Anyone else losing faith in Ford Aus?

[DanielXR8]

Well the car is a little too much BF in styling for it's own good, but I can live with that. There are two key tests for me:

1. Will the cars engineering and build quality be improved? For example will V8 Manual Falcons still be inflicted with appalling driveline shunt and dodgy diffs? If the FG has a chronic fault like the BA's brake rotor warp, will Ford bend over backwards to fix it and keep the customer happy or will they treat the customer to another circus for months on end?

2. Will the new President of Ford Aust take a size 11 boot up the ***** of the Ford Dealer Network and put the customer first?

If they do both, I'll take a look at FG otherwise the FG Falcon is not past the starting line for me, which would be a shame as I like the new XR8.

Dan

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Well the car is a little too much BF in styling for it's own good, but I can live with that. There are two key tests for me:

1. Will the cars engineering and build quality be improved? For example will V8 Manual Falcons still be inflicted with appalling driveline shunt and dodgy diffs? If the FG has a chronic fault like the BA's brake rotor warp, will Ford bend over backwards to fix it and keep the customer happy or will they treat the customer to another circus for months on end?

2. Will the new President of Ford Aust take a size 11 boot up the ***** of the Ford Dealer Network and put the customer first?

If they do both, I'll take a look at FG otherwise the FG Falcon is not past the starting line for me, which would be a shame as I like the new XR8.

Dan

I hear you Dan. Agree with everything you say. The car in my opinion is brilliant in every aspect, but, as you say, customer service comes first. Hopefully the product itself will live up to my expectations and have very little teething issues.

I've only seen pics, but the more I look at them the more I'm liking what I see. Most who've been to the MMS have come back with positive feedback on its appearance, which is good to see/hear/read.

Have I lost faith in Ford Au? No.

[5.4 GT]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Well the car is a little too much BF in styling for it's own good, but I can live with that.

The XT's

[XplosiveR6]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

Well what can I say, even as a long time ford supporter over the past weeks I'm starting to lose my faith in the Australian Ford company. The introduction of the BA showed us that Ford was starting to lift its game again and the offerering from FPV were promising in many ways. But slowly we have seen the FG which to me is a slack attempt at a new car having design cues from the BF, we've seen the last Fairlane released as some bog stocker with nothing special and even though FPV havn't released any official figures for the FG based models I mean what can we expect, small power increases and stripes? All this while we see Holden coming out with nice models that even the biggest Ford fans are giving great credit to. This has all been dissapointing to me and I hope Ford is doing this for a real surprise down the track but if things keep going like they are I'll probably be saying stuff Ford soon. All opinions welcome

So what your saying is that ford shouldn't wary about economic problems and go all out investing millions of dollars in one big powerful V8 with 500kw so kids at school that have no chance of buying one have something to talk about in the playground? I think you will find that most people who actually own a GT are quiet happy with the power output, they're certainly no slug and if you actually go out and had a ride in one your views will change too.

Ford simply do not have cheap and big crate motors which they can easily import from the stats, i don't understand why importing a motor wows you so much. Where ford have to go to all the trouble of hand making and developing their motor right here in aus, obviously already investing way more money then holden and are still developing it. but this still isn't enough for you, doesn't this show that ford is trying pretty hard. They could have said screw it we will just import the 3v 5.4 cos its easier.

Let's not forget ford aus developed and engineered the I6 turbo which easily keeps up with holden imported 6litre, and they developed this motor here in aus, but this still isn't enough for you? And where would holden be exactly if the didn't have corvette to get engines from? What does holden offer you which simply isn't imported?

[XplosiveR6]

Originally Posted by Electric

I was thinking today....almost every Taxi in the county is a Falcon.

Where would Ford be in the sales chart if they didn't sell so many Taxis?

Most taxi's are bought second hand

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Electric

I was thinking today....almost every Taxi in the county is a Falcon.

