Doesn't like superchargers

[xr8cam]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Nice- I had a 1600 MK 11 Cortina head ported/polished, big valves, twin dcoe 40 mm webber side draft with trumpets and socks. Only musical instrument I was able to make music sound good from.

Driving from Melbourne to Horsham to go rock climbing I used to sit on under the tail of semi trailers for hours on end - they seemed to know what I was doing- really helped petrol reduction on Austudy- thanks Whitlam and the labour years...

Love early Cortina's. My first car was MkI GT-1500. I bought it from a friends Aunty of all people. It was straight & original but I had to get rust in the rear tyre well's cut out. That car did 115mph (down hill) as it was and used to go 'round corners on 3 wheels if you couldn't get the rear to slide.That is the car I probably miss the most out of some special Fords I have been lucky to own. Sold it to a bloke who destroyed it in a few months...I always loved MkII Cortina's, so different to Mk1. Don't remember seeing car companys do that very often, 2nd model completely different to the first.

[cycle myth]

yeah - each to their own.

I love the sound of an 8, even more you hear in the distance someone wind up a super charged one.

But if I had to live with one it would be a turbo V8.

May not sound as good on the outside to others on vs. supercharged, but to live with the sound, power vs the the whine of the supercharger - best daily drive.

[jimt3te50]

I've got a turbo six, a big hp blown 8, a warm n/a 351 Clevo and even a twin turbo diesel V6 with a synthetic exhaust note... They've all got their place but a blown V8 is like a meat pie and sauce, they're just made for each other. Sound is subjective though, like saying blue is the best colour. I love having the choice but if I could only choose one, it'd be blown 8 Every minute of every day...

[LoudPipes]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Yip- everyone has their own take.

I use my FGX XR8 as a daily, and really only hear the whine when I boot it- and never get bored with it.

Drove my brothers AMG C63 for a week- and really missed the front end mechanical cacophony of the Miami blower quad cam.

Miami is like being in the middle of a 3 some, non blown is like vanilla 2 some- not saying this from experience of the analogy- more wishful dreaming......

Those piddly sounding AMG C63’s don’t come close to the sound of a blown Miami.

My ears always prefer the sound of a worked over naturally aspirated V8 over anything else and even more so if that is an old school V8.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by LoudPipes

Those piddly sounding AMG C63’s don’t come close to the sound of a blown Miami.

My ears always prefer the sound of a worked over naturally aspirated V8 over anything else and even more so if that is an old school V8.

Thing is his is the sports pack version, ie more free flowing exhaust, and he has extractors as well- so it is really LOUD and aggressive. If you pump the pedal a little before hitting the start button the engine start up sounds like a big bore 500 nitro express rifle cracking its load.

The Miami on start up sounds xxxx beer weak to be honest.

Also, WOT the C63 is deeper and more aggressive than the Miami, although the Miami over 4,000 WOT has a real pushed edge to the exhaust note which is cool.

But, the C63 does not have that supercharger banshee wailing up front, and to me it is Nirvana, the bark behind and the mechanical banshee wail up front WOT- is a unique sound.

Everyone is different- I love the sound of high tech v8s with quad cams and 4 valves, and a supercharger banshee wailing is just an extra cherry on top.

And I have been in cammed supercharged Holden V8s, and although deep and loud from the rear, they do not produce that banshee high tech wail that a Miami does.

The Miami with the quad cam 4 valves and supercharger intake plenum arrangement is something special....in terms of sound up front. Nothing quite like it.

First day I bought my car I uhmm tested it round the Lake that night for uhm some time. The salesman who sold it rang me at work next day, asking - was that you last night at 10.30 - hard to mistake that sound...he lived in Eleebana and recognized the sound...just a classic unique tone.

[PooDog]

i reckon its like listening to music ,sometimes you want loud metal and sometimes you need something cruisey

love the sound of a blower ...and love the sound of a cammed windsor on start up in the morning
and i know i would love the sound of a 5.2l flat plane crank at 8200rpm

different motors for different moods ....just all fords

[Mercury Bullet]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Thing is his is the sports pack version, ie more free flowing exhaust, and he has extractors as well- so it is really LOUD and aggressive. If you pump the pedal a little before hitting the start button the engine start up sounds like a big bore 500 nitro express rifle cracking its load.

