Protest

[TURBOTAXI]

How about a compulsory safe driving subject integrated into the curriculum of our schools.?
They do it in the US, why not here?
The driver and the mindset is the issue here, not the car. The car only goes fast if the driver drives it fast.
A stock XR6 or smilar will blow the doors of an old V8 but our kids have a control put on them to make pollies feel like they have earned their $3k per week SHOW ME THE EVIDENCE THAT THIS WILL REDUCE DEATHS ON OUR ROADS.

[stiddy]

You could put the platers through a driving school, but there will still be a fair share of idiots out there thinking, *ive done an advanced course, i know how to handle my car i can drive the best* and they will still drift, burnouts, crash get seriously hurt and die.
its the sad truth that you really cant stop the deaths they will keep happening no matter what happens nor the car they are driving.
there really isnt a need for a p plater or an older guy to have a fast sport turbo car, V8 or whatever but its more of a want thing.
im 20, still on my green P's with a few speeding fines,never an accident *touch wood* i drive an AU XR6 that is about to be turbocharged next week.. cause i want to do it, its something i want not need.

[Biggoggs]

The driver and the mindset is the issue here, not the car. The car only goes fast if the driver drives it fast.

Absolutely.
Firstly, people are more likely to drive cheap 4-bangers harder than v8's or turbos. I know more crazy provisional drivers with Datsuns, Corollas, and Lancers, than turbo's and eights.
Whether a provisional driver `needs' a v8 or turbocharged vehicle is entirely opinion- do you need a turbo or v8? And for those who say provisionals should wait until they have a full license- how would you feel if someone took your v8 or turbo off you for three years or so, saying it was for your own good? I'm going to tried the line here, and say that there are provisional drivers that drive as well/better than oldies with fast cars, just without a superiority complex :P

That said, I'm in Tas, so it's not my problem

[T_Terror]

This issue has been covered plenty of times.

More driver training and MAJOR improvements to the licencing system are whats needed.
Even a new advanced licence that would allow access to hi-po vehicles. Anyone who says it will just make P-platers bolder dosnt know what they are talking about. Go and do a motorbike training course (which is run by private contractors, not government ****ers) and see how much of an eye-opener it is.

Those that are still going to drive like nutters are going to do it in any vehicle they can get. My 15year old falcon can get me into plenty of trouble for gods sake. Why drag everyone down to the lowest level? Why not ban sports cars completely cause "some" people have accidents in them "sometimes".


Get real, theres no P-plater epidemic. Just a slow news day.

Originally Posted by Rodp

I don't know about that... Nearly every weekend there's a story about a fatality or serious injury involving a P plater and a hi-po car, issues with illegal street racing or knobends doing laps around this weeks site of the day causing issues on a Friday or Saturday night.

At least in Sydney, it's a different culture among some car enthusiasts than it used to be. I had been to a couple of off street drags in the late 80's and I had also been on my fair share of street meets and it was a bunch of car enthusiasts getting together and being social, and stemming from that (as part of organised car enthusiast groups) that culture still goes on. Thankfully it's also passing the torch to the next gen of car enthusiasts (plenty of them on this site) to carry on that tradition. Good clean fun and socialising within a group interest.

There's another breed of 'enthusiast' but I don't know if they can even be called that, who indulge in fast cars but get together mainly to cause trouble or indulge in bonehead acts. The "Fast and Furious" crowd. I think that partly this law has been passed to help curb that behaviour as well, but until they issue batons instead of purses for police officers to keep their testes, we're still going to have these issues in Sydney.

I'm sure it was on this site not so long ago about a link to a ricer cruise along the F3 that got busted up and a few cars defected that we all had a chuckle about... however, you could see the destructive mentality among them as the thread got heated. It's not just about trying to remove the potential to get a car that can go from 0 to oops quicker than the inexperienced driver can handle but to also attempt to break up the anti-social behaviour that's harboured within it.

Shit I sound old.

Thats great except that i the unlikely event they obey the new restrictions they are just going to be driving a different car while doing the exact same thing. I don't know what makes people think that people who BREAK laws are going to obey a few new ones. Maybe they should ban speeding or something : : :

[Soundwarp]

Take away their liscence???

