FG X, The Last EVER Falcon - Picture & Discussion Thread

[cro142]

Originally Posted by 4vxc

I've never felt the seat is too high and I've never heard anyone else mention it either seems to me once a journalist first came up with this they all seemed to jump onboard and have a whinge, as they do.

I agree - I don't see any sense in this "seat too high" idea.
I am 6' 4" and have never had any feeling of this. In fact sometimes I raise the seat a bit.

I too think it may have begun as a silly comment by a journalist needing something to say, and it just stuck and became part of the lexicon.

[FGX008]

Originally Posted by Bonn

FG seating position is perfect, IMO.
Wife raises it substantially (on the rare occasion she drives it) to see over the bonnet bulge.

It will be so rare that that my wife gets to drive our new car that I suppose if I am honest ( in a moment of weakness) I could classify it as - never! Just saying!

[commodorenutt]

Originally Posted by Snowdoggydogg

I've had all three (FG Falcon, VE Commodore, Toyota Camry Hybrid) and I'm 6'4 and 105 kg. I find the Commodore sits me low and makes the A pillar issue with that car even worse. The Toyota as you pointed out is crap. My G6Et probably feels the most engaged out of the three. It's certainly a different and more upright feeling being in the Ford but with my not so flash back I tend to appreciate that car the most. The commy makes me want to pull over every hour to stretch.

I had a company VE for 3 years (and have also owned a Calais-V for 5), and I've had the FG for 3 years, so like you, quite some time behind the wheel in each (40k/yr).

The VE seats themselves are more the issue than the position - they simply aren't as comfortable as the Ford (even the Calais-V aren't as good IMO), and I find the "rest break" is needed more through lack of support than position. The exception to this is the SS-V & HSV seats.

The thing I miss least about the VE was having to do the "VE shuffle" - you can have a couple of pedestrians at a crossing completely hidden by the A-pillar, but that's a whole different can of worms, but I'd prefer to have to do that than have the wheel as low as it is. I've actually fitted a G6E steering wheel to my G6 in the hope that the flattened off part of the rim at the bottom would make a difference. Perhaps it does, marginally, but not really in reality.

The BA2 XR6 I had before the VE was one of the most comfortable cars I've ever had, and the FG is not far behind it. I can do an 8 hour drive (2x 4 hour stints with a 1/2 hour rest) in the FG and get out and feel like doing it all again. Not many cars are like that (and the VE wasn't).

Once you're in the FG, it's fine. It's the entry/egress that's a PITA. The reps at work who are in & out of their cars all day see it as a real probem.

I found the various FG-X I sat in at the dealer to all be similar to my FG with regards to the seat & steering wheel relationship, which is why I couldn't see any change. But then I sat in the passenger seat of my FG today...and quickly realised that the driver's seat has sagged quite a lot compared to the passenger one. So I now believe them when they say they've done something to the foam in the FG-X.

[arronm]

Yep totally agree the pillar in the VE VF are terrible. But Iam use to it now in the VF after having a VE for years

That pillar is quite dangerous if you arnt aware you need to look around it

That's probably why the VF has so many safety features. To many crashes from the dreaded pillar

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by Freiherr

Never mind the seating changes or the bonnet bulges. The paragraph from TopGear which caught my eye goes like this.
“Driving the FPV GT hard on a winding road was the ultimate Napisan Challenge: when pressed, the car bucked and swayed and the back end let go whenever it could. But the XR8 handles like a go-kart in comparison.”
My question, was there any major change to RSPEC for such a transformation in handling?

The author mas making the comparison to the standard GT suspension and wheel set-up.

[DFB FGXR6]

Another thing to consider with the comparisons to VE/VF and FG seating is that the Holden has a much shallower "glass house" compared to the Falcon, giving a impression of sitting lower.

[arronm]

I don't think so. I think he was asking had they changed the r spec suspension in anyway as it appeared to perform better in the XR8 than it did in the GT. Both which have R spec suspension

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by arronm

I don't think so. I think he was asking had they changed the r spec suspension in anyway as it appeared to perform better in the XR8 than it did in the GT. Both which have R spec suspension

The FPV GT did not come with the Rspec suspension. The motoring journos panned the GT as it did not have enough rubber on the rears, and they said it was too pillowy with too much body roll. That quote was in relation to the original FPV GT as compared to the FG X XR8 (with the Rspec suspension).

