FPV F6 E unveiled

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by zx10

Do you think that the F6E is a poor excuse for a vehicle?

Ive said multiple times that its good if you slow down and read the posts.

Another way of putting it, look at the score card. Ford from a quality and engineering perspective has a superior package to that of holden in most if not all the segments yet get trounced in sales month after month (again FPV have done ok on the odd occasion).

So Ford/FPV pour money into making their cars superior, which for those of us that know something about cars is great and we appreciate it.

But at the end of the day they need sales to continue, I cant see how this car is going to increase the trend after the usual 1-2 month honey moon period.

Im happy to be proven wrong though.

This car would be a huge cash cow for FPV because they have done bugger all to it, but in order to be a cow it has to sell in the first place.

[DJR-351]

Gotta say that is a tidy looking car, not into bling or stripes myself, i prefer the subdued look....

But for me its NOT a Ford its FPV and im still not convinced that one equals the other, no offence to the FPV fans....

Also im to much of a tight a**e to spend that much on a new car....

My 2 cents worth....

[Walt Kowalski]

Originally Posted by flappist

You guys do realise that about $5k of the $23K is kuxury car tax don't you?

Now can someone explain to me why a G6ET is $20,000 more than a XT. They are the same car with a slightly more powerful motor, different seats and wheels and a few farkles.
No leds or DVDs or multi sub woofers or anything useful........

[HSE2]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

Personally, FG FPV's weren't pushed far enough away from the donor package, visually, technologically and on some of the finer detail.

I would go a bit further.

I initially thought the same of all FG FPVs but once I heard about the cost of the FG development (in essence just an engine upgrade) from FPV I decided to alter my opinion just a bit.

I am ok with the GT and the F6 but I have issue with the GT-P and the GT-E and now the F6 E. I also have issue with the G6E package as well.
When Ford dropped the long wheel base cars I expected that some of the exclusive features from such a model would filter down to the luxury SWB versions. The G6E is an excellent package, so good that it does put pressure to justify the extra FPV coin, but in terms of luxury appointments or technical innovation that is expected in the premium market, Ford are just a little underwhelming.

We don’t really expect FPV to go out by themselves and package the cars up outside of perhaps one technical innovation and perhaps one more interior highlight exclusive to them. They are relying on Ford to hand them a package that is competitive in the appointment stakes. Sounds tough I know but the expectations in this region is just a little higher than what Ford are currently delivering. Exposure to the entry point Euros is partially to blame.

I would take the HSV Senator over any other local luxury package. It delivers more features and makes a bigger technical statement and I really do think in this end of the market that such statements play on the minds of perspective customers.

FPV could do a better job of packaging these luxury cars by making Sat Nav standard but the cupboard is pretty bare. There is no sunroof option. Yeah I know but it’s a feature that is valuable in this end of the market and another option Ford don't provide.

I can afford this car as well and am in the market right now to replace my daily driver. My European exposure has me understanding and liking the understated appearance but the lack of upper features or at least one technical exclusive feature just doesn't hold my attention. I simply don’t dislike the GT package enough to walk past that option. While ultimately it might not make the best statement in terms of buying the best FPV money can buy, in terms of what you get for your coin it makes a better fist of not pretending to be something it isn't.

The GT-P and the GT-E range are now pretending to be something they aren't. Package wise they are just a little underdone. Personally I would pay slightly more to have these products packaged accordingly.

FG was a tough task for FPV. I hope to see many of these issues revisited with the update next year.

[Ibrox90]

Originally Posted by F6 FOON

I did back to back testing of an 07 XR6T and my now owned 07 F6 when deciding the purchase, let me tell you when you do the back to back testing it becomes so very clear the difference between the Ford and the FPV that it might as well slap you in the face. Before you can bag the new F6-E, why dont you do a back to back test with a G6ET and see if you can find the $20k difference because there will be some.

As the saying goes don't knock it til you try it.

