Finally, someone telling it as it is....

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by tut0r

I'm in no position to buy a house anytime soon(i'm 26). No fault of anyone's, just my choice in my life is different from others, I decided to start my own business which proves to have its own challenges and costs, which also brings work that is up and down. Unfortunately costs of living don't stop and moving out of home early probably didn't help in the saving department, but I learnt some great life skills as opposed to my friends who still live with their parents.

Each to their own.

I was in a similar position about 12 years ago. I had a $10k deposit and mortgage all lined up and was looking to buy an apartment in inner Melbourne.

But then an opportunity came up to start my own business. The first 8 years or so I never made much, but since then I've upped the effort and reaped the rewards. My partner and I recently bought our first house this year and I've got the business that is worth a lot more than what that crappy little apartment I was looking at ever would have been.

Point of the story - buying property isn't as important as some make out, there are other ways to skin a cat. Be clever with your money and you'll end up just fine with or without owning a house.

[adumb]

Mrs and I purchased land at 22, built our first house by 23. Admittedly we got the 20K FHBG, which in our case meant we could build a bit quicker than without it. I have worked full time for the past 8 years (straight out of school) and the Mrs the last 4 (after uni). We built in a cheaper suburb, which meant cheaper land and in the long run a smaller mortgage. I am fortunate that I have almost doubled my wage since we first moved in but we weren't struggling then, just lived within our means. When we met with the bank we could have borrowed almost double what we needed (somewhere around 700k!!!!) we were smart enough to say no thanks but I hate to think how many said yes please! Now days I would say that hardest part (No FHBG) is having the willpower to save really hard for a few years, thats the hard bit, mortgage payments (providing you buy within your means) aren't an issue. Got a mate I work with could easily make payments on a 400k+ loan, its just the saving he is struggling with

[HULK_I6T]

If people are renting now, how are they going to be able to give their child much to help get into the property market?

prices of houses are just going to get away

[Nova 8]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

Honest answer? 2 million (1.4m in equity) is hardly considered rich. Your parents would be lucky to get a townhouse in brighton after a lifetime of painstaking hard work. And I would say they would be hard done by to get any less, but then again remember a lot of people actually are.

Your soldier friend is the exact problem with our society, some people are full of themselves and feel if they give a dime they deserve a million back and that's this guy. There are people who were on the front line now currently in wheelchairs with 3 amputated limbs on welfare too incompetent to fight for cover and incapable of holding a full time job earning no more than 30k p.a. on benefits forced to rent their entire lives in a hole because this self entitled ******** has inflated house prices out of their reach.

Honestly I hope he goes back into service on the frontline so he can stop making a mockery of the system happily prepared for the bank to pay it all back and collapse the economy if his 95% LVI's go south because that's ok he's served his country he's allowed to put the debt on our shoulders if his little game goes south :O

People like that make a mockery of good hard working people like your parents I'm sorry your soldier friend reminds me of that Chinese lady on ACA who had 65 investment propertys (with 10mil debt 99.9999% LVI). I wonder if David Hicks "got the portfolio he deserved"?

I take real issue with your comments, Im continually amazed with the crap you say.

My solider friend has never expected to get given anything for the time he has served at war, he has worked for it every step of the way, you do understand what working for your money is. Just because someone has more than you doesn't mean they are evil worthless people. You trash and belittle those who have more than you saying they are scum who trashed and belittled others all their lives causing them to be in their current sorry state, can you not see that you do what you accuse everyone else of.

You know nothing of my mate yet here you are smashing him into the ground, a guy who fought for the country that supplies you with the welfare that you plan to buy a house with and live off for the rest of your life. He actually helps these soldiers who lives have been ruined by war, do you? Or do you just use them as an example to try and claim any able bodied solider is scum??

My parents currently have just put a house on the market which once sold will make them debt free which they will immediately get a loan and buy a couple more run down houses to fix up and sell, their goal is 10 houses by 2020 so I guess they become scum some point along the way? When does a good hardworking person become something else, when are they the issue with society?

[BHDOGS]

First step liberals need to grow some balls second step get rid of negative gearing third step limit ownership of homes to 5 fourth step add house value into pensioners assest equations so there forced to sell and move into something cheaper to free up money so they dont leach of the system. after that take a look and try something new.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by HULK_I6T

If people are renting now, how are they going to be able to give their child much to help get into the property market?

prices of houses are just going to get away

If house prices weren't so artificially inflated to benefit a few, the next generation wouldn't be looking for help to get into the market.