Where would Ford be in the sales chart if they didn't sell so many Taxis?

Ford don't build a Taxi pack anymore. Taxi's are used cars (generally bought at auction), that are repainted and put into service by the Taxi companies.

GP stopped Taxi production during his tenure as FoA boss.

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Well the car is a little too much BF in styling for it's own good, but I can live with that. There are two key tests for me:

1. Will the cars engineering and build quality be improved? For example will V8 Manual Falcons still be inflicted with appalling driveline shunt and dodgy diffs? If the FG has a chronic fault like the BA's brake rotor warp, will Ford bend over backwards to fix it and keep the customer happy or will they treat the customer to another circus for months on end?

2. Will the new President of Ford Aust take a size 11 boot up the ***** of the Ford Dealer Network and put the customer first?

If they do both, I'll take a look at FG otherwise the FG Falcon is not past the starting line for me, which would be a shame as I like the new XR8.

Dan

Well said.

My own thoughts on the matter however is that perhaps the "brand continuation" from the BF to the FG has been a little too successful, with a little too much similiarity in appearance - at least when viewing from afar.

There also doesn't quite seem to be the media buzz or talk about town as what I recalled when the BA Falcon was released. I think the danger is that the market will take the new Falcon as a model update, rather than a major revision.

It's also got a little bit of that "lack of enthusiasm" feel or what you might call a minor eventuality to the release that would probably be best described as the excitement that one feels towards the release of a new Corolla, or Torago, probably due in part to a lack of hype about the release, and the attention the media seems to be giving Holden all the time.

Regardless, I too will have a good look at an FG Falcon.

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by XplosiveR6

Let's not forget ford aus developed and engineered the I6 turbo which easily keeps up with holden imported 6litre, and they developed this motor here in aus, but this still isn't enough for you? And where would holden be exactly if the didn't have corvette to get engines from? What does holden offer you which simply isn't imported?

It's that I6 motor that has got you in all this trouble...Everytime ford australia either drops their v8's (back in the 80's) or invests more into their I6 (turbo anyone) than their V8's you let Holden back in. You make it sound like Holden is the only one that gets help from its US parent company, so will you buy a Aurion when the next falcon has a US designed platform and drivetrain?

I'm a Aussie so I want anything Aussie to do well, nothing eats me more than seeing Toyota whip us both... But too compete with the Japanese giants both Holden and Ford need all the help they can get from their USA parent companies. One of the biggest ways they can do that is help open up export markets... It's scary to think Holden produce more V8's motors than all of the I6's ford australia can make isn't it? why?...Exports

So while you pay out on holden for going to GM headquarters for a big motor, it actually wont be till Ford Australia gets a US V6 and a US designed platform that it opens up exports markets and Ford Australia can taste some of the success Holden has been enjoying.

Come on Ford, hang in there

[ED Classic]

I think Ford is the goods in the performance stakes with this new model. I dont know about FPV yet (obviously they should compete with 307 but too early to compare it to what it will ultimatley need to compete with the 6.2) but with Ford no wories.

The BF XT gives the base Holden good thrashing well wait till this baby with even a bit more power 5 Auto std is compared. Run it on 98 octane and 410+ Nm is class leading by a fair margin. Will probably beat the Commode by a second to 100kmh atleast all while using less fuel.

XR6T will be much much quicker than the BF version which was already not too far Behind SS. It could be argued it might be quicker than BF F6 as its got the same power with only just less torque but then has a quicker responsive Turbo, Overboost feature and launch control, (better suspension for launching?)

XR8 gets 290 kw which should be reasonably competitive with SS.

[KW XRT]

Originally Posted by KBBossedXR

Ford/FPV in my opinion are and always will be playing catch up to Holden/HSV, unless they come up with an all new car that turns the market upside down. I was under the impression this was going to be an all new car but you can definately see the BA/BF in the FG but i still like the look and cant wait to see one in the flesh, a couple of my mates dont like the look from the photos so far especially the black/grey sections on the front bar that puts them right off.
It is little things like this that will stop people from buying a car even if it handles well goes like the clappers and the interior is great (i dont like the screen being so high on the dash) if they dont like the look on the outside they wont buy the Car its as simple as that.

