W427 finished - Page 2

Coogs289 · 17-04-2009, 07:32 PM

good on them for having a go. hopefully they'll, somehow, make a HO

:
i think (like many others) that the real killer was the price; if they'd left it at $120,000 like they originally stated, it would have been more of a "success".
also, in many ways it was just a normal HSV, just double the price tag...
e.g

Quote:

Originally Posted by XR6_190

Holden's do go better, GO OUT OF PRODUCTION THAT IS!

Seriously though, that shows just how arrogant they are, they seriously thought they had 427 sales sewn up as sure things. in the end they have only gotten a quarter of that. And before anybody says that I would be thinking different if it was a GTHO, well, if Ford ever get to build another GTHO, and it is priced more than 55k more than the next model down, I will say it is ridiculous, and if it has a substandard interior, I will say it is ridiculous.
cheers, Anthony

If the W427 had a classier interior, and a pricetag more like 125k, then it would of been a different story.

REVIEW from 2:10 onwards, interior...

4Vman · 17-04-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by velocity_avisGT

good on them for having a go. hopefully they'll, somehow, make a HO

:
i think (like many others) that the real killer was the price; if they'd left it at $120,000 like they originally stated, it would have been more of a "success".
also, in many ways it was just a normal HSV, just double the price tag...
e.g
REVIEW from 2:10 onwards, interior...

The reason they didnt leave the price at 120K was they would have lost money selling it at 120K.
The cost of building this car kept climbing day on day...

Coogs289 · 17-04-2009, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

The reason they didnt leave the price at 120K was they would have lost money selling it at 120K.
The cost of building this car kept climbing day on day...

that makes sense....
but just for the record, is it really worth double a normal HSV?
a lot of things are the same (refer to previous post, youtube link)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H76hj...eature=related
cheers, Anthony

Iggypoppin' · 17-04-2009, 07:59 PM

Ok-I never said the F6 beat it in a straight line. I meant, that in my opinion the F6 is a much better car for the money. W427 is a decent car but if I ever owned one I wouldn't feel fulfilled enough. Neither would my wallet. Applause for doing it. It is a credit to Holden that they did, yet everything has it's flaws.

ORSM-XT · 17-04-2009, 07:59 PM

There is one of these rolling around in shepp

looks alrite sounds alright but not as ORSM as the black F6310 with agents around town!

Cheerz,

vztrt · 17-04-2009, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

The reason they didnt leave the price at 120K was they would have lost money selling it at 120K.
The cost of building this car kept climbing day on day...

I doubt it made a profit, unfortunately.

gtxb67 · 17-04-2009, 08:07 PM

i never understood why they would build it - it may be an awesome car, but i could not see how they would sell 427 and even 200 at the price they needed to ask

it is a little surprising though that many people are hanging crap on hsv for being so adventurous
i hope they are not the same people who put down ford's conservative marketing
you can't have it both ways

Iggypoppin' · 17-04-2009, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghosn

Smoke much?

Cigarettes. Think about it. For the money, I'd have an F6. As it would need SFA to make it match a W427, and it's half the cost. Imagine insuring one. Now imagine pranging it. Now imagine how long it will take to fix...and as good as it is, I couldn't justify it...you'd be scared to take that thing anywhere, it is far too rare.

4Vman · 17-04-2009, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJXR6

Cigarettes. Think about it. For the money, I'd have an F6. As it would need SFA to make it match a W427, and it's half the cost. Imagine insuring one. Now imagine pranging it. Now imagine how long it will take to fix...and as good as it is, I couldn't justify it...you'd be scared to take that thing anywhere, it is far too rare.

You just answered your own question...

Scott · 17-04-2009, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Oh, and anyone who tries to compare this car to the blown Walky Clubsport at 99K or other aftermarket non adr compliant offerings is kidding themselves about what FACTORY performance really costs...
This car has serious DNA.. not just a snail bolted onto it to make pretty dyno numbers...

There is no comparison - HSV made a car that no-one wanted for the money. Big applause for them having a go but they missed the mark.

The W427, regardless of how brilliant, is an irrelevant car at that price, in this market, in these conditions. And if HSV didn't have an inkling that a recession wasn't too far off then they deserved to take a bath. It's not like the GFC is a new thing.....

I think they simply built the wrong car.

The right car (in my admittedly personal and un-educated opinion) was an ADR compliant, warranted blown LS3 with a tougher driveline, great suspension, same great brakes, a snappy body kit perhaps some special stitching on the seats. And it would have rolled out of the driveway at, or close to $100k producing something like the performance of the W427.

Iggypoppin' · 17-04-2009, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

You just answered your own question...

Question?

4Vman · 17-04-2009, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

I doubt it made a profit, unfortunately.

No chance at 120 units.. the whole business model was originally developed around 200 units over 2 years. 427 units come around some time later on after initial interest, but the real number was 200.
At 120 units the front bumper alone would amount to over $8K in costs per car.... Add a reasonable margin to that and you're over 10K out of 150K just on the front bumper.

Windsor220 · 17-04-2009, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP006

The W427, regardless of how brilliant, is an irrelevant car at that price, in this market, in these conditions. And if HSV didn't have an inkling that a recession wasn't too far off then they deserved to take a bath. It's not like the GFC is a new thing.....

It really does seem like a stupid idea when you look at it now with the GFC. Holden had a go but really wasnt a good business decision.