Now if I could part with my F6 through desire to upgrade the F6-E will be the first to be tested.

I had the same with the XR8 and the GT huge difference. BAsed on price and what you get for the extra money for the GT i decided on XR8

[GT-E]

Being the owner of a GT-E, I feel that I can comment on all that has been said.
While there may not be measurable value in the addons in comparison to a G6ET, there is pleanty of difference.

Firstly they are very rare and are noticed by real car enthusists.
I was at a Vodafone drive day on Tuesday with Craig Lowndes and Jamie Whincup and both of them noticed my car in the carpark. CL even said he wanted one, but was given a 5th GT in black.

The dealer principal of my local BMW dealer came over and had a close look and was shocked when he saw what a great package FPV have created and questioned the price of a M5 at 3 times the cost.

While there is many people who would spend $xxxxxx on modifying a G6ET to try to get a better car, it would never be a F6E, it would only be a modified G6ET.

Well done to FPV for taking the step in creating a high profile low volume build to order car. It is just a pity that they do not allow for more customizing for the intended owner.

Myself, it would be a hard decision choosing between the F6E and the GT-E, but I am happy with my choice as it is the best car I have ever owned by a mile and gets the looks form people who know what it is.

[Snelens]

I love it!
If they do something similar in a Territory, the boss & I will be throwing the SAAB keys away.

[Polyal]

GT-E, can I ask a question, if the manual was an option would you go for it?

What do you use the car for? daily?

Very curious to hear from an owner.

[Walt Kowalski]

Congratulations to everyone involved in releasing this gorgeous F6 E.

Now can you get a F6 E Ute organised??

Or can Ford get a G6E T Ute happening???

Yes I know a ute is supposed to be utilitarion but some of us treat them as 2 seater sports cars with a big boot and do not want racoon eyes and boy racer wings.

PLEASE no comments about a "luxury" ute not being wanted by anyone.

Well done FPV

[GT-E]

Originally Posted by Polyal

GT-E, can I ask a question, if the manual was an option would you go for it?

What do you use the car for? daily?

Very curious to hear from an owner.

Nope, the ZF is the best gearbox hands down.
I owned a BF F6 ZF for 3 years before I got the E, so I was looking for something different. I got my car for a very good deal, essentially it was the same driveaway price as a F6. I did look at a new GTR, M3 and R36 Passat, but nothing came close for bang for buck.

It is a daily driver in Sydney traffic and is a very nice car to drive. The only option is Satnav or NCO red leather. Personally the Satnav should have been standard, as I would never pay for it as it is crap and not worth $3k

[bloggs24]

Originally Posted by GT-E

Being the owner of a GT-E, I feel that I can comment on all that has been said.
While there may not be measurable value in the addons in comparison to a G6ET, there is pleanty of difference.

Firstly they are very rare and are noticed by real car enthusists.
I was at a Vodafone drive day on Tuesday with Craig Lowndes and Jamie Whincup and both of them noticed my car in the carpark. CL even said he wanted one, but was given a 5th GT in black.

The dealer principal of my local BMW dealer came over and had a close look and was shocked when he saw what a great package FPV have created and questioned the price of a M5 at 3 times the cost.

While there is many people who would spend $xxxxxx on modifying a G6ET to try to get a better car, it would never be a F6E, it would only be a modified G6ET.

Well done to FPV for taking the step in creating a high profile low volume build to order car. It is just a pity that they do not allow for more customizing for the intended owner.

Myself, it would be a hard decision choosing between the F6E and the GT-E, but I am happy with my choice as it is the best car I have ever owned by a mile and gets the looks form people who know what it is.

I personally wouldnt give a damn about what others think when theres 20 grand+ on the line for something, whereas something else is a little cheaper and hardly any different.
IMO exclusivity is not worth it, a build number isnt going to sway my decision when it comes to buying new, Ill leave that to the test drive.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by GT-E

Nope, the ZF is the best gearbox hands down.
I owned a BF F6 ZF for 3 years before I got the E, so I was looking for something different. I got my car for a very good deal, essentially it was the same driveaway price as a F6. I did look at a new GTR, M3 and R36 Passat, but nothing came close for bang for buck.

