only cruises sound good, but surely the idea of the club is to spread the word and get new people along. I wouldnt fork out money going into something blindfolded, if ya get where I'm trying to go with this? :yeees:

I think not.

There must be a better way. I don't know what it is, I'm racking my brain trying to think of a way to make the club better, but I'm just lost.

I like the idea of getting details at a first meet point, and I also like the idea of not posting the specifics about a cruise. Maybe just something like

"Bunnings @ 7pm. You will then be given an intinery upon a gold coin donation"

Ah look, I really do not know what the answer is. There are drivers on ego trips no matter where you go. I think the key is to eliminate them from the club, somehow.

[ilsautomotive]

Cheers for the replies guys, it is great to see so much interest. I will try to reply to the points raised by your responses.

Originally Posted by Kenaz

I vote for the paid membership option. Quality not quantity.

As the one person who has been a regular both in the early days and the evolution, your opinion is highly valued.

Originally Posted by CRUIZIN EB

Get reps for all states that way we get more exposure to do all the ideas above

Perhaps you were absent on the several attempts at voting in a WA rep that I took on. I cannot take on the rep position myself, and if there is insufficient interest then it is out of my hands and I can only retry every now and then.

Originally Posted by Stevo

Only paid members come on the cruises. What do you do about potential members wanting to check out club cruises ? If you say guests can come, then "everyone will be a guest".

Very good point. The E series General forum will still be free for all, and I feel the best thing would be to have occasional 'free for all' events under very controlled circumstances. This way we can still enjoy the large events now and then, but we would ultimately be a focused Club for true E series enthusiasts.

Originally Posted by Age182

how much are you all thinking when you say paid membership?

what is the point of paying im missing the point to it sorry people?

The CCC as an example charge $20 per annum. Other Clubs have been known to charge up to $50. It need not be anything like that amount, but the idea is to have enough resources to make the Club a legally recognised entity with only the most enthusiastic and mature members present at official meets.

Originally Posted by 94EDxr6

Why should the responcible drivers suffer from this road toll.

If supporting the Club is a 'road toll' I should be complaining about the hundreds I've spent on web site URLs and hosting over the years.

Originally Posted by EFFalcon

Optional paid membership.

A good suggestion. My concerns are that a) it would mean all the administration of paid memberships without the advantage of streamlining our membership base, and b) in the bigger picture it would be an unnecessary stop gap between free-for-all and ultimately ending up a paid membership Club.

By having occasional free-for-all cruises we will go a long way towards having the best of both worlds.

Originally Posted by oneredED

I think that your presence Jack, as the president of our club, would need to be far more involved on a physical level ie. attending meets to let people know that the club is a serious thing

I apologise this has not been the case more, as you may be aware I am in a bind with my car at the moment. I'll make every effort to attend in future even as a passenger. However, I would nonetheless prefer to focus on prevention rather than cure for the hooning issue.

Originally Posted by Gunns

I will put my hand up to get the club Cams registered, once the club is registered.

This is one of many possibilities that will be opened up.

Originally Posted by stockstandard

I am not sure how optional membership is going to address the issues in the original post.

Nor am I.

Originally Posted by FairmontEL

I fear that with this introduction of paid membership the numbers of members and cruise numbers will dwindle. :

There is no doubt numbers will downsize because we will only have our most dedicated Club members present. I am not convinced this is a bad thing.

Originally Posted by davway

im not a member but who would the fee be paid to and what would it go towards? who has a say that it is going towards something worth while and benifits everybody?

Your suggestion re: police would certainly apply to future free-for-all events. The funds would be allocated such that they go towards events in the home state of the payer, or national Club expenses like donations to the forums or upgrades to the site. It would be the responsibility of the Treasurer and myself to report with the details to the satisfaction of the members.

For this reason, I feel that the paid membership would apply only to Victoria until we build up elsewhere, as anyone in, say, Northern Territory paying full fees would get absolutely nothing to show for it.

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

OK, so i assume paid membership = registered club?

If this is the case then I only have two words: Vicarious liability

Whilst there may be possible legal implications, one has to remember that the cruises themselves will be far more controlled and thus the actual probability of disaster will go through the floor. We are not treading unchartered waters here, merely aspiring to the same standard of commitment and maturity as the existing Tickford/FPV (etc) Clubs from across the land. I don't see them getting sued every day.

As E series cars become older and rarer, only the true enthusiasts will remain. In theory, over the long term we would end up a similar niche to the various '70s Falcon Clubs or the P76 Clubs.

I hope I have addressed every point. There was a time, before the Club reached the size it has, that I had long-time members begging me to move in this direction, but I was eager to focus on expanding our size. Now the downside of this has hit the fan.

Of course I am far from having any form of conclusive decision, but I would like to take all feedback into account in doing so. Not everyone will be satisfied with decision when it comes, but it is the long-term interests of the Club's most dedicated members that I am personally focused on.