It's a big problem...

[Bucknaked]

I guess this is going to receive mixed reactions. Sure I've seen some P Platers drive irresponsibly on the roads. But I've see more experienced drivers who should learn to drive within the law. I've been on club cruises where the speed limit is rarely stuck too. So its not just the P Platers who are at fault. Its just that the P Platers are an easier target.

[stiddy]

there were 4000 people caught driving unlicensed last year, i dont think it would stop many of them AND, they would take off there p plates and drive around..

Originally Posted by Soundwarp

Take away their liscence???

It's a big problem...

Whats a big problem? P platers in their high performance death cars? :rolleyes: :

[Biggoggs]

More driver training and MAJOR improvements to the licencing system are whats needed.
Get real, theres no P-plater epidemic. Just a slow news day.

More training is good, more testing and restrictions is not. Provisional restrictions are beginning to sound like racing car class specs :/

Ban fast drivers, not fast cars.

[Polyal]

I think everyone is taking this way out of proportion.

Is it really going to disadvantage a P plater to not drive a "high performance" car for 3 years or so?

When those three years are up, go buy a porsche I dont care; but untill they have some road experience I dont see the harm with this law other than the choice to have the potential to go fast.

[the_scotsman]

I agree with the new rules....I see SOOOOOOOO many P plater hoons...whenever someone is driving fast, or stupid...9 times out of ten theres a P plate somewhere on the car....
Its a good start, but more needs to be done IMO....not all P platers are bad, obviously, but there is no way around it...just have to put up with it...

[hqtunna]

being a p plater and being from the ACT it wont affect me but i think its pretty stupid thing because of the fault of a few drivers who think they own the road, i just wanna see the results of doing this in the next 12 months and then we will know for sure if it was the right decision or not. i think it might have a small affect but nothing to substancial to make a big difference but lives are lives...

[MITCHAY]

But think about it though. Seriously when people are older and can afford a better car they are gonna buy it. I reckon its a good idea to learn to drive a car as you can afford it if you get what i mean. Surely driving a more affordable car when your older with no experience is got to be more dangerous than with experience. No matter how old you are or how young you are if your gonna be a ******** then your goin to be one regardless of what car your drive.

Originally Posted by Polyal

I think everyone is taking this way out of proportion.

Is it really going to disadvantage a P plater to not drive a "high performance" car for 3 years or so?

When those three years are up, go buy a porsche I dont care; but untill they have some road experience I dont see the harm with this law other than the choice to have the potential to go fast.

The thing is it doesn't actually do anything for road safety, it stops people be able to choose certain cars just because some journalists and polititions are morons.

Originally Posted by the_scotsman

I agree with the new rules....I see SOOOOOOOO many P plater hoons...whenever someone is driving fast, or stupid...9 times out of ten theres a P plate somewhere on the car....
Its a good start, but more needs to be done IMO....not all P platers are bad, obviously, but there is no way around it...just have to put up with it...

Yeah and these bad drivers are going to magically disapear when the new laws come into effect. :rolleyes:

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by lizardmech

Thats great except that i the unlikely event they obey the new restrictions they are just going to be driving a different car while doing the exact same thing. I don't know what makes people think that people who BREAK laws are going to obey a few new ones. Maybe they should ban speeding or something : : :

Why would they neccessarily be doing exactly the same thing? Had the guy driving a Skyline in Cronulla who hit and disintegrated a pedestrian been driving my first car... firstly, I doubt he would have been involved in a street race to begin with and secondly, we probably would still have time to yell and warn the pedestrian to look out for the blue Escort. :P He's got quite a while to think about his driving habits while he's doing his best not to drop the soap now though.

I don't know where you're from but I highly suspect you haven't been on the road late at night in Sydney and been surrounded by ricers on P's harrassing you. I have. Several times. It's not like these idiots that decide that 160 in a 40 zone is a good idea are only putting themselves at risk, they're putting everyone who uses the road at risk, and most importantly, putting ME at risk!