It is a daily driver in Sydney traffic and is a very nice car to drive. The only option is Satnav or NCO red leather. Personally the Satnav should have been standard, as I would never pay for it as it is crap and not worth $3k

Yeah I agree, the ZF is better but was interested if you thought about the manual. If the manual was better would you consider it?

For your situation going through sydney would mean the auto would be a no brainer really.

The F6/GT E should really have no options other than sunroof and leather colour.

Are you the type to go racing at all?

Final questions I swear.

[GT-E]

I would have considered the manual if I had gotten a GT-P or GT, but the GTE is not really a manual car choice, as it is an exec cruiser.
I have had a manual XR6Turbo and is had bad driveline backlash that Ford thought was "normal". This really turned me off the manuals in the Ford range as they still clunk in the FG.

My car has been on the track (eastern Creek) for the FPV drive day and I tracked my XR6T and F6 many times, but not this car. I will be getting a track car in the next 12 months to wear the lead off the right foot.
If you have not driven a ZF, I suggest you do as I have owned over 30 cars and only 3 Autos, 2 of which were Fords with ZF's, the other was a SWB Pajero.

[Paddyboy]

So your saying that this car is worth $79K because it has a few features that pretty much standard on cars in the 45-55K range?

I thought FPV was supposed to offer something special? This car has nothing to offer over the G6E-T, its not even that much faster (not enough anyway).

FPV needs, technology and innovation as standard and options that are not available on normal cars, and not available in the Falcon range and are completely unique to the model.

As it stands there is nothing hard about buying your own XT and coming very close to making your own equivalent spec car. It won't be an 'FPV' but so what, the FPV part doesn't actually give you anything except a build number. I doubt anyone on here woudl admit to wanting one because it has a number printed in the dash.

And if you have the money to pay for that privilege then your really demonstatring you have more cents the sense.

Ok, I know someone already has proven that if you add all the extra's a F6E has over a base XT that it'll cost even more if you did it yourself, but this comment is ridiculous. Why would anyone, ever, ever, ever want to buy an XT and spend an extra 40 grand and make it a F6E equivilant??????? If you did that, it would be hilarious to compare the two cars after 5 years when it came time to selling them, I reckon the F6E after 5 years would be worth around $35k mark, maybe more, but the XT would be worth 15k at best. So who in their right mind would do it?

The thing that bothers me about this whole topic is FPV have just brought out another great looking car (we can all agree with that, well mostly), it looks great, will go great, it has a little niche, people will buy it, its good for Ford and FPV, BUT, most of us on here a just bagging FPV and saying we wouldnt buy it! Are we Ford supporters or what? They havent brought out another AU here, the F6E is a beautiful machine and if you dont have the money to buy one, you arent qualified to whinge about its price or whether you would buy it. You guys are hard to please..
Remember that a european car with similar specs (maybe not the gadgetry) such as the BMW 550, which only has 270kws or the E class 500. Sure the BMW has the 7 speed box now, but the BMW and MERC are around 160K to 180K, so we are talking 100K less for a refined local High performance Luxury car! Now im not saying the F6E can match BMW in all departments, the BMW is engineered better and all the rest but for 80K the FPV is still a good car. Lets hope that FPV can implement some more specs and gadgets in coming models.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by bloggs24

I personally wouldnt give a damn about what others think when theres 20 grand+ on the line for something, whereas something else is a little cheaper and hardly any different.
IMO exclusivity is not worth it, a build number isnt going to sway my decision when it comes to buying new, Ill leave that to the test drive.

Do they put your P plate in the windscreen or stick it to the number plate when you do your test drive?