The GT Rspec put wider rubber on rears, thicker rear roll bar, changed geometry, stiffer springs and mounts beefed up. This was rolled out in GT Rspec and the GTF, and Ford has uploaded the acquired FPV parts bin to roll out that GT R Spec suspension into the new XR8.

So in essence, the FG X XR8 has a better suspension than the FPV GT, but is virtually identical to the FPV GT Rspec and FPV GTF. As one motoring journo wrote, will take a racing track and good driver to determine any differences in suspension performance between FGX XR8 and the FPV GT Rspec and FPV GTF.

[HO 3]

Originally Posted by Freiherr

Never mind the seating changes or the bonnet bulges. The paragraph from TopGear which caught my eye goes like this.
“Driving the FPV GT hard on a winding road was the ultimate Napisan Challenge: when pressed, the car bucked and swayed and the back end let go whenever it could. But the XR8 handles like a go-kart in comparison.”
My question, was there any major change to RSPEC for such a transformation in handling?

The author is pointing out the different virtues of R Spec vs the standard GT suspension set up.


Cheers Mick

[arronm]

Sorry. Looks like I was wrong. Obviously the R spec suspension and wider tyres work well

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by Bobman

How tall are you?

I've noticed in full electric seat models my hair will always brush the rooflining, but not so in the base models or standard XR of B Series/FG.

Ah, explains why I never had a problem with seat height in my FG......lack of hair up top to touch the rooflining



I've mentioned a number of times before on this forum that height alone is not a good measure as to who will have problems and who won't. The study of human measurement is called anthropometry (that''s pronounced an-throw-pah-met-ree for those of you who have commented before that you can't even pronounce it ) and is something I did when I managed the ejection seat for the Pilatus PC-9 fleet of aircraft as used by the RAAF.

The other factors that would be important are bottom to shoulder height, shoulder to wrist length (determines where you like to have the steering wheel in relation to your torso) ankle to knee length, knee to hip length, etc.

What you will find is that a number of people who share the same height (ie how tall they are) will still have a variation in some of the other anthropometric variables, and therefore height cannot even be used as a 'rough' guide, as some people on here are trying to use.

So, just because someone is over 6' tall and doesn't experience a problem does not mean that someone who is 6' tall can't legitimately experience a problem.

Craig H

[Professor Farnsworth]

Try installing a sunroof lol.

[bionic2006xr6t]

I'm 6,6 and have never had an issue with the seat height. I like the position and can see everything I need to with plenty of head room. The issue I have with my FG is the steering column. It can't be adjusted high enough. You look at the gap maybe 1" between the top of the column and the dash and you think it should be able to be adjusted higher but no. Yes I guess you can say lowering the seat would fix this! But so would more adjustment in the column. Lowering the seat also makes getting in and out harder. I drive a festiva work hack as a daily and find the knee to steering wheel issue worst on the FG than that.

Cheers Ryan

[Wretched]

I am not tall and found the seating from EL -> FG uncomfortably high. Never felt like I was sitting in the car, more like I was sitting on a bench.
Some may prefer this type of seating but I couldn't stand it.
Funnily enough in other cars in the Ford range (I haven't driven all cars) I don't have this issue. Must be a Falcon thing.

[LeadFoot81]

I've had plenty of time to try and find a comfortable seating position in my wife's FG and:

- the steering wheel hasn't got enough vertical adjustment
- even with the seat at its lowest setting, my knees are jammed in under the steering wheel
- ingress/egress sucks because of where the wheel sits

I do like my seat set closer to the steering wheel than most, but even moving it back a couple of notches doesn't help.

I've never had this problem with EA-AU.

It's a shame because the door openings on the FG are great, and the doors open up nice and wide. Other than that, great car.