The Miami on start up sounds xxxx beer weak to be honest.

Also, WOT the C63 is deeper and more aggressive than the Miami, although the Miami over 4,000 WOT has a real pushed edge to the exhaust note which is cool.

But, the C63 does not have that supercharger banshee wailing up front, and to me it is Nirvana, the bark behind and the mechanical banshee wail up front WOT- is a unique sound.

Everyone is different- I love the sound of high tech v8s with quad cams and 4 valves, and a supercharger banshee wailing is just an extra cherry on top.

And I have been in cammed supercharged Holden V8s, and although deep and loud from the rear, they do not produce that banshee high tech wail that a Miami does.

The Miami with the quad cam 4 valves and supercharger intake plenum arrangement is something special....in terms of sound up front. Nothing quite like it.

First day I bought my car I uhmm tested it round the Lake that night for uhm some time. The salesman who sold it rang me at work next day, asking - was that you last night at 10.30 - hard to mistake that sound...he lived in Eleebana and recognized the sound...just a classic unique tone.

Haha.

You're going to be upping that redline to seven grand soon.

*I believe Ford ran one for 800 hours straight on the dyno at 7500rpm....nudge, nudge.
Coyote tho...

[mitelsx2000]

Originally Posted by Mercury Bullet

Couldn't care less about the whine, it's not that loud and certainly not intrusive. Most of the time it's in bypass mode anyway.

I love the power delivery though.

Same here love the S/C doing its thing better than the wife whining in the passenger seat

[Bent8]

Listen to an SLR 722 scream past you and you will know the greatness of a supercharged V8 !

I still love the angry roar of AMG's M156 but every time I hear that blower whine in my GT, it puts a grin on my face.... every single time !

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Yip- everyone has their own take.

I use my FGX XR8 as a daily, and really only hear the whine when I boot it- and never get bored with it.

Drove my brothers AMG C63 for a week- and really missed the front end mechanical cacophony of the Miami blower quad cam.

Miami is like being in the middle of a 3 some, non blown is like vanilla 2 some- not saying this from experience of the analogy- more wishful dreaming......

6.2 or 4.0TT?

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Cobra

6.2 or 4.0TT?

6.2 sports pack, extractors. In manual paddle shift mode it does sound wicked from the rear end, especially on the software mapping rev matching on downchanges....had the sunroof open at all times.

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by asagaai

6.2 sports pack, extractors. In manual paddle shift mode it does sound wicked from the rear end, especially on the software mapping rev matching on downchanges....had the sunroof open at all times.

Nice. How does its grunt compare to the blown 5 litre?

[PHawk]

Originally Posted by mitelsx2000

Same here love the S/C doing its thing better than the wife whining in the passenger seat

I'll tell her you said that Tony!!!

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Cobra

Nice. How does its grunt compare to the blown 5 litre?

The 6.2 is mated to an auto. So when you hit the power there is like a slight lag, and the power comes on a little slow, and then blooms. Then when the 6.2 hits its straps it pulls hard right up to 6,700 rpm odd. This "delay" is there- but its relative- not like hitting a slushbox delay in your normal crapbox.

In contrast my Miami is manual, and combined with the characteristics of the supercharger means there is absolutely no lag with power, and if the revs are 3,500 odd and if in second and higher, the power hits brutally and virtually instantaneously and those who drive these know the engine absolutely screams from 4,500 to rev limiter of 6,200 odd all to quickly.

So, the 6.2 is a bit more laggy or "lazy" to come on, but when it blooms it has a longer band of pulling- ie quite a bit higher redline. The Miami in manual has no lag, vicious power snap when revs are 3,500 and above, and has a shorter band before the chimes start chirping and limiter kicks in.

This difference in power delivery is what resulted in my brother crashing out my car round a roundabout onto a freeway onramp- in second gear, revs about 3,500 odd and then when he WOT it and held it, and him expecting that laggy delay before it hit.

And- I have learnt because of this, if you are doing that with the Miami traction off, as you WOT you pre-empt the snap and actually start pre-correction movement with the tiller. Well the Miami came on much earlier and harder than he was expecting based on his 6.2, and he overcooked it and you really have to drive a Miami with traction off to appreciate how hard and fast they can snap.