[YOOT]

Originally Posted by Paddyboy

Ok, I know someone already has proven that if you add all the extra's a F6E has over a base XT that it'll cost even more if you did it yourself, but this comment is ridiculous. Why would anyone, ever, ever, ever want to buy an XT and spend an extra 40 grand and make it a F6E equivilant??????? If you did that, it would be hilarious to compare the two cars after 5 years when it came time to selling them, I reckon the F6E after 5 years would be worth around $35k mark, maybe more, but the XT would be worth 15k at best. So who in their right mind would do it? .

You wouldn't but the fact that you can and for much less only strengthens the point that this car is over priced and under delivers. FPVs still feel too much like their donor (the XT) the entire dashboard just reeks of cheap base model. I honestly don't have solution to this problem, but is too much money for what is still a Falcon with go fast bits.

HSV have the same problem.

If it was the same price as the F6 then this story would be different.

And don't talk about resale values and Ford in the same sentence, there is no such thing LOL!

[Fev]

Originally Posted by YOOT

You wouldn't but the fact that you can and for much less only strengthens the point that this car is over priced and under delivers. FPVs still feel too much like their donor (the XT) the entire dashboard just reeks of cheap base model. I honestly don't have solution to this problem, but is too much money for what is still a Falcon with go fast bits.

HSV have the same problem.

If it was the same price as the F6 then this story would be different.

And don't talk about resale values and Ford in the same sentence, there is no such thing LOL!

atleast the HSV has a bit more difference then a bodykit and GFB's though - even if it is just the taillights and rear quarters over every other VE model

[GT69]

Alright, hypothetical time. The f6e comes with ever extra as standard, plus a few other things on top. They ask you for a cheque for $120,000. You'd all still whinge it was over priced. God how many people, out of all of you paid the extra, what $2500 for sat nav? Not many I would bet. What if your g6e was $2500 more expensive but came with sat nav? You'd still bloody complain that you didn't need it. They just cant win with you lot.

[HSE2]

Originally Posted by GT69

Alright, hypothetical time. The f6e comes with ever extra as standard, plus a few other things on top. They ask you for a cheque for $120,000. You'd all still whinge it was over priced. God how many people, out of all of you paid the extra, what $2500 for sat nav? Not many I would bet. What if your g6e was $2500 more expensive but came with sat nav? You'd still bloody complain that you didn't need it. They just cant win with you lot.

A bit tough. With the advancement of portable Sat Nav systems in terms of performance and price a factory offering for well over double is behind the times. A bigger question would be how many people are buying portable Sat Nav devices and sticking them on the windscreen?

That will tell you if it’s a desirable feature. If the answer to that is yes then FPV probably need to offer Sat nav as standard for about the same money as the car is now.

It's natural that consumers look at the spec sheet and compare features above that of the car below to see what they are buying.

I think the GT-E gets reverse camera as standard and more electric adjustment for the driver, maybe an extra memory position. It not much in the way of extra luxury features in say comparison to the Senator or some entry level European cars.

Just speaking for myself I would probably buy the GT-P or the Senator if I really disliked the GT-Ps appearance too much, (which I don’t)

I wouldn’t buy the GT-E or F6E because I disagree with its presentation but rather the feature list of a car in this category doesn't tick all of the boxes I require it to make me seriously think about it.

That not really FPVs fault. Ford just hasn’t implemented many of those features that give greater appreciation for spending a few more thousand, not the 40 odd in your example.

The Australian consumer is very very tough and it not about winning with us it’s about finding buyers that will purchase this product.

We had a similar situation with the Force cars. I said the same thing then. The people talking it up didn't buy one. At least when I whinge I have a reason why I won’t support the product. In this case I suspect my opinion will be the same as many. Essentially, as a very small nitch FPV, must have found a way to get the business case to work. That is good news, it means they think they can sell the car and that's all that matters.