[Blem]

[QUOTE=arronm;5276607 Sorry. Looks like I was wrong. Obviously the R spec suspension and wider tyres work well/QUOTE]

Just for the record

[XR Martin]

Last Australian Ford
Last RWD Ford sedan
Last V8 Ford sedan
Last Turbo 6 RWD Ford
Last Ford V8 car with 5 seats
Last Ford Ute
Last Ford sedan with 6cyl and manual gearbox
Only Ford sedan with supercharged V8

And we're talking about seats...

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Last Australian Ford
Last RWD Ford sedan
Last V8 Ford sedan
Last Turbo 6 RWD Ford
Last Ford V8 car with 5 seats
Last Ford Ute
Last Ford sedan with 6cyl and manual gearbox
Only Ford sedan with supercharged V8

And we're talking about seats...

And the seats are fitted to every one of those cars...so...relevant

[Nicholas Reeks]

Originally Posted by bionic2006xr6t

I'm 6,6 and have never had an issue with the seat height. I like the position and can see everything I need to with plenty of head room. The issue I have with my FG is the steering column. It can't be adjusted high enough. You look at the gap maybe 1" between the top of the column and the dash and you think it should be able to be adjusted higher but no. Yes I guess you can say lowering the seat would fix this! But so would more adjustment in the column. Lowering the seat also makes getting in and out harder. I drive a festiva work hack as a daily and find the knee to steering wheel issue worst on the FG than that.

Cheers Ryan

I'm 6'10" and have the same problem with FG's. Current Focus' have amazing head and leg room I find.

[yanknbank]

I am not tall and found the seating from EL -> FG uncomfortably high. Never felt like I was sitting in the car, more like I was sitting on a bench.

I'm of average height and the alleged lack of vertical adjustment for the steering wheel has never been an issue. Whilst the range of vertical adjustment may not be quite the same as what you get in other vehicles, I'd say it's more than adequate for what's needed in the FG.

This is something that the motoring journo's have been repeating over and over for years to the point of adnauseum, without ever justifying what they say with any hard facts or data. Eventually everyone repeats the same thing to the point....... well you know.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by yanknbank

This is something that the motoring journo's have been repeating over and over for years to the point of adnauseum, without ever justifying what they say with any hard facts or data. Eventually everyone repeats the same thing to the point....... well you know.

Or...it might an issue for some. Like I said others may enjoy the driving position offered but after driving other makes and models (including some in the Ford range) I couldn't stand it anymore.
It isn't made up, so I don't know what facts you can get out it. It's a strange comment that one, asking for facts, I suppose measure the seat to steering and roof lining and compare that with other cars. It's the only "fact" i can think of.

[commodorenutt]

There's already enough people who own them that are complaining about it - you don't need facts when it's become a common issue.

As mentioned by a few of us, it's all about the position of the seat to suit each individual's height - and everyone is different - more importantly, the height of their torso section vs leg length which determines the seat position and how far forward they need to sit.

If your legs are long enough, and you can sit back further, then you get away from the wheel more - but if your legs are too long, you end up with your knees on the wheel. A mate of mine, same height as me, was considering updating his XH to an FG. He simply couldn't get a comfortable position in my car, no matter what he tried - yet he's the same height as me.

Once I'm in, it's fine, but entry/egress is a PITA with only a small gap between the seat and the wheel, and I find I have to slide in under it, which is wearing the set trim. Leather would be a lot easier to get in & out of, as the black fabric in the G6 is quite grippy.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by commodorenutt

If your legs are long enough, and you can sit back further, then you get away from the wheel more - but if your legs are too long, you end up with your knees on the wheel. .

The steering wheel is not only adjustable for height but also reach. So get the seat in a position so that your legs are comfortable with the pedals, then move the steering wheel in, out, up and down to suit.

[superfly]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

The steering wheel is not only adjustable for height but also reach. So get the seat in a position so that your legs are comfortable with the pedals, then move the steering wheel in, out, up and down to suit.

The issue is that the wheel doesn't move up far enough. I too have never complained about any seating position in any other car but in my FG I too find that either the seat doesn't go low enough or the steering wheel doesn't go high enough. If either one of these were addressed, then I'd be fine. My wheel is on the highest it can go and the seat the lowest it can go but still I can't see the tops of either dial.