Travelling home late at night on the M5, I was cruising at around 120kph west just past King Georges exit. 5 buzz boxing ricers caught up to me like I was standing still and surrounded my car and were attempting to get me to give them a rolling drag. I wouldn't comply. They boxed me in and started to slow down, so I picked up the phone and started dialling while my window was down. They didn't stick around after that.

Learning to exist on the same strip of road that many other cars attempt to share is a steep learning curve in itself without doing it in a car that can potentially swap ends with a mistimed blip of the throttle. When they've had some experience on the road, had a reduction in testosterone and hopefully learned some impulse control, they're free to drive whatever the hell they like.

Originally Posted by Rodp

Why would they neccessarily be doing exactly the same thing? Had the guy driving a Skyline in Cronulla who hit and disintegrated a pedestrian been driving my first car... firstly, I doubt he would have been involved in a street race to begin with and secondly, we probably would still have time to yell and warn the pedestrian to look out for the blue Escort. :P He's got quite a while to think about his driving habits while he's doing his best not to drop the soap now though.

I don't know where you're from but I highly suspect you haven't been on the road late at night in Sydney and been surrounded by ricers on P's harrassing you. I have. Several times. It's not like these idiots that decide that 160 in a 40 zone is a good idea are only putting themselves at risk, they're putting everyone who uses the road at risk, and most importantly, putting ME at risk!

Travelling home late at night on the M5, I was cruising at around 120kph west just past King Georges exit. 5 buzz boxing ricers caught up to me like I was standing still and surrounded my car and were attempting to get me to give them a rolling drag. I wouldn't comply. They boxed me in and started to slow down, so I picked up the phone and started dialling while my window was down. They didn't stick around after that.

Learning to exist on the same strip of road that many other cars attempt to share is a steep learning curve in itself without doing it in a car that can potentially swap ends with a mistimed blip of the throttle. When they've had some experience on the road, had a reduction in testosterone and hopefully learned some impulse control, they're free to drive whatever the hell they like.

Well older 6 cylinder commodores can do 200 km/h and I doubt they will cease being idiots after the new law comes into affect. Saying that performance cars swap ends with a blip of the throttle is ridiculous.

[mik]

They are targeting p platers for a reason and that is because they are the high risk group, you dont see many 60 year olds dragging through the suburbs,and predominatley its p platers that are less experienced ,unpredictable,and more likely to end up wrapped around a pole

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by lizardmech

Well older 6 cylinder commodores can do 200 km/h and I doubt they will cease being idiots after the new law comes into affect. Saying that performance cars swap ends with a blip of the throttle is ridiculous.

Have you driven on Sydney roads late at night through Brighton Le Sands, Orange Grove or Auburn on the weekend?

[NIGHTHAWK]

I personally cant see anything wrong with a p plater, driving a low powered vehicle until they get their opens. The ones that do and will flout the law, will either find it harder to do the stupid things that they would do with a v8 with heaps more power.
They are less likely to "drag" someone at the lights, especially someone in a xr6 or a v8, and even if they do you know if it was one of us we would not even bother with the idiots,because it is illegal, it would not even make sense, and we have been on our opens for a year or more therefore more experience,more road sense.
Let them serve their time as apprentices, hopefully when they get their OPENS they will be masters of their trade.

My son, age 19, on his 'Ls' recently purchased in the last few weeks, an EL XR8, so now won't be allowed to drive it. The funny thing is that with the new rules coming into place, he could have bought an XR6 which would have given him more power, and have him be able to legally drive it!

So how will this effect the people that have done mods to their cars, like a bonnet bulge on a six with no badging, as my my daughter-in-law has done? Will they be pulled over by the cops constantly thinking a 'p' plater is waving a red rag at them...not knowing it's a six?

Originally Posted by deesun

OK so really what percentage drivers are we talking about here 3%,5%,or 10%. It ONLY affects V8s and Turbo cars and a few F**kwits who have already lost their license once. It doesn't affect tossers in clapped out VLs etc. Find out the real statistics as to how many P platers were killed in these types of cars and you will find the net effect will be SFA. Then they will bring in more draconian rules You can still pile 5 kids in a laser and at 100kph the result will be the same,more dead kids. My P plate son will still able to drive my BA XR6 (yeah right) but not allowed to drive a 10yr old V8 which doesn't produce as much power,go figure. Which one do you think he can afford. What about a low blow Turbo SAAB 2ltr even less power still, sorry young fella. Or will there be a list of what they can and can't drive like in VIC.

