5 yearly driving tests - Page 2

Auslandau · 12-09-2011, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

I see the main cause of confusion of road rules due to the fact that so many over 50's got their licence by driving the local copper around the block in a town that didn't even have a roundabout.

I fully encourage 5-yearly driving tests.

AH yes .... 30 years of driving experience accounts for nothing but someone who has just passed their license at 18 is the wizz. Until the license system is improved greatly then nothing will improve on the roads and 5 year tests as they stand mean zip.

You can never legislate against stupidity and anyone can get a license as long as they pay the money at the RTA and mange to survive a 20 minute drive ..... whether it be a copper around the block or an instructor with a clip board.

**Silver Ghia** · 12-09-2011, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geez Louise

I have to say that I don't see it as a bad thing.

I have been driving for a long time and I consider myself a good driver but there are new rules coming in all the time and having people brush up on basic driving skills, checking mirrors etc couldn't hurt.

Some drivers get overly confident so having them brush up/re-check their skills can't be a bad thing.

I think drivers generally know the rules and can drive very well, just see how everyone suddenly drives immaculately within the rules when a marked police car comes into the vicinity.

carbine · 12-09-2011, 09:55 PM

not a bad idea, but over here in wa the system is heavily overloaded as it is.

Falc'man · 12-09-2011, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auslandau

AH yes .... 30 years of driving experience accounts for nothing but someone who has just passed their license at 18 is the wizz. Until the license system is improved greatly then nothing will improve on the roads and 5 year tests as they stand mean zip.

You can never legislate against stupidity and anyone can get a license as long as they pay the money at the RTA and mange to survive a 20 minute drive ..... whether it be a copper around the block or an instructor with a clip board.

Far out. I kid you not I actually typed the same thing (not word for word

) re the 30 years experience but deleted it. They're exactly my sentiments.
When law makers stop thinking about lining their pockets, we'll find actual progress in all aspects.

vanman_75 · 12-09-2011, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parkway

Motorcyclists can't always be the victim here, though. A few years back I nearly witnessed what could have been a fatal crash for a bike rider because of his stupidity. You wouldn't believe what he did.

I'm sure most experienced drivers know to be cautious when driving because of potential cyclists, but it has to be understood, they can be very difficult to see sometimes and from experience, most people don't have enough time/effort to check twice.

Also, I don't know what the rules regarding motorcyclists are. Can they legally ride through the middle of the traffic? Can they sit next to you on a single lane set of lights? This information would be handy

To conclude, in my opinion, this test will do nothing. Anyone ever seen World's Strictest Parents?

Yes a bike can lane split ( in Queensland ) I very rarely do it unless there is a slow vehicle up front ie truck as its safer for a bike to be in the clear . If there are any performance looking or bogan looking cars up front then no way , they will only have the poos , and try to race you .I always ride with the knowledge that I am hard to see so I don't sit in blind spots etc . yes it should be known to the general road users about such rules , but I find it much safer thinkin that they don't and treat it as such .

hawker · 12-09-2011, 11:35 PM

In theory it sounds like a decent idea, in practice, sounds like a mess waiting to happen. I think two major things just need to be fixed:

1) Fix up the testing system, make sure people are being trained by good drivers. Best idea the NT had was, if you go to a driving class held through the NT Education System (ie. a school) you got 8 free lessons with a driving school.

2) Police and the courts should concentrate on taking rubbish drivers off the road. Make them do extra driving classes and change their attitude. If all you're doing is getting people to take a test, they can fake it and pass easily, but if you actually work with them to change their attitude, you'll get a much better result!

uranium_death · 12-09-2011, 11:50 PM

Proof that the current system is failing:

Crossing The Kingsway in Glen Waverley with a green walking man (clearly visible - it was night time) and a lovely young oriental girl with a p-plate on her car almost ran us down, not realising we had right of way...

How can somebody that just got their license be so damn clueless?

I support driving tests every five years in theory alone. In practice, the system simply doesn't work.

I think that the quality of teaching is terrible nowadays with people like Jimmy Fong teaching young people how to drive when "indicator" or "road manners" are yet to enter his vocabulary...