Telling people why I wouldn’t buy one isn't a whinge just my opinion.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by HSE2

A bit tough. With the advancement of portable Sat Nav systems in terms of performance and price a factory offering for well over double is behind the times. A bigger question would be how many people are buying portable Sat Nav devices and sticking them on the windscreen?

The major difference in the price between the portable units and the inbuilt is that they use different technology.

The inbuilt units use accellerometers to track the movement of the car and only use the GPS to confirm positioning. This is why they work imediately on startup, in tunnels etc. or when there are few or no satellites available and do not get so easily confused if you take or miss a turn they do expect. They can also tell which direction you are pointed, whether you are reversing or going forward, whether you have changed to a side lane that is close to the main road etc.

All of the portable units work on GPS only and take time to start up (which can be anything from 10 seconds up to several hours when signals are bad) and can only tell you are in what direction or how fast you are moving by comparing your position to the last (few) positions. The often miss location fixes for whatever reason (usually interference to signals) and just assume you are following the predicted path. This is why they get so confused when you turn the wrong way and then play catchup.

I had one of each in my F6 and used to play games when I was bored making them track along different parallel roads. I was never able to trick the DENSO inbiult unit but have managed to confuse the hell out of Navmans, TomTom, Magellans and Route 66.

So in summary, the protables are nowhere near as clever as the fixed units but if they do the job you want then buy one, if you want better then buy the inbuilt.

A FG XT has the same number of seats, will do the same maximum legal speeds and carry the same amount of groceries as a FPV GT-E (or F6-E).

The FPV just does it all a whole lot better......

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by flappist

The major difference in the price between the portable units and the inbuilt is that they use different technology.

The inbuilt units use accellerometers to track the movement of the car and only use the GPS to confirm positioning. This is why they work imediately on startup, in tunnels etc. or when there are few or no satellites available and do not get so easily confused if you take or miss a turn they do expect. They can also tell which direction you are pointed, whether you are reversing or going forward, whether you have changed to a side lane that is close to the main road etc.

All of the portable units work on GPS only and take time to start up (which can be anything from 10 seconds up to several hours when signals are bad) and can only tell you are in what direction or how fast you are moving by comparing your position to the last (few) positions. The often miss location fixes for whatever reason (usually interference to signals) and just assume you are following the predicted path. This is why they get so confused when you turn the wrong way and then play catchup.

I had one of each in my F6 and used to play games when I was bored making them track along different parallel roads. I was never able to trick the DENSO inbiult unit but have managed to confuse the hell out of Navmans, TomTom, Magellans and Route 66.

You mean like this??

[HSE2]

I have both Tony and I can tell you the latest Tom Tom does very nicely without the accelerometer.

Latest version of Tom Tom home and live map update make the only real difference between the two as tunnel travel, but then really how many times do people do that and if so what options have you got to change directions.

There is no way in hell I would recommend people pay so much for a factory unit unless seamless integration was a requirement.

I do have an external antenna though.

[ST]

^I've seen that image before many times, sometimes funny but often frustrating (especially when you are in the middle of a FREEWAY).

I'm definitely getting an inbuilt GPS in my next car. I don't need a portable GPS plus nearly all mobile phones have a GPS these days, the one on my phone is excellent.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by HSE2

I have both Tony and I can tell you the latest Tom Tom does very nicely without the accelerometer.

Latest version of Tom Tom home and live map update make the only real difference between the two as tunnel travel, but then really how many times do people do that and if so what options have you got to change directions.

There is no way in hell I would recommend people pay so much for a factory unit unless seamless integration was a requirement.

I do have an external antenna though.

Yeh I have a TomTom in the Z at the moment and it is a better than 95% solution.

The only real time I miss the DENSO is when I am in heavy traffic by myself and not sure how to get where I am going so I spend the majority of time trying not to run over other vehicles not looking at the satnav.
It is annoying when you can't take an exit because you are actually on the wrong road and you have to travel 3 or 4 km in 5km/h bumper to bumper traffic before you can turn back.

In saying that I definitely do not miss the $400 per year for map updates.