So in a way the 6.2 is sorta more smooth "lazy" but grows into a longer power bloom, and in contrast the Miami is a more brutal out the box and a handful, but runs out of legs earlier.

[Express]

Originally Posted by asagaai

The 6.2 is mated to an auto. So when you hit the power there is like a slight lag, and the power comes on a little slow, and then blooms. Then when the 6.2 hits its straps it pulls hard right up to 6,700 rpm odd. This "delay" is there- but its relative- not like hitting a slushbox delay in your normal crapbox.

In contrast my Miami is manual, and combined with the characteristics of the supercharger means there is absolutely no lag with power, and if the revs are 3,500 odd and if in second and higher, the power hits brutally and virtually instantaneously and those who drive these know the engine absolutely screams from 4,500 to rev limiter of 6,200 odd all to quickly.

So, the 6.2 is a bit more laggy or "lazy" to come on, but when it blooms it has a longer band of pulling- ie quite a bit higher redline. The Miami in manual has no lag, vicious power snap when revs are 3,500 and above, and has a shorter band before the chimes start chirping and limiter kicks in.

This difference in power delivery is what resulted in my brother crashing out my car round a roundabout onto a freeway onramp- in second gear, revs about 3,500 odd and then when he WOT it and held it, and him expecting that laggy delay before it hit.

And- I have learnt because of this, if you are doing that with the Miami traction off, as you WOT you pre-empt the snap and actually start pre-correction movement with the tiller. Well the Miami came on much earlier and harder than he was expecting based on his 6.2, and he overcooked it and you really have to drive a Miami with traction off to appreciate how hard and fast they can snap.

So in a way the 6.2 is sorta more smooth "lazy" but grows into a longer power bloom, and in contrast the Miami is a more brutal out the box and a handful, but runs out of legs earlier.

Strange how you brother’s car reacts differently to mine.

In sports mode (not manual mode) and with traction on it jumps instantaneously with a little wiggle of the bum and would take a quick car to beat it to 100km/h, it’s then that it lacks the rush of my mate's supercharged Falcon and as you’ve pointed out it comes back into its own as it revs out and starts to get some serious velocity happening.

Up high the Merc preforms better and even more so if both cars have the limiter switched off but in the midrange which is where most of us live, the Falcon is the winner.

The Merc also jumps faster than my mate's manual Falcon.

With traction off both cars will easily skin the tyres to the rims.

Mine gets the occasional hit out from a standing start and runs on 285 wide rears, maybe your brother’s car needs to be exercised more and the software will learn to launch hard.

I’ve got a new twin turbo car on order and from what I’ve been told the forced induction model no longer has that soft spot in the middle and a aftermarket tune does both the N/A and turbo'd models wonders or even to just popping in the E63 tunes will waken them up.

[xr8cam]

Originally Posted by asagaai

The 6.2 is mated to an auto. So when you hit the power there is like a slight lag, and the power comes on a little slow, and then blooms. Then when the 6.2 hits its straps it pulls hard right up to 6,700 rpm odd. This "delay" is there- but its relative- not like hitting a slushbox delay in your normal crapbox.

In contrast my Miami is manual, and combined with the characteristics of the supercharger means there is absolutely no lag with power, and if the revs are 3,500 odd and if in second and higher, the power hits brutally and virtually instantaneously and those who drive these know the engine absolutely screams from 4,500 to rev limiter of 6,200 odd all to quickly.

So, the 6.2 is a bit more laggy or "lazy" to come on, but when it blooms it has a longer band of pulling- ie quite a bit higher redline. The Miami in manual has no lag, vicious power snap when revs are 3,500 and above, and has a shorter band before the chimes start chirping and limiter kicks in.

ng that laggy delay before it hit. s differencThie in power delivery is what resulted in my brother crashing out my car round a roundabout onto a freeway onramp- in second gear, revs about 3,500 odd and then when he WOT it and held it, and him expecti

And- I have learnt because of this, if you are doing that with the Miami traction off, as you WOT you pre-empt the snap and actually start pre-correction movement with the tiller. Well the Miami came on much earlier and harder than he was expecting based on his 6.2, and he overcooked it and you really have to drive a Miami with traction off to appreciate how hard and fast they can snap.