I don't think this takes into account the fact HSV had years head start with manufacturing support but FPV has kicked their butts so hard since they started HSV are spinning.In there first couple of years sales were almost neck and neck this is an outstanding achievemnt and should not be overlooked.FPV can just not keep up with sales and HSV up till 12 months ago was stagnate compared to there rivals.Last lot of sales figures I saw were still very encouraging.

cheers

[KW XRT]

Originally Posted by HSVKILLA

You want my opinion,get over yourself and harden up FORD is the biggest and best thing to ever happen to me,so to read these types of start up threads makes me wonder about easily pushed turncoats :

Take it easy there's ford owners here who spent there hard erned on The AU Falcon {that's die hard for ya all be it with new grill and rear wing never the less I did my bit.

cheers

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Karlos

It's scary to think Holden produce more V8's motors than all of the I6's ford australia can make isn't it? why?...Exports

No they don't, they sold around 10,000 V8's here in Australia, and probably another 20,000 in exports. Thats less than half the number of 6 cylinders Ford produce, with the BA and Territory the numbers were up around 100,000. Now its down around 60-70,000.

[XplosiveR6]

Originally Posted by Karlos

It's that I6 motor that has got you in all this trouble...Everytime ford australia either drops their v8's (back in the 80's) or invests more into their I6 (turbo anyone) than their V8's you let Holden back in. You make it sound like Holden is the only one that gets help from its US parent company, so will you buy a Aurion when the next falcon has a US designed platform and drivetrain?

I'm a Aussie so I want anything Aussie to do well, nothing eats me more than seeing Toyota whip us both... But too compete with the Japanese giants both Holden and Ford need all the help they can get from their USA parent companies. One of the biggest ways they can do that is help open up export markets... It's scary to think Holden produce more V8's motors than all of the I6's ford australia can make isn't it? why?...Exports

So while you pay out on holden for going to GM headquarters for a big motor, it actually wont be till Ford Australia gets a US V6 and a US designed platform that it opens up exports markets and Ford Australia can taste some of the success Holden has been enjoying.

Come on Ford, hang in there

Paying out holden for importing there V8's wasn't my intention. My point i was trying to make is that people like to pay out ford for not doing enough for the performance sector, which in actual fact they do a lot more then holden does, as developing, engineering and implementing a motor requires a ton more work then simple shoehorning a crate motor into a car.

[WindsorXR]

As someone who has seen my fair share of FG Falcons and had to work on them for the past 2 years, I can say with certainty that this model is a great step forward for Ford Australia. In the flesh the car looks so much better. Sure the advertising, managment and dealership service for Ford let us down regulary, but I'm hoping that Ford is really going to sink the boot in and really let the public know that Ford Australia is on top of it's game.I think that Ford is still going to be one of Australia's Favorite manufacture's for many years to come.

As for those who think nothing has changed and Falcon is copying everyone else I have this- 99% of the car has changed, if it totally changed you wouldn't see it as a Falcon. It'd be an alien to a lot of people.
- Australian vehicle first for Standard equipment on certain models such as side curtain airbags, DSC and Tracton Control (all of which takes a great deal of money to develop and engineer to exceed satisfactory results.
- A great power increase across the whole Falcon Range with better fuel economy.
- Improved and fantastic Noise, Vibration and Harshness levels and also Vehicle Dynamics.

OK, If anyone has bothered to read this Huge and Long post I think you know where I stand. I have a great amount of Trust, Faith and Love of Ford Australia and it's new products. Now if only I had enough money to get one straight up right now!!lol.