I've learned to live with it but it's definitely an issue.

[Silver Ghia]

People must have fat legs. My steering wheel is only half way up the vertical travel adjustment which gives around 140mm gap between the seat base and the steering wheel, which I find is more than sufficient to get my left leg past when getting in or out. Maximum gap when the wheel is at its highest adjustment is 165mm. My steering wheel is at its rearward most position, and adjusted so I can just see the top of the analogue dials under the wheel rim. I'm 5'10" and the gap between my head and the ceiling is about 275mm.

And once in the seating position my legs are splayed apart so there is heaps of room between my legs and the steering wheel. I find the seating/steering wheel position perfect in my FG.

[P6LTD351]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Last Australian Ford
Last RWD Ford sedan
Last V8 Ford sedan
Last Turbo 6 RWD Ford
Last Ford V8 car with 5 seats
Last Ford Ute
Last Ford sedan with 6cyl and manual gearbox
Only Ford sedan with supercharged V8

And we're talking about seats...

AMEN!

Open the door, sit down, turn on the engine and shut up!

I must be strange. I've had all sorts of Falcons, Fairlanes and LTDs and I've never had a problem.

What are we wine testers or something?

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by P6LTD351

AMEN!

Open the door, sit down, turn on the engine and shut up!

I must be strange. I've had all sorts of Falcons, Fairlanes and LTDs and I've never had a problem.

What are we wine testers or something?

How many fg's have you owned?

[commodorenutt]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

The steering wheel is not only adjustable for height but also reach. So get the seat in a position so that your legs are comfortable with the pedals, then move the steering wheel in, out, up and down to suit.

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

.........My steering wheel is at its rearward most position, and adjusted so I can just see the top of the analogue dials under the wheel rim. I'm 5'10" and the gap between my head and the ceiling is about 275mm.

What you guys are failing to understand is that when you pull the wheel out (as noted by silver Ghia, all the way rearward) the angle that the column is mounted on, means the wheel lifts up away from the seat as you pull it rearward, giving you more clearance.

That might be alright if you have long legs, and sit right back, but when my feet are on the pedals comfortably, I can only have the wheel about 1" out from the dash, otherwise I feel like I'm elbowing the window & door trim.

I am also 5'10" but as I explained further up, everyone is different in their measurements - with the seat all the way down, I only have a hand width (roughly 125mm) between my head and the roof lining. That's 150mm (6 inches in the old money) difference in torso height. Get the picture now?

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

And once in the seating position my legs are splayed apart so there is heaps of room between my legs and the steering wheel. I find the seating/steering wheel position perfect in my FG.

Like I've said a number of times, once I'm in, it's not too bad, but entry/egress is a pain in the ***.

Other cars (even smaller ones) offer a far greater level of adjustment. That's all we're pointing out - the limits of adjustment don't suit a number of people in this thread, numerous friends of mine who have sat in my car, and at least a dozen of my work colleagues who complain about it (and wonder why the Mondeo is so popular with the reps, instead of the falcon) so it's not just a journo having a sook, it is a very real problem.

Originally Posted by superfly

The issue is that the wheel doesn't move up far enough. I too have never complained about any seating position in any other car but in my FG I too find that either the seat doesn't go low enough or the steering wheel doesn't go high enough. If either one of these were addressed, then I'd be fine. My wheel is on the highest it can go and the seat the lowest it can go but still I can't see the tops of either dial.

I've learned to live with it but it's definitely an issue.

Exactly! It only needs a small amount of attention to make a big difference to many people.

[Silver Ghia]

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

.... and the gap between my head and the ceiling is about 275mm.

Whoops typo, sorry it should be 175mm.

Like everything, its designed for a certain percentile of the population, so as others have said lets enjoy the last of the Falcons, the Ford I've known best for the last 54 or so years. I'm thinking of the brand new woodgrained XL I saw as a kid in the Coffee for Ford Upper Ferntree Gully showroom when I say that.

[Blem]

Too little extra, too late.
FoA was asleep at the wheel.
Pricing & power.
Finally woke up to rear traction etc