[gozza]

i vote u all pitch in for the gozzas turbo fund
i will personaly see to it that all who donate shall become matyrs in my afterlife kingdom

but seriously i don't have an opinion...im happy to go with the flow

[neb]

Originally Posted by gozza

im happy to go with the flow

same i'm happy to go with the flow

i havn't really seen any issues with cruises that i've been on, apart from the occassional idiot but nothing that wasn't taken care of.

so yeah i'm not fussed at all, whatever is decided i'm happy to go along with, everyone seems to have good ideas. but i do agree trouty you have to get out to more cruises... i don't think you really exist, never seen you :P

[1TUFEA]

So this wont affect the other states as much really ! ??????

[KEV EB XR8]

As i also am not a member as yet, i dont know if my opinion is warranted , but just need to raise one question in interest.
As a sporting car club, would'nt you need to adhear to the same rules as any other club, that is, president,secretary,treasurer,vice, and board directors. In short terms the compliance and goverance laws would be asking these people to be liable for all ethics of the club and its members.
I sit on the board of directors at the RSL and the bowling club, and if these rules apply to this new formed club, a bit more homework may need to be done.

In saying this, membership also brings disiplinary powers to you that are the same as everyday clubs ltd , very usefull if needed to be enforced. a club constitution is written and amendments added and everybody is inducted to read and understand the rules, if broken , you allready know what the action is?

sport and rec has a website that assists new clubs starting up.

[Sprint_ED]

i think everyone has good points here, ill add my 2 cents

i think johns idea is verygood, a members area only, and cruises, to help the concerns stevo's question, the regulars who pay, get the benefits such as discounts, the members section etc, if someone wants to come to a cruise who is not a member, they must tell a mod, eg john, on the forums or on the night, they must give rego/liscence numbers, and sign a form saying they are not a member of the club, and they tak responsibilty for their own actions, and say like a gold coin donations, so here the paid members have the advantage of not filling out these details every time and having to request to come. this way people who are not members can see what it is like on our cruises, and trouty is right, last cruise, i left early because i did not want cops barreling me cos of other people. and i know a few members that are in the same boat

EDIT: sorry forgot to add something, with these guests having to give their details they will know we mean business, and if they stuff their details will be handed to police, and they being banned

[FPVWEPN]

and if a non member tags along with the cruise and refuses to give details and doesnt play up what are you gonna do ????

[Sprint_ED]

ok well that is open to disscussion

[EFFalcon]

i'll do a burnout on their skull.

[Gunns]

Originally Posted by FPVWEPN

and if a non member tags along with the cruise and refuses to give details and doesnt play up what are you gonna do ????

Drop a match in their fuel tank!

[Simmo]

Originally Posted by 1TUFEA

So this wont affect the other states as much really ! ??????

the QLD eseries club and meets are very different to the southern states. seeing only 1 QLD member post in this thread apart from myself shows that whatever you southern guys do i dont think its going to filter up here as quick. we have great free for all cruises and although we have exuberant members we have not gotten into any trouble as yet. i dont want to cast a shadow but half the time one of the cruise objectives is to have a little fun. i think if it comes down to paying for membership a lot of the QLD guys will not bother and just organise snap cruises like we always do.

EDIT: the majority of our cars up here dont have the club stickers either. so we arent misrepresenting the club.

[1TUFEA]

Originally Posted by Simmo

the majority of our cars up here dont have the club stickers either. so we arent misrepresenting the club.

lol i do but my car couldn't pull a skid to save its life hehe !

[Aaron_EF8]

Originally Posted by Simmo

the QLD eseries club and meets are very different to the southern states. seeing only 1 QLD member post in this thread apart from myself shows that whatever you southern guys do i dont think its going to filter up here as quick. we have great free for all cruises and although we have exuberant members we have not gotten into any trouble as yet. i dont want to cast a shadow but half the time one of the cruise objectives is to have a little fun. i think if it comes down to paying for membership a lot of the QLD guys will not bother and just organise snap cruises like we always do.

EDIT: the majority of our cars up here dont have the club stickers either. so we arent misrepresenting the club.

Do you actually know what happened at the recent Melbourne cruise? I've seen more than a couple people on this thread, and the last one that was closed, say a lot of different things, without actually KNOWING what happened on the cruise. Yes I know I wasn't there either, but i've spoken to a lot of people who were off the forums and it seems all the burnouts etc were blown way out of proportion.

Anyway, back on topic, I agree with Martin's (4.9 EF Futura) post, I don't think paid membership will stop anything that's trying to be adressed. Won't the club also at least be registered as a business, with an ABN, if it accepts any payments?

[FPVWEPN]

no seriously guys you cant really stop random people from coming nor can you tell them to leave as u haven't hired out "bunnings carpark" for private use

[EA2BA]

Originally Posted by FPVWEPN

no seriously guys you cant really stop random people from coming nor can you tell them to leave as u haven't hired out "bunnings carpark" for private use

That may be true, but a free for all cruise you would know about, a member only cruise in theory you would not know is happening, in either case if you tagged along your number plate would be recorded and passed to police if you chose not to behave.

[FPVWEPN]

my point is what if you didn't do anything illegal??? and you tagged along you cant report them to the cops coz they aren't doing anything illegal