So in a way the 6.2 is sorta more smooth "lazy" but grows into a longer power bloom, and in contrast the Miami is a more brutal out the box and a handful, but runs out of legs earlier.

Looks like there will be a lot of these in wrecking yards pretty soon, maybe I will be able to afford one

[LoudPipes]

Originally Posted by asagaai

So, the 6.2 is a bit more laggy or "lazy" to come on, but when it blooms it has a longer band of pulling- ie quite a bit higher redline. The Miami in manual has no lag, vicious power snap when revs are 3,500 and above, and has a shorter band before the chimes start chirping and limiter kicks in.

I've owned a few AMG's and laggy or lazy down low is the last way I'd ever describe them.

Those N/A M156 engines release a lot of that 650Nm of torque from very low down and from all reports on the MB Forums the new T/T M157 is even more ferocious.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Express

Strange how you brother’s car reacts differently to mine.

Up high the Merc preforms better and even more so if both cars have the limiter switched off but in the midrange which is where most of us live, the Falcon is the winner.

I’ve got a new twin turbo car on order and from what I’ve been told the forced induction model no longer has that soft spot in the middle and a aftermarket tune does both the N/A and turbo'd models wonders or even to just popping in the E63 tunes will waken them up.

Express-no issue on that high end rush in an AMG C63, it is mesmerising at higher speeds and is unrelenting, tunnel vision inducing- feels so much like a bike.

But cars are individual, my brothers was owned by a retired surgeon for the first 12,000 km who traded it in with the comment of superfluous power for my needs, and it uses a lot of oil.

My car I drove very hard from the start, but was OCD with oil changes, and it is quite mental now and with intercooler and the responsiveness of power had the main Kloster guy suspecting me of having a tune.

I just gave the best explanation between the 2 I could, and when I say laggy or delay, it is relative, slight but there, especially compared to mine. A person who hopped in used to driving normal cars would think the 6.2 instant viciousness- but it is only when you drive other machinery and get to know it well, that these issues become transparent.

And this difference in power delivery between the Miami and 6.2 explains why I am presently driving a crapbox Captiva and just amazed at how bad some cars brakes/centre of gravity are.......

[blackf6]

Originally Posted by asagaai

The Miami on start up sounds xxxx beer weak to be honest.

Drink the carton, not one stubbie mate. Get into it.

[TS50AU]

I'll throw my 2cents worth in here!
Daily driver is my 2012 R-Spec. No, the blower whine never gets old (nor the shove in the back!), but for me it's more about induction noise. ANY induction noise, whether it was the twin 42's on my '63 Mk1 Cortina, the blower on the GT, the H-H-Holley on the old XB (that doubled as a horn!), that gutteral echo of the T3 intake or even the home brew turbo on the GQ diesel tow wagon. If it's screaming, whining or whistling from the front of the car it gets the juices flowing. One of the most epic drives I've ever had was in a Gallardo - if for nothing else but that shriek from behind you every time you prod it with the right foot... And why I'm looking forward sooooooooo much to quad IDA's on the XC. It's all about big engines gulping air - Lots of it.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by blackf6

Drink the carton, not one stubbie mate. Get into it.

Did that when I was in Darwin.

Nowadays prefer a thick ale like coopers vintage/or a beer like Angry Man, have 3, ok maybe 4, and then it is time to call it a day and start snoring with my feet up......

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Did that when I was in Darwin.

Waay off topic but..... you drank a carton of Darwin Stubbies ?

[Mercury Bullet]

Probably the equivalent at the old workers club in Cavanagh st on a couple of occasions.

I wonder if that old joint is still there...

[Bent8]

Originally Posted by asagaai

The 6.2 is mated to an auto. So when you hit the power there is like a slight lag, and the power comes on a little slow, and then blooms. Then when the 6.2 hits its straps it pulls hard right up to 6,700 rpm odd. This "delay" is there- but its relative- not like hitting a slushbox delay in your normal crapbox.

So in a way the 6.2 is sorta more smooth "lazy" but grows into a longer power bloom, and in contrast the Miami is a more brutal out the box and a handful, but runs out of legs earlier.