Perhaps inflammatory, but I just think it's a concern...

Fordlover1313 · 13-09-2011, 04:11 PM

i agree with it

2011G6E · 13-09-2011, 04:55 PM

"I've been driving for thirty years and I don't need to be tested again!".

Sure...you've "never had an accident", but you've probably caused dozens.

Never mistake "experience" for "skill"...

flappist · 13-09-2011, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

"I've been driving for thirty years and I don't need to be tested again!".

Sure...you've "never had an accident", but you've probably caused dozens.

Never mistake "experience" for "skill"...

Interestingly at the most recent skidpan day I attended it was not the older drivers who were spinning out and falling off the track even though they were getting the best times......

Falc'man · 13-09-2011, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Interestingly at the most recent skidpan day I attended it was not the older drivers who were spinning out and falling off the track even though they were getting the best times......

Maybe they're used to driving with caution and take less risks. The difference is these young hot-heads try the same on the road and find themselves in the hereafter.

Papa Smurf · 13-09-2011, 05:24 PM

With so many people breaking road rules daily and some just couldn't care, I think this would be a GREAT idea. I have advocated this to friends over the last 15 years and so many said I was nuts. They said it would cost too much and it wouldn't work now, someone has come up with the idea and gotten press for it.

I think it would be a step in the right direction, maybe the Gov could look into it (every state) and try, even if there were a small cost to cover papaer work.

2011G6E · 13-09-2011, 05:28 PM

I think people are missing the point...the important thing isn't how long you've been driving, it's how well you drive and how much you know about the road rules. They'll soon weed out the bad drivers of all ages and get them on the damn bus where they belong.

As i said, don't mistake experience for skill...just because you've been doing something for years, doesn't automatically mean you know everything there is to know about it and possess the required skills. It could well mean you've just been damn lucky so far not to come to grief.

**Revolver** · 13-09-2011, 05:39 PM

Echoing the sentiments of "Great idea in theory, but in practice....."

I completely agree, if implemented correctly, this would help some people sharpen up their act.

This is actually an excerpt of an email I sent to a radio program a few months back

Quote:

There is a lack of driver education education in this country to start with. While kudos is given to everyone who has done a defensive driving course (I have completed two, & plan to do a whole lot more) & have an understanding of how a car behaves in the wet, dry, snow, with under & over-steer, how weight shifting effects these situations, it is rather alarming how many people DON'T know the techniques to control their cars in all conditions.

A nation-wide standard driving training & etiquette program should be introduced & made compulsory. Including a number of defensive driving courses, road etiquette, & basic car maintaince such as oil, coolant, tyre pressures, etc. Checks & maintaince, as well as roadside tyre-changing should be taught, no matter if your the daughter of a multi-millionaire, or the son of a mechanic. & you must be proficient at all facets of the course to earn the privilege of your drivers licence. As apposed to strapping in a young teenager & "teaching" them "how to drive". Yet its such a wonder why our road toll is so high........

Moreover, a refresher course should be brought into play for all drivers who currently have their licence to keep up to date, & informed on road rule changes & etiquette's. A classic example of this, is on Wednesday night, on a two lane motorway, I was over-taking a car in the left lane, I am in the right lane, on the speed limit of 80 when the car in front of the car I am overtaking, flashes once to indicate he is pulling into the right lane, & simply moves over, causing me to brake hard, & pass him in the left lane. What's more, is there was no visible traffic in front of us, & no turnoffs for at least 5kms. (I travel that road daily) Pulling alongside, I looked to see it was an elderly gentleman, in an old 4wd ute, with both his hands on top of the steering-wheel. In serious need of both driving technique & etiquette's there......

Thats my feelings. Yes, while experience shouldn't be confused with skill, skill isn't always enough to get you out of or being able avoid tricky situations. Its the experience of being there before, & knowing what to do that can seriously help your chances of minimalising damage, or even avoid an incident at all. Just having raw skill isnt enough. But without having skill in the first place means (pardon the pun) a long hard road to being a good driver........