If all the people currently renting went out and bought a house now, what do you think would happen to the price of housing, my guess would be an increase due to demand.

What would happen to all those negative geared investment properties without tenants?

[tut0r]

Originally Posted by HULK_I6T

If people are renting now, how are they going to be able to give their child much to help get into the property market?

prices of houses are just going to get away

Should a parent give a child money to buy a house? Or should they do it all on their own? My friends now have saved all their money on their own backs without parents giving them money, I think a parent letting their child stay at home rent free is giving enough IMO.

[Giant Cranium]

Originally Posted by Nova 8

You know nothing of my mate yet here you are smashing him into the ground, a guy who fought for the country that supplies you with the welfare that you plan to buy a house with and live off for the rest of your life.

i thought that was him but couldn't find the thread. that thread really game me the ****'s. what a rubbish attitude he has

[ILLaViTaR]

Originally Posted by Giant Cranium

i thought that was him but couldn't find the thread. that thread really game me the ****'s. what a rubbish attitude he has

lol get off your high horse my family PAYS 50k in tax p.a. and doesn't ******* negative gear. Instead half of that ultimately goes to their sons welfare. Whereas ALL of it could be deducted for self gain like your so much more ethical mob :S My fathers the taxpayer and he couldn't give a **** about any of you investors he absolute despises your ethic and is a better person for not indulging in the rorts. Raising a son with illness he understands welfare is more important than greed and toys.

It's embarrassing that my family contributes to society and only takes when required ie for mental illness and not to play monopoly games. It's beyond condescending when critique is coming from the the real rorters of society.. Self entitled bigots who don't actually need the wealth yet convince themselves they have a right before those that actually don't abuse society's pool.

I'm sorry but your attitude is amazing I think you've got the morality the wrong way around. Nothing wrong with disability benefits as they're used for disability like 10 thousand boxes of tissues and an electric heater everyday not to mention 10 000 other things that are none of your business. They're called essentials and human rights unlike your privileged monopoly zionist tirade that stole from an entire generation.

Greed and toys before survival and healthcare what a joke. Explain how it's ok to build your own equity with society's pool? And to have a problem with welfare that comes from the same pool and is actually essential? Some people just have a self entitled attitude I guess talking of attitudes and all.

[Giant Cranium]

if its for disability fair enough you deserve all you can get but I'm not a mind reader and neither is all the other forum users. but in that thread you said that the dole was going to service the mortgage.

also i worked for all i have and I'm only 27. my wife pays over 50k a year tax with no deductions. i will never ever stop pushing myself to earn and own what ever i want. really don't want to be paying tax so that you can service your mortgage.

and if they can deduct there whole pay good on them but the ato would be after them.

also don't have many toys anymore, i have a set of golf clubs and a few guns, sold my xr8 a few years back as i needed to set myself up with a deposit.

[Dash_XR]

Plenty of cheap homes around everyone just wants their first home to be in the inner suburbs. The only reason I have a "TO DO" list in my sig is I was saving for a deposit, you can't have everything straight away.

[Nova 8]

Thumbs down would be awesome....

[Nova 8]

Originally Posted by Dash_XR

Plenty of cheap homes around everyone just wants their first home to be in the inner suburbs. The only reason I have a "TO DO" list in my sig is I was saving for a deposit, you can't have everything straight away.

Spot on, buy a first house that isn't the house you plan to retire in. Just cause you plan on having 3 kids doesn't mean you need a 4 bedroom now. Buy affordable and build equity then upgrade later when you can do so with more ease and comfort.

[Dash_XR]

It's easier just to say it's impossible.


Doesn't CBA own Aussie Home Loans now anyway? Anything John Symonds says now doesn't have the weight behind it like it use to. Probably just sowing the seeds for CBA to reem their clients even more.

[Charliewool]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

lol get off your high horse my family PAYS 50k in tax p.a. and doesn't ******* negative gear. Instead half of that ultimately goes to their sons welfare. Whereas ALL of it could be deducted for self gain like your so much more ethical mob :S My fathers the taxpayer and he couldn't give a **** about any of you investors he absolute despises your ethic and is a better person for not indulging in the rorts. Raising a son with illness he understands welfare is more important than greed and toys.

It's embarrassing that my family contributes to society and only takes when required ie for mental illness and not to play monopoly games. It's beyond condescending when critique is coming from the the real rorters of society.. Self entitled bigots who don't actually need the wealth yet convince themselves they have a right before those that actually don't abuse society's pool.