Also worth noting is the gearing in both cars.... the Miami (ZF) will pull 170+ in 3rd while the C63 will just manage 150kph... same with 2nd gear, about 115 for the Miami vs 100 for the AMG

Did you notice any delays in manual mode?... apparently the 7G tronic is picky when down shifting...

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Bent8

Also worth noting is the gearing in both cars.... the Miami (ZF) will pull 170+ in 3rd while the C63 will just manage 150kph... same with 2nd gear, about 115 for the Miami vs 100 for the AMG

Did you notice any delays in manual mode?... apparently the 7G tronic is picky when down shifting...

The C63 has a 7 speed box. The car I drove had the Sports mode in auto, not the additional Sports + mode. The AMG C63 with Sports + mode was more direct and quick in power delivery when I drove that version - so that may explain the differences in my experiences to what Loudpipes found.

But yes- the early 2012 version I drove a lot with only sports mode is sometimes a tad slow to change down, and sometimes refuses if the speeds are deemed wrong by the software.

[ebxr8240]

Originally Posted by xr8cam

I remember a bunch of mates who loved their red motor powered EH & HR sedans who all got gear drives, they loved em! Back in the days when K-mart sold 12 slotters and super, (petrol), cost $0:45 per/l. I had a RS2000,ported & cammed with twin 45mm Webber's and I often used $100 p/week on petrol!

Me too..

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by asagaai

The 6.2 is mated to an auto. So when you hit the power there is like a slight lag, and the power comes on a little slow, and then blooms. Then when the 6.2 hits its straps it pulls hard right up to 6,700 rpm odd. This "delay" is there- but its relative- not like hitting a slushbox delay in your normal crapbox.

In contrast my Miami is manual, and combined with the characteristics of the supercharger means there is absolutely no lag with power, and if the revs are 3,500 odd and if in second and higher, the power hits brutally and virtually instantaneously and those who drive these know the engine absolutely screams from 4,500 to rev limiter of 6,200 odd all to quickly.

So, the 6.2 is a bit more laggy or "lazy" to come on, but when it blooms it has a longer band of pulling- ie quite a bit higher redline. The Miami in manual has no lag, vicious power snap when revs are 3,500 and above, and has a shorter band before the chimes start chirping and limiter kicks in.

This difference in power delivery is what resulted in my brother crashing out my car round a roundabout onto a freeway onramp- in second gear, revs about 3,500 odd and then when he WOT it and held it, and him expecting that laggy delay before it hit.

And- I have learnt because of this, if you are doing that with the Miami traction off, as you WOT you pre-empt the snap and actually start pre-correction movement with the tiller. Well the Miami came on much earlier and harder than he was expecting based on his 6.2, and he overcooked it and you really have to drive a Miami with traction off to appreciate how hard and fast they can snap.

So in a way the 6.2 is sorta more smooth "lazy" but grows into a longer power bloom, and in contrast the Miami is a more brutal out the box and a handful, but runs out of legs earlier.

Thanks for the detailed run down. I've driven a C63 AMG before. It was a 2010 MY 7 Speed. I really liked it. The closest I could compare a Miami to would be the Jag F-Type R I drove a couple of months back. It was savage.

The AMG pulled hard off the line but nothing like the blown Jag. The AMG's top end was phenomenal. My mates BF XR8 ZF is a nice thing to drive and the AMG just felt like a BOSS on roids. The M156 would have been fantastic in a Falcon.

[FPV6]

You cant even hear the blower in the miami its 1800 its a baby

[pursuit57]

Originally Posted by xr8cam

I remember a bunch of mates who loved their red motor powered EH & HR sedans who all got gear drives, they loved em! Back in the days when K-mart sold 12 slotters and super, (petrol), cost $0:45 per/l. I had a RS2000,ported & cammed with twin 45mm Webber's and I often used $100 p/week on petrol!

Ha, memories..sounds like we hung around the same group of car fanatic's !
If you were a Sydney sider, you spend all those $'s on petrol going to brickies ??

[blackf6]

Originally Posted by GasOLane

Waay off topic but..... you drank a carton of Darwin Stubbies ?

Would like to see that. Big jug beer. Yeah... Super chargers. Hmmmm