Auslandau · 13-09-2011, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I think people are missing the point...the important thing isn't how long you've been driving, it's how well you drive and how much you know about the road rules. They'll soon weed out the bad drivers of all ages and get them on the damn bus where they belong.

As i said, don't mistake experience for skill...just because you've been doing something for years, doesn't automatically mean you know everything there is to know about it and possess the required skills. It could well mean you've just been damn lucky so far not to come to grief.

^ Spoken by someone who is more skilled but less experienced .........

Really ... I have heard it all now but I know who I would rather be sitting next to in the passenger seat.

Franco Cozzo · 13-09-2011, 05:51 PM

Also there is a BIG problem with the wait time to actually sit a damn test, when I did mine it was a 3 month wait.

BENT_8 · 13-09-2011, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

Motorists already know what is right and what is wrong; my concern is, would a simple test actually get people to do the right thing? That is, they know that texting while driving is dangerous, but it's the complacent attitude, lack of courtesy to others' safety, impatience, or whatever, that doesn't prevent them from doing this.

This is why I see it more of an inconvenience and money grabbing exercise. Spend the revenue money on more highway patrol officers because a speed camera can't see any of the stupidity that goes on on our roads.

Couldnt have said it better myself!

In a perfect world it would be a great idea, however, as you've pointed out its more about driver attitude than knowledge of the rules.

Take myself for example.
Got my license at 17, found a great instructor who was thorough and took me through the log book system which took me 6 lessons to pass.
Spent the next 18 years achieving every bad habit he warned me about. Fortunately i was lucky in that i avoided any accidents.
Just recently i sat my MR truck license.
Spent the first 2 hours of the test pulling my hair and abusing myself. Not because i couldnt drive the truck, that was easy, but learning the mirror checks and intersection checks and to indicate before i brake, which is difficult for me as i always check my brakes way before the turn etc.
Drove me and the instructor nuts.

Anyway, eventually i got the swing of it and passed succesfully, infact he invited me back to upgrade anytime and said to ask for him to take me.

The thing is though, 3 months later and im back to my old habits, so the 9 hr on road scruitineering did nothing to improve my long term attitude.

I doubt a 5 year test would have much impact unfortunately.

asdf1234 · 13-09-2011, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

That is really interesting. Please elaborate.
The amusing thing with P-platers is just the day before when they were on the Learners they were driving like an old citizen 20 kph below the limit (which I have time for, it's understandable) but when they get the Ps they're invincible. I'm not having a go at any P licensed motorists rather it proves the point that attitude is not something that is being taught, nor is it captured by a one-eyed camera.

Yeah that's what I meant. After you drive for a while you forget how to drive 20kph like you did to get your license. Get tested again and chances are you will fail. For example how many people actually drives with both hands on the wheel all the time (shifting not counted).

Tors77AU · 13-09-2011, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

Motorists already know what is right and what is wrong; my concern is, would a simple test actually get people to do the right thing? That is, they know that texting while driving is dangerous, but it's the complacent attitude, lack of courtesy to others' safety, impatience, or whatever, that doesn't prevent them from doing this.

This is why I see it more of an inconvenience and money grabbing exercise. Spend the revenue money on more highway patrol officers because a speed camera can't see any of the stupidity that goes on on our roads.

That is really interesting. Please elaborate.
The amusing thing with P-platers is just the day before when they were on the Learners they were driving like an old citizen 20 kph below the limit (which I have time for, it's understandable) but when they get the Ps they're invincible. I'm not having a go at any P licensed motorists rather it proves the point that attitude is not something that is being taught, nor is it captured by a one-eyed camera.

My dad taught me to drive in 1990 when i was 13 years old, I bought my 1st car at 16 and got my L's i drove by myself without l plates on for years (couldnt be bothered to sit P's test.). then i got my L's again bought another car, did the same thing again. Got pulled over for rbt 2 hours drive down the coast. copped $67 fine for no L plates and $67 fine for no Black liscenced driver onboard. cop let me drive away after asking if i was meeting some one to drive home with. i replied no.