I'm sorry but your attitude is amazing I think you've got the morality the wrong way around. Nothing wrong with disability benefits as they're used for disability like 10 thousand boxes of tissues and an electric heater everyday not to mention 10 000 other things that are none of your business. They're called essentials and human rights unlike your privileged monopoly zionist tirade that stole from an entire generation.

Greed and toys before survival and healthcare what a joke. Explain how it's ok to build your own equity with society's pool? And to have a problem with welfare that comes from the same pool and is actually essential? Some people just have a self entitled attitude I guess talking of attitudes and all.

You, my boy have the biggest chip on your shoulder...
Forever the same drum banged.
Seriously, get over it or it'll eat you...

[tut0r]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

lol get off your high horse my family PAYS 50k in tax p.a. and doesn't ******* negative gear. Instead half of that ultimately goes to their sons welfare. Whereas ALL of it could be deducted for self gain like your so much more ethical mob :S My fathers the taxpayer and he couldn't give a **** about any of you investors he absolute despises your ethic and is a better person for not indulging in the rorts. Raising a son with illness he understands welfare is more important than greed and toys.

It's embarrassing that my family contributes to society and only takes when required ie for mental illness and not to play monopoly games. It's beyond condescending when critique is coming from the the real rorters of society.. Self entitled bigots who don't actually need the wealth yet convince themselves they have a right before those that actually don't abuse society's pool.

I'm sorry but your attitude is amazing I think you've got the morality the wrong way around. Nothing wrong with disability benefits as they're used for disability like 10 thousand boxes of tissues and an electric heater everyday not to mention 10 000 other things that are none of your business. They're called essentials and human rights unlike your privileged monopoly zionist tirade that stole from an entire generation.

Greed and toys before survival and healthcare what a joke. Explain how it's ok to build your own equity with society's pool? And to have a problem with welfare that comes from the same pool and is actually essential? Some people just have a self entitled attitude I guess talking of attitudes and all.

I think you are missing one individual point, not to downgrade what you have said by any means but if you read the 'mental illness' thread which I am sure you have stumbled upon, there are plenty of people with big issues who own homes, invest have nice things.

You can't compare home owners to say someone with a disability, there are plenty of home owners who struggle with depression, anxiety, cancer and a myriad of different ailments. To say those who invest and use tax breaks are rorting the system is crazy, when it comes to tax time I use every loophole and deduction I can get to get more money in my pocket to BUY a house!

I also served in the military and i'll tell you right now, unless you have served yourself, you have no idea. I have never made better friends, that I trust and care about more in my life than my short time in the Airforce.

I come from a family with Bipolar, Post Natal and many other issues, yes my parents do not own property but once upon a time they were doing well, my father ran successful cafe's all throughout Melbourne!! But a few simple mistakes and health issues basically meant he had to give it up and now lives in a flat just on the pension.

I suggest in future you reword your posts carefully as attacking Nova for what he said was blatantly disrespectful and even if it was your opinion it wasn't the right way to go about it. Especially if you don't want others speaking to you in such a way.

Only my 2cents but the grass is always greener.

[Franco Cozzo]

Its all relative too, is it worth the $400K+ you need to live in Melbourne's outer suburbs on a tiny 500m2 property, with a "2 car garage" you couldn't fit a Falcon in length ways, being crammed in with heaps of neighbours, so close you can probably hear them having a domestic?

$350K gets you into Sunbury, and Goonawarra at that which is the dodgy end.

I live in the Macedon Ranges with my rents, I was born in Sunbury, lived in Goonawarra for the first few years of my life, then when I was 3 we moved out here into Macedon Ranges.

We're in a housing estate but the properties are all around 1500m2, so there is space between everyone, there is acerage/farm all around our estate too.

Air is clean and most people are friendly.

Land costs are higher now compared to when my parents bought here nearly 20 years ago now, $26K back in 1994, now its $250K for the same size in a new estate going up.

What does $250K get you land wise around Melbourne?

It was about 50 minute drive into work to Melbourne's northern suburbs but I was cruising at 100km/h just about all the way, my sister lives in East Brunswick and it can take her anywhere from 50 minutes to 1 hour 30 mins to drive 7 KILOMETERS to work in peak hour, one time she walked to work quicker than she could drive.

7km to the next town takes me like 5 minutes lol.

$400K gets you something nice out here guys and the drive into Melbourne is easy, public transport is pretty decent on VLine, the trains are in good condition and they still have inspectors.