Thats the thing isnt it.

1996 EL Falcon V8 165kw
1996 VS Commodore V8 165kw

2005 BA Falcon I6 182kw
2005 VZ Commodore V6 190kw


Stupid rules from ****ers in the NSW govt. Mr Costa ,Mr Carr Mr Scully :

I think they have been down in Mr Bracks Underpants

Originally Posted by mik

They are targeting p platers for a reason and that is because they are the high risk group, you dont see many 60 year olds dragging through the suburbs,and predominatley its p platers that are less experienced ,unpredictable,and more likely to end up wrapped around a pole

I have seen a fair few middle age people and P platers act like idiots on the roads too. cutting in with out looking, swaping lanes on round abouts. red light hopping

This is a bandaid sollution to a problem that should have been fixed 20yrs ago.

1. Comp Driver Education
2. Sensible Registration
3. Insurance that takes into account driving record i.e points system , cheeper points for safe driving and taking courses.


ofcourse they have taken the cheepest route

I was taught to drive in big cars and i respect the power.

But i do agree with the problems in sydney and other places with leb idiots and the Ricer Crews causing trouble.

[Phillo62]

I think that the idea is smart. Being on my P plates, i am in Victoria and i see ALOT of stupid shit being done by my fellow mates.
I would hate to see one of them wrapped around a tree. and you know what, since i live in the country there is wide open road where ever you look.
Night + Whatever car = danger.
The government should think of some ideas to reduce the road toll at night because that is when most p platers are out on the back roads pushing the limits.
Ever watch the news, when do the accidents occur? At night.
I agree that p platers dont need a turbo or a V8, i had a HX ute with a 253 in it for my first car, i now have a pretty much stock standard ef gli.
1. the car i have now is much more lethal than my ute
2 However, it is much safer.
Why dont the government make it a law that young driver cant have a car that is older than say 10 - 12 years old?
My car is 10 years old and it has airbags!!!
These safety options can be used to save lives, these cars can also be electronically limited, maybe try something like that.
Dunno, im still young and my ideas may sound dumb to some but its my opinion.

Philthy

Originally Posted by Rodp

Have you driven on Sydney roads late at night through Brighton Le Sands, Orange Grove or Auburn on the weekend?

No I havn't but you havn't explained to me how making them drive marginaly slower cars will suddenly transform them into good drivers.

[EA2BA]

Originally Posted by Phillo62

I think that the idea is smart. Being on my P plates, i am in Victoria and i see ALOT of stupid shit being done by my fellow mates.
I would hate to see one of them wrapped around a tree. and you know what, since i live in the country there is wide open road where ever you look.
Night + Whatever car = danger.
The government should think of some ideas to reduce the road toll at night because that is when most p platers are out on the back roads pushing the limits.
Ever watch the news, when do the accidents occur? At night.
I agree that p platers dont need a turbo or a V8, i had a HX ute with a 253 in it for my first car, i now have a pretty much stock standard ef gli.
1. the car i have now is much more lethal than my ute
2 However, it is much safer.
Why dont the government make it a law that young driver cant have a car that is older than say 10 - 12 years old?
My car is 10 years old and it has airbags!!!
These safety options can be used to save lives, these cars can also be electronically limited, maybe try something like that.
Dunno, im still young and my ideas may sound dumb to some but its my opinion.

Philthy

If the govt looked at bringing in a rule of 10-12 yead odl cars for P-platers, i would turn up in protest, making them spend more for a car is not going to solve anything, and half of them run around in an new car anyways, and the banks hand money out.

[EFFalcon]

wgaf about the restrictions..
Vic's had it for years and we handle it...
buy a slow car and mod it!

[deesun]

The **** just fell out of the second hand ricer turbo and 10 year old V8 market, I can haer the sound of doors closeing all along Parramatta Rd as we speak. The importers must be shaking in their boots :togo: . On the other hand Jim Mock probably just went out and rented double the space he has now. :