And before anyone says it, no I wasnt one of the people whinging about a GTHO. I think they shouldnt bother with one.

GT69 · 17-04-2009, 08:27 PM

God i hope they dont bother with a GTHO.

4Vman · 17-04-2009, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torxteer

It really does seem like a stupid idea when you look at it now with the GFC. Holden had a go but really wasnt a good business decision.

And before anyone says it, no I wasnt one of the people whinging about a GTHO. I think they shouldnt bother with one.

You all need to remember a car like the W427 didnt happen over night.. it was on the drawing board for some time.. development/R+D had been going on for years.. once a project like this gets past a certain point there's no turning back.. i too think its been caught out by bad timing.. but unfortunately things were far rosier when it was being planned than they are now. Ive always maintained that it wouldn't have gotten off the drawing board if initial planning took place at its release date.

Daymoe · 17-04-2009, 08:34 PM

IMO forget about the GTHO and bring that new green Focus in from Europe under FPV, something that actually might have a chance of selling, hot hatches these days seem to be what the public prefer. Who the HELL would pay $150K for something with a Holden/Ford badge when you could get something from BMW/Audi/*european brand here* top of the range models for the same price?

4Vman · 17-04-2009, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daymoe

IMO forget about the GTHO and bring that new green Focus in from Europe under FPV, something that actually might have a chance of selling, hot hatches these days seem to be what the public prefer. Who the HELL would pay $150K for something with a Holden/Ford badge when you could get something from BMW/Audi/*european brand here* top of the range models for the same price?

: oh dear....

Scott · 17-04-2009, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

: oh dear....

: +1

OZQUAD44 · 17-04-2009, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daymoe

Who the HELL would pay $150K for something with a Holden/Ford badge when you could get something from BMW/Audi/*european brand here* top of the range models for the same price?

I would, if it spent its time spanking the euro's in every department. Although, as you seem to suggest, A Ford or Holden will never have the right image for some no matter how good it is.

I have to agree with you about the GT HO. Unless I regularly see GTs doing wonderful things in production car racing, I never want to see a new GT HO on our roads. A "sticker kit" GTHO would be a travesty.

hardaz · 17-04-2009, 09:01 PM

Holden had a go, they always seem to be having a go and trying different things like the torana, coupe 60, monaro.
Ford don't seem to try much different at all. the shape of the new territory or even the fg for example.

Iggypoppin' · 17-04-2009, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hardaz

Holden had a go, they always seem to be having a go and trying different things like the torana, coupe 60, monaro.
Ford don't seem to try much different at all. the shape of the new territory or even the fg for example.

Could be wrong, but Holden would have had the funding more readily available than ford wouldn't they?

vztrt · 17-04-2009, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJXR6

Could be wrong, but Holden would have had the funding more readily available than ford wouldn't they?

Ford Australia was spending money on the new ranger also they developed the lazer for the Indian market.

4Vman · 17-04-2009, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daymoe

Who the HELL would pay $150K for something with a Holden/Ford badge when you could get something from BMW/Audi/*european brand here* top of the range models for the same price?

Ok, talking apples V apples and similar performance tell us all what a RS6, E63 or M5 is worth?

GT69 · 17-04-2009, 09:25 PM

Hell I'd spend $150,000 on a car, if it was the car I wanted

Iggypoppin' · 17-04-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Ford Australia was spending money on the new ranger also they developed the lazer for the Indian market.

Ah. Explains a bit.

4Vman, probably a sight more than a W427

HSE2 · 17-04-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

The GTHO badge will assure it will sell, and Ford wouldn't be stupid enough to sell it for more than 100k, Rod Barrett has already said they would want to keep it under that.

That's not what he has said.
You aren't going to keep a HO under 100k and have it worthy of the name.

He did say 150k was too expensive in his eyes for an Australian built car, but then again he doesn"t have an MRC bill.

Daymoe · 17-04-2009, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Ok, talking apples V apples and similar performance tell us all what a RS6, E63 or M5 is worth?

$200K+, but I reckon the BMW M3 could take on the W427 and thats $145K.

Elks · 17-04-2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

: oh dear....

+2

:

b2tf · 17-04-2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daymoe

Who the HELL would pay $150K for something with a Holden/Ford badge when you could get something from BMW/Audi/*european brand here* top of the range models for the same price?

It is this train of thought that will ensure that Australian manufacturers cannot sell things like W427 - if it had a Merc badge on it I am sure it would have sold a hell of a lot more. People want all the euro trimmings on an Aussie sedan budget and it just doesnt happen. You cant expect Ford/Holden etc to be able to produce euro style/quality cars when nobody buys the cars they build now - which for the record I think personally stand up to any beemer etc. Development costs money which is brought in by sales of your product and when you have people whinging about the product and not supporting it it won't go very far.

I personally would rather support Aussie companies and jobs and, in my opinion, get a better car for my money, rather than shell out just for the sake of a badge.

Coogs289 · 17-04-2009, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

It is this train of thought that will ensure that Australian manufacturers cannot sell things like W427 - if it had a Merc badge on it I am sure it would have sold a hell of a lot more. People want all the euro trimmings on an Aussie sedan budget and it just doesnt happen.

I personally would rather support Aussie companies and jobs and, in my opinion, get a better car for my money, rather than shell out just for the sake of a badge.

here here! Amen! +1 for that! agree 100%