Cheers fella's

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by WhatsMyUserName

- Australian vehicle first for Standard equipment on certain models such as side curtain airbags, DSC and Tracton Control (all of which takes a great deal of money to develop and engineer to exceed satisfactory results.

Hasn't the Toyota Aurion got this across the entire range?

[WindsorXR]

Originally Posted by Dave_au

Hasn't the Toyota Aurion got this across the entire range?

Go to www.Ford.com.au and watch the release vids. Ol' Bill makes a speech on all the new and improved safety features.
I'm not sure? How Australian is Toyota and the Aurion??

[RPO83]

Originally Posted by WhatsMyUserName

Go to www.Ford.com.au and watch the release vids. Ol' Bill makes a speech on all the new and improved safety features.
I'm not sure? How Australian is Toyota and the Aurion??

I'm not sure? How Australian is Ford and the Falcon?? :P

[WindsorXR]

It's a lot more Australian than Aurion and Commodore if you see where all the parts come from. But i think every manufacturer is getting less and less Aussie every year because of Aus production prices on components. We are all going Chinese.lol

[WindsorXR]

But seriously, I was actually asking the question about how Aussie they are. I don't think they are as Aussie as Ford and holden.

[RPO83]

Originally Posted by WhatsMyUserName

It's a lot more Australian than Aurion and Commodore if you see where all the parts come from. But i think every manufacturer is getting less and less Aussie every year because of Aus production prices on components. We are all going Chinese.lol

I know the Falcon is, although its a shame Ford can't source our own steel in a country with an abundance of natural resources. To dismiss the Aurion because it uses less Australian sourced components though is a little weak.

[WindsorXR]

Originally Posted by RPO83

I know the Falcon is, although its a shame Ford can't source our own steel in a country with an abundance of natural resources. To dismiss the Aurion because it uses less Australian sourced components though is a little weak.

That wasn't what i was getting at. That was just a fact to use that i thought i'd throw in there. It sorta does use less Aussie people to get the whole car finished considering all the import components though.

[LeadFoot81]

Originally Posted by WhatsMyUserName

How Australian is Toyota and the Aurion??

The Aurion is a V6 Camry with a new nose and tail, and a smartened up interior. I dont know how much work they do on the suspension to Australian-ize it, but you'd think most parts used to transform the Camry into the Aurion would come from the Japanese Toyota parts catalogue.

Haven't driven one but I've heard mostly good things about them.

[zetec]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

Well what can I say, even as a long time ford supporter over the past weeks I'm starting to lose my faith in the Australian Ford company. The introduction of the BA showed us that Ford was starting to lift its game again and the offerering from FPV were promising in many ways. But slowly we have seen the FG which to me is a slack attempt at a new car having design cues from the BF, we've seen the last Fairlane released as some bog stocker with nothing special and even though FPV havn't released any official figures for the FG based models I mean what can we expect, small power increases and stripes? All this while we see Holden coming out with nice models that even the biggest Ford fans are giving great credit to. This has all been dissapointing to me and I hope Ford is doing this for a real surprise down the track but if things keep going like they are I'll probably be saying stuff Ford soon. All opinions welcome

Not a bad post from someone who based on his username appears to still be driving an 18 year old Falcon... clearly putting your money where your mouth is in support of Ford in recent years.

[sleekism]

Originally Posted by The_Fantastic_Ford

The Aurion is a V6 Camry with a new nose and tail, and a smartened up interior. I dont know how much work they do on the suspension to Australian-ize it, but you'd think most parts used to transform the Camry into the Aurion would come from the Japanese Toyota parts catalogue.

Haven't driven one but I've heard mostly good things about them.

Aurions are junk.

A lot of fancy options on a really bad chassis and engine combination.

We have them at the work and having to drive at 5000rpm around town, the annoying torque steer and understeer makes it a dynamic piece of junk.

If you think cars have nothing to do with engine/drivetrain and everything to do with electric seats and an impressive looking brochure then you will enjoy the Aurion. If you actually drive your own car then you will hate it.