Bought another car got my L's again after they expired. By this time i was 20 years old. Kept driving no plates no passenger. Only reason i got L's is its a cheaper fine than unliscened and uninsured. continued this untill i was 27 when i got pulled over for the 3rd time ever. But L's had expired, had to go to court for the 1st time and got susspended from obtaining a Liscence for 6months. Also was told looking at 18month inside and $2000 fine for repeat offence within % years.

Ive never had an accident or caused an accident. perfect driving record up until i finally bothered to get my P's, Now im the target of every F-WIT on the road, I do ALOT of driving, More than 1000Kms a week for work, then i usally travell up or down the coast to surf anywhere from the vic boarder to port macquarie from sydney. Im very experienced, yet ive never in the 21 years ive been driving copped so much crap from driver because i have P plates on now.

If i was driving in the left lane on a highway doing 100 in a 110 zone oin cruise control and all the daydreamers are doing 90-95 as soon as i overtake them they want to go 120 to overtake me. Ive had the same 3 cars do it to me all the way from newcastle to port mac. I get cut off and abused and cop the bird for no reason at all. People just have to be infront of me all the time, sit up my ****, try to race me at lights.

October long weekend 2010. (this all happened right infront of highway patrol, i had my cruise control on the whole time and the whole thing happened in less than 3 or 4 seconds) Im on the F3 coming home from port mac, Just driven 1300K with the cruise on, get to ourimbah, in the left lane. coming around a long right hand bend at kangi angi, known spot for highway patrol. theres a caravan in the left lane about 100m infront of meteravelling at about 60Kmh, an 8 car prossesion of cars in the right lane travelling ay 120+ and an empty middle lane.

I put on my right indicator, check over my shoulder, check my mirrors, all clear, change lanes, then when im 3/4's into the lane a chop from the middle of the pack of speeders in the right lane changes lanes right on top of me, clips my mirror, i swerve back into left lane to avoid horrific multiple car accident, quickly change back into middle lane to avoid running up **** of caravan, behind the idiot who cut me off. He sees the radar gun and slams on the brakes fades it to about 80 less than a car length infront of me, (hes in a small SUV) it stops quicker than my BF wagon loaded to the brim is ever going to.

I have no choice now but to quickly pick a gap into the right lane into the gap that idiot who cut me off left in the pack of speeders (who havent noticed radar yet) who are still doing 120, i tap the trottle pick the gap, then slow down the cars behind me. three cars infront of me speed straght past radar and the police book me for 116 because i have my P's.

They followed me for a few K's 1st in which time the same Idiot who cause the whole situation proceeds to cut me off again very dangerously right infront of the police. The police dont book him for neg driving instead they ruin my life by booking me for speeding on double demerits and i loose my P's for 3 months.
If i didnt do what i did i wouldnt be typing this right now, but because i have my P's im a target for the police aswell even though i have a better friving record and more years experience than the cop who booked me.

Some one tell me why just because i have P plates on that i have a bullseye on my car for stupidity?

Tors77AU · 13-09-2011, 07:53 PM

There are sooo many people on the road who dont have what it takes, just because you drive nicely fro 20 minutes in a test shouldnt mean that you can drive a deadly weapon.

All drivers should have to sit advanced driver course. And if you dont have the skill then to f-ing bad.
Driving is a privilage, not a right! You dont see 17 year old kids flying planes after a 20 practicle exame on their own do you? how is a car any different?

Franco Cozzo · 13-09-2011, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tors77AU

Some one tell me why just because i have P plates on that i have a bullseye on my car for stupidity?

Because they can single you out.

Though, I've never had issues with police, mainly just over drivers tailgating me the only accident I've had was with another P plater

who just got his license a few months ago before the accident who caused it.

I guess with police it comes down to what car you drive, and where you hang around. If you drive a Falcon/Commodore or jap import, expect police harassment.

I'm surprised no cops have tried to get me on my driving lights, they're done legally but its interesting no one has seen it thinking easy opportunity for a defect or something/

graham7773 · 13-09-2011, 08:27 PM

I am agreeing with the idea that there should be legislation for 5 or 10 year refresher courses ie advanced driver training. Sudsy ^ is on to a good idea. New road rule, all motor cyclists, scooter riders and push bike riders should be required to wear high visibility (dayglo) jackets. If it is good enough for a worker on a building site, why not on a public road where anything that hits you will be going a lot faster than most things on a work/construction site. My 11 cents worth.

Parkway · 13-09-2011, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tors77AU

Some one tell me why just because i have P plates on that i have a bullseye on my car for stupidity?

Because it is assumed by all, that P-Platers are the bowels of the on-road society.

The P-Plates are an identifiable tag that means you're a suspect of being young, immature and egotistical with no experience whatsoever and this is coming from a P-plater, mind you.

We're not all bad drivers, but it's those stupid platers that drink drive, speed and take huge risks that reinforce this stereotype that P-platers are on the road to pull skids and deliberately run people over and it frustrates me that the responsible ones are caught up in the mess as well. At least it's not forever.

flappist · 13-09-2011, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graham7773

I am agreeing with the idea that there should be legislation for 5 or 10 year refresher courses ie advanced driver training. Sudsy ^ is on to a good idea. New road rule, all motor cyclists, scooter riders and push bike riders should be required to wear high visibility (dayglo) jackets. If it is good enough for a worker on a building site, why not on a public road where anything that hits you will be going a lot faster than most things on a work/construction site. My 11 cents worth.

Well then all black and grey cars should be banned for exactly the same reason. All cars will now be dayglow yellow as well.

On mine/work/construction sites all vehicles have flashing yellow lights so maybe they should be mandatory too.

And of course all distractions such as stereos, phones and of course noisy exhausts should be removed and replaced with Mr Whippy chimes.

And pedestrians will have to wear bright colours and be prohibited from using distraction such as mobile phones when within 100m of a road.

OR

People can just stop blaming everyone else, mind their own business, have respect for others and ensure that they are actually up to scratch in the knowledge and skills.

Franco Cozzo · 13-09-2011, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

On mine/work/construction sites all vehicles have flashing yellow lights so maybe they should be mandatory too.

Please do, business will be a boomin' at work.

vanman_75 · 13-09-2011, 09:04 PM

Only if cars are all white with reflective stripes , roll bars, vhf radio , data collection ,call sign on doors ( so I can call you as I get close to you ) flashing lights ( so I see ya coming from that driveway ) ....are you getting what I'm saying or should I continue.
I will say it again no test will stop fools / accidents / mistakes / lack of respect / ...not humanly possible , train right once vigilantly and we will fix it in time .
I'm really over do gooders and money grabs ....end rant

vanman_75 · 13-09-2011, 09:09 PM

Lol like minds on this subject flappist , sorry all for that one had it typed already

Yellow_Festiva · 13-09-2011, 09:20 PM

What I don't get is that when you get your rego renewal, you get a leaflet on how to get the best price on your greenslip but no info on the latest road rule changes that have come into effect in the past 12 months.

Would it hurt to slip in a few pages, reminding drivers of correct round about manners as well as many other rules that are not all that well known (and should be??).

Chopped · 13-09-2011, 09:54 PM

5 year testing seems good but would end up being a pain in the whatsy for all the people who are good drivers.
The government couldn't resist turning the idea into a increasing revenue stream with little actual benefit.
And in the end all of the usual turkeys would still be causing accidents.

Ban turkeys.

Falc'man · 13-09-2011, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

What I don't get is that when you get your rego renewal, you get a leaflet on how to get the best price on your greenslip but no info on the latest road rule changes that have come into effect in the past 12 months.

Would it hurt to slip in a few pages, reminding drivers of correct round about manners as well as many other rules that are not all that well known (and should be??).

That is a good point; if there are new rules there should at least be a mail-out, and not even wait a potential 12 months.
The last time there was a rule change though I think they had ads for it on tv, regarding roundabouts? Since then... nothing that I can think of.

On a good note, I don't think it's all as bad as people think. I spend a fair amount of time on the road and by my observations 99.9% of motorists are quite sensible.