.0019%

[mcflux]

Stefan - I identify as left-wing. I posted that link (showing Australia isn't in the top 10) in spite of my views.

[Stefan]

Sorry mate, despite quoting you, my comment was in general and not aimed at you or anyone in particular.

[snowcone]

How can anyone in their right mind continue to believe that we are big polluters.
Look at the changes in the last 50 years in Australia (and probably most of the developed nations)
In Australia we no longer have BHP making steel, we no longer have lead smelters, half the aluminium smelters in NSW are closed, we no longer have small stand alone city power stations but massive efficient state ones, estimated over 90% of vehicles have catalitic converters, we no longer have lead based fuels or paints, we have gotten rid of ozone depleting gases in domestic, industrial and automotive refrigeration systems, we no longer have lead based fuels and are using 10% ethynol, international and national aircraft are using the most effective jet engines ever, railroad diesel engines are now more fuel efficient producing their lowest emissions ever.

The point is - WE AREN'T MAKING ANY POLLUTION like we did in the past so what the hell do we have to do to make the mung bean munchers realise that we don't have to throw billions of much needed money to fix a non existent problem.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

Or the enlightened policy will ensure jobs migration in an transitioning economy which will prosper, our per capita emissions will tumble, and we wont suffer trade sanctions because if our belief we don't pollute enough to worry about. I cant prove this as much as you cant prove otherwise. Lets have this discussion again in 30 years and se who was right
I believe based on the science I've read that continue the way were going will end in environmental, social and of course economic ruin.
JP

There is no policy which govco of any flavor could put in place to make this "transitioning economy" a reality. There is no renewable energy technology that can be manufactured in Australia and be economically viable. There is no way to revive manufacturing in Australia, far too much damage has been done and with the pending demise of the big three car makers, the point of no return will be reached.

The only way to ensure long term prosperity whilst not having a negative impact on the planet is to trigger a genuine paradigm shift where any trace of the current governmental structures is vaporised and the economic foundation of debt is good and exponential growth is king becomes an entry in the history books.

[jpblue1000]

Loud, I hear what your saying regarding existing or short horizon proposed policy.
I disagree on the rest. I believe renewable technologies exist and that they will work in our situation. They do require a paradigm shift in knowledge of the proletariat to gain support.
If we want to manufacture again we pay. Subsidy, co development and education will cost our society. But we have knowhow, capability but just lack will power. I pay a high 45 cents in the dollar tax but consider generally per capita Australia to be a medium taxed country. When you ask australians to pay for the future they ***** about how much they pay. Then ***** about governments borrowing on their behalf to provide what they ***** about not having.
These issues prevent our governmental system working. Or perhaps its lack of true leadership
JP

[mike_nofx]

Meh, the Earth will survive my lifetime, my childrens lifetime and my childrens childrens lifetime. I should care beyond that because why??

[Trump]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

Loud, I hear what your saying regarding existing or short horizon proposed policy.
I disagree on the rest. I believe renewable technologies exist and that they will work in our situation. They do require a paradigm shift in knowledge of the proletariat to gain support.
If we want to manufacture again we pay. Subsidy, co development and education will cost our society. But we have knowhow, capability but just lack will power. I pay a high 45 cents in the dollar tax but consider generally per capita Australia to be a medium taxed country. When you ask australians to pay for the future they ***** about how much they pay. Then ***** about governments borrowing on their behalf to provide what they ***** about not having.
These issues prevent our governmental system working. Or perhaps its lack of true leadership
JP

Renewable energy technology does exist, however these technologies will not work in our situation. I've said it before as have others, nuclear is the only option to replace baseload generating capacity currently provided by coal (brown in Victoria, higher quality black in NSW and other states).

Even if by some miracle consensus was reached and nuclear was adopted, all of the equipment and technology to build the plants would have to be imported. The expertise to engineer safe fast breeder nuclear fission plants does not exist in Australia, the education system has failed the nation in maintaining such expertise.

The political system attracts low quality candidates because it is fundamentally broken; so broken that what the politicritters get upto is accepted as "just the way it is", the bureaucracy is completely unaccountable to the electorate, the candidates for either team are glory hounds or have failed in their chosen profession, but ultimately, both teams answer to those much higher in the food chain than themselves.

[snowcone]

I back up my previous post with a photo of Pittsburgh taken in the 1940's when the real pollution was going on.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by snowcone

I back up my previous post with a photo of Pittsburgh taken in the 1940's when the real pollution was going on.
image

So like modern day china.

[goo33]

And them Ice-breakers keep gettin stuck in ice as yer Antarctic got a helluva lot bigger in the last coupla years.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by vztrt

So like modern day china.

Yep... was going to say the exact same thing after experiencing similar when I was there.

[snowcone]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

Yep... was going to