This is still an emerging technology. I remember when basic car radios and aircon were very expensive options with aftermarket being much cheaper albeit "clunky". In the next few years I am fairly confident that all cars will have satnavs standard.

But back to the topic (almost), if I do lash out and buy a F6-E it will be lightning strike or maybe winter white with black seats and satnav.

[outback_ute]

Apparently orders are healthy so far, not big numbers but they were never planned to be

[bloggs24]

Originally Posted by flappist

Do they put your P plate in the windscreen or stick it to the number plate when you do your test drive?

Not sure what point you're trying to make, but mine still stands. If you've got 20+ grand to blow then hell, go blow it and be as exclusive as you want, for 20 grand all youre getting is a little extra attention.

BTW i really dont appreciate you're unwaranted attack, ive made no attack towards you or anyone else in this thread.

[HSE2]

Actually, you aren't. The idea is not to create attention. Its a "less is more" take on appearance

[bloggs24]

Originally Posted by HSE2

Actually, you aren't. The idea is not to create attention. Its a "less is more" take on appearance

I understand that, in relation to the F6E i completely agree.

Im not attacking GTE im just using his post as an example:

Being the owner of a GT-E, I feel that I can comment on all that has been said.
While there may not be measurable value in the addons in comparison to a G6ET, there is pleanty of difference.

What he gets, and he admits to, is that in terms of accessories etc, he might not be getting much more then what a G6ET has, but what he does get is exclusivity as they arent very common.
There is a market for it, is exclusivity worth an extra 20 grand? in MY opinion, no it isnt, in GTE's opinion, Yes it is.

[ORSM-XT]

http://www.carsales.com.au/news/2009...-pricing-16059

FPV Announces F6E Pricing

FPV announces F6E pricing
words - Ken Gratton
On sale in September, the stealthy-but-strong F6E will appeal to a select group of buyers

Refinement and performance for not that much moolah? Ford Performance Vehicles' MD, Rod Barrett has some good news for you. As the Carsales Network reported earlier, the niche manufacturer is going ahead with limited-volume production of the F6E unveiled at the Melbourne International Motor Show earlier this year.

"We launched this car at the Melbourne Motor Show as a concept vehicle and the expressions of interest in it have been enough to warrant us to go into a production run of the vehicle," said Barrett in conversation with the Carsales Network earlier today.

"They're not huge numbers, but they will cater for a boutique group of executives that wish to drive the F6 in executive form."

Barrett believes that now is a good time to introduce this car. Feedback from the public has been good, but the company's dealer body has also got behind the car.

"The dealer support has been very encouraging for the car at launch. Our production run for August and September is almost complete. Like I said, it's only a small production run this year and we'll just see how it goes," says Barrett, who puts the production batch for this year at "less than 50 [units]".

"It's a car that we've always probably wanted to do... Whether that goes to a hundred cars next year or 150, who knows?"

Barrett puts the current production ratio of V8-powered FPV models to turbo sixes at 65:35 roughly. He doesn't believe the model mix has changed significantly since the introduction of the FG Falcon, but does cite increased interest in the F6 turbo cars. Although the company is setting conservative sales projections for the F6E, the decision to produce it has presumably also been contingent on improving sales for the F6.

"In the future, it wouldn't surprise me if [the mix of drivetrain variants] evened up at a 55:45 sort of thing," says Barrett. I think we're always going to be a V8 company... but there is a new generation of person coming into the fold... that's looking outside a V8."

The F6E, priced at $79,740 (manufacturer's list price, not including on-road costs), will be a permanent addition to the range, not just a limited edition, and will go on sale September 1.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by Paddyboy

haha some of you guys make me laugh.


The XT isnt just different seats and wheels and motor, the G6ET is a totally different car! Im not going to even explain why, surely can tell the differences and the 20grand price difference.

Absolutely! The plastic wheel trims don't fit over the alloys for a start!

Dan