To see what the Aurion is like. Go buy a Fairlane. Convert it to Front Wheel Drive and put a 2 stroke engine in it.

[ea90gl]

Originally Posted by XplosiveR6

So what your saying is that ford shouldn't wary about economic problems and go all out investing millions of dollars in one big powerful V8 with 500kw so kids at school that have no chance of buying one have something to talk about in the playground? I think you will find that most people who actually own a GT are quiet happy with the power output, they're certainly no slug and if you actually go out and had a ride in one your views will change too.

Ford simply do not have cheap and big crate motors which they can easily import from the stats, i don't understand why importing a motor wows you so much. Where ford have to go to all the trouble of hand making and developing their motor right here in aus, obviously already investing way more money then holden and are still developing it. but this still isn't enough for you, doesn't this show that ford is trying pretty hard. They could have said screw it we will just import the 3v 5.4 cos its easier.

Let's not forget ford aus developed and engineered the I6 turbo which easily keeps up with holden imported 6litre, and they developed this motor here in aus, but this still isn't enough for you? And where would holden be exactly if the didn't have corvette to get engines from? What does holden offer you which simply isn't imported?

Did i ever just mention the V8 side of things? that was one of a few examples I used in my start post, Im not expecting a fire breathing monster I just mentioned we'll probably see the new GT's with a small increase in power which in my opinion wouldnt be anything to WOW over. As for the I6 i didnt say one bad word about it or even mention it in fact I think its a great engine and can hold its own very well. I think some people are getting a tad upset about this whole thing

[ea90gl]

Originally Posted by zetec

Not a bad post from someone who based on his username appears to still be driving an 18 year old Falcon... clearly putting your money where your mouth is in support of Ford in recent years.

sigh what a pointless post you just made..... So tell me since a username can tell so much about someone what time did i eat lunch today? how many weetbix did i have for breakfast?..... As a matter of fact that ea is a runarounder mostly used for work purposes, i never bought it since "I love ford so much that i must buy one". You dont have to buy every single model ford releases to be a fan of the company Im sure you know that. any way besides one or two useless posts like the one above this the replies have been very interesting and have shed alot of light in some areas

[irlewy86]

Originally Posted by zetec

Not a bad post from someone who based on his username appears to still be driving an 18 year old Falcon... clearly putting your money where your mouth is in support of Ford in recent years.

Someone has to stop the resale from falling into oblivion!

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by sleekism

If you think cars have nothing to do with engine/drivetrain and everything to do with electric seats and an impressive looking brochure then you will enjoy the Aurion. If you actually drive your own car then you will hate it.

Your really coming out with some completely left field rants these days that are off topic.

A) The Aurion broucher is crap - its 6 pages long, of which 2 are devoted to specs, one to colour charts, one to dealer added options.
B) The engine, 2GR-FE is from the same family as the Lexus IS350 (2GR-FSE), which Stateside pulls a 5.6sec 0-100 with 223kw/377nm, although our Aurion's version is obviously detuned and without direct injection.

[XplosiveR6]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

Did i ever just mention the V8 side of things? that was one of a few examples I used in my start post, Im not expecting a fire breathing monster I just mentioned we'll probably see the new GT's with a small increase in power which in my opinion wouldnt be anything to WOW over. As for the I6 i didnt say one bad word about it or even mention it in fact I think its a great engine and can hold its own very well. I think some people are getting a tad upset about this whole thing

I was merely giving you examples of the effort ford has gone into in recent years. As your first post clearly stated that apparently ford doesn't seem to make much effort. And yet you still haven't answered me, instead of just complaining please tell us what exactly is it that you expect from ford? What should they do differently exactly?

[Sorted]

Answer = NO

Why - Just went to the Melbourne Motor Show..............

Or i could be a and make comments about the cars without seeing them in the flesh..................... NAH that would just be silly!!! :