Gisborne and Woodend are a bit over-priced though for what they are, anything on the Calder freeway side is exy.

If you go further out towards Bendigo or on the other sides of Bendigo land is still cheap, and its not far from Bendigo which is the areas I'm looking at for a property when the time comes.

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by Nova 8

Spot on, buy a first house that isn't the house you plan to retire in. Just cause you plan on having 3 kids doesn't mean you need a 4 bedroom now. Buy affordable and build equity then upgrade later when you can do so with more ease and comfort.

We're building a three bedroom, and when it came to the bank valuation they valued it nearly 50k under build cost purely because it doesn't have the fourth bedroom. It damn near would have been better to go back to the drawing board and make it a four bedroom house.

Instead we had to come up with a further 30k deposit to avoid the lmi.

Ironically we have a small storeroom on the plans and I suggested we send it back and say that was a typo and it's actually a fourth bedroom, but the broker said they will see straight through that lol

[Iggle Piggle]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

It's embarrassing that my family contributes to society and only takes when required ie for mental illness and not to play monopoly games.

That is pretty impressive - paying so much tax and your family only benefits from the half of it that goes to you.

He must find it hard to then build private roads for him and your family to drive on when you are not using your personal trains and buses that you guys must personally fund from his after tax earnings, particularly given he must also have had to build a hospital and employ doctors, nurses and all the other staff for when any of your family are ill, all the while paying his own personal police force to keep you guys safe and a personal army to protect your family's little bit of Australia.

So many things that rest of us tax payers take for granted as we realise the tax we pay goes towards funding these and many other things we get to use - kudos to your family for not using any of these tax payer provided facilities and services, and funding your own private versions instead.

[Nova 8]

Originally Posted by nstg8a

We're building a three bedroom, and when it came to the bank valuation they valued it nearly 50k under build cost purely because it doesn't have the fourth bedroom. It damn near would have been better to go back to the drawing board and make it a four bedroom house.

Instead we had to come up with a further 30k deposit to avoid the lmi.

Ironically we have a small storeroom on the plans and I suggested we send it back and say that was a typo and it's actually a fourth bedroom, but the broker said they will see straight through that lol

Sucky situation and if you were comfortably able to get the extra to get a 4 bedroom it's obviously the choice to make, however if spending the extra money is enough to possibly break bank then it better just to get in your house and enjoy. My point is it's better to take the next step on the ladder rather then stretching and falling down.

[Iggle Piggle]

Out around the Beth they have worked out how to use that 4th bedroom to not only pay for itself but pretty much pay for every other room too.

Choice is do you green thumb or break bad

[tut0r]

My dream is to build, my biggest dream is to build in the inner suburbs of Melbourne, can't see myself having 1.5 million to do so in Preston area, but the rougher side of town is cheaper, not to bad considering it used to be a nice part! Maybe in 5 years they'll be forced further out again.

[ILLaViTaR]

Originally Posted by Iggle Piggle

That is pretty impressive - paying so much tax and your family only benefits from the half of it that goes to you.

He must find it hard to then build private roads for him and your family to drive on when you are not using your personal trains and buses that you guys must personally fund from his after tax earnings, particularly given he must also have had to build a hospital and employ doctors, nurses and all the other staff for when any of your family are ill, all the while paying his own personal police force to keep you guys safe and a personal army to protect your family's little bit of Australia.

So many things that rest of us tax payers take for granted as we realise the tax we pay goes towards funding these and many other things we get to use - kudos to your family for not using any of these tax payer provided facilities and services, and funding your own private versions instead.

lol not at all I don't think you understand how welfare works.

[Iggle Piggle]

Probably don't, but I also think you don't understand that you and your family benefit from more than just the half of your old man's tax that pays your pension.

[ILLaViTaR]

Talking about free welfare we could all buy in olivers hill 100k under-market such as this guy did http://house.ksou.cn/p.php?q=Frankst...a=vic&id=47142

Sub divide 12-30k from the equity renovating/painting the initial residence, unit on the back (120k) from the increased equity of the now 2 blocks. 450k later each worth 350k+. 700k+ in equity without a cent/deposit upfront. Come out one year later with mortgage repaid and 300k in hand. Obviously centrelink wouldn't accept you on that income but who would be silly not to trade up to the ultimate welfare that is investment?

[ILLaViTaR]

Originally Posted by Iggle Piggle

Probably don't, but I also think you don't understand that you and your family benefit from more than just the half of your old man's tax that pays your pension.

What about finance then?

Let's say he's just started paying 15% smsf instead of 47% into his own family retirement a lot less than 25k/the half! It's almost like me claiming 2 pensions but that's not as bad for some reason. That's a bigger rort than the 30% flat rate for small businesses (17% exemption) but the payg earnier finally get's one little rort for himself so he's not complaining. Instead of 25k out of 50k going to society only around 18k does at 15%.

And you've stretched the truth quite a lot. What you're suggesting would imply is my dads laundering his tax dollars directly into my bank account :S

[Iggle Piggle]

Nah mate, all I am suggesting is you are wrong when you say your old man pays $50k in tax each year and the only benefit to you and your family is the half of that $50k that you receive as a pension.

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

lol get off your high horse my family PAYS 50k in tax p.a. and doesn't ******* negative gear. Instead half of that ultimately goes to their sons welfare...

Your family is not out the other $25k due to the tax payer funded services we all benefit from.

What I am suggesting is that his tax dollars (and every other tax payer's dollars) go towards everything from everyone's welfare (not just your own), health services, defence, education, general public services, interest on government debt, transport and communication, housing and community, fuel and energy, foreign affairs and economic aid, industry assistance, immigration, public order and safety, recreation and culture, and other purposes - well, that is where Tony and Jo reckon our tax payer dollars go (they print it on the back of our tax returns).

[ford man xf]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

If house prices weren't so artificially inflated to benefit a few, the next generation wouldn't be looking for help to get into the market.

Can you explain how prices are artificially inflated? There are plenty of people either earning decent cash or have stored wealth to buy, so naturally this particular market is going to be high cost due to inflationary pressure.
Often people will say that it's because of supply and demand, yet I can go and buy a new home as we speak, there are thousands of blocks of land for sale at the moment ripe and ready to build on.

[ILLaViTaR]

Originally Posted by Iggle Piggle

Nah mate, all I am suggesting is you are wrong when you say your old man pays $50k in tax each year and the only benefit to you and your family is the half of that $50k that you receive as a pension.

Your family is not out the other $25k due to the tax payer funded services we all benefit from.

What I am suggesting is that his tax dollars (and every other tax payer's dollars) go towards everything from everyone's welfare (not just your own), health services, defence, education, general public services, interest on government debt, transport and communication, housing and community, fuel and energy, foreign affairs and economic aid, industry assistance, immigration, public order and safety, recreation and culture, and other purposes - well, that is where Tony and Jo reckon our tax payer dollars go (they print it on the back of our tax returns).

Nah I definitely didn't mean it that way!! I was just saying even with the pension taking away from that 50k, that over 25k still pays for all those things (roads, defense, transport etc) whereas a lot of people showing contempt here would be paying less than 25k for all those things you've mentioned taking the rest back through negative gearing/tax deductions etc, which is in the same category as welfare to be frank to them. Which would make them hypocrites as they're contributing less wealth to society than the family they've actually abused for that very thing.

Only on a right wing forum would you get scrutinized into revealing your financial situation and taboo/disability personal information lol. Like I have to justify myself to anyone here. People don't talk/treat people like they do on here... Well not in the Australia I've lived the last 25yrs in anyway. Look who I'm talking too lol and the context of it... no where else would anyone address/attack someone as blatant as can be to their face demanding their personal information as though it's their god given right... never seen something more audacious. Who the **** do you think you are to all those that did? Pathetic. Mind your own business? It's obvious these people can't comprehend anything outside of their own self interests. Or accept other peoples differences and lifestyles that may conflict with their own. Therefore who's ever going to listen to them?

And as far as property goes, if you can't beat them join them is what I've learned. Unless you want to be on the street in 10yrs. 40 000 job positions, 100 000 unskilled graduates is another reality that comes to mind. I'm just a realist.

[BHDOGS]

The real diffence is simple the people sitting in there million dollar homes had choice back then to buy we're they wanted now the next generation doesn't and so on and so on to the point you will have to drive 3 hours just to get to work people are blind if they actually believe it's just peoples lack of work ethic or not wanting to sacrifice there beer and smokes and shows the bigger problem with the current system or all systems those who benefit from it never want anything to change and will always complain loudest the system is fine no matter how broken it is. Apparently being born with a disability and not being able to work is acceptable to never having a place of your own or any aspirations. A system that merely caters to one set principles of work or earn nothing is not sustainable and will envitable collapse as the fortunate who can maintain the system begin to run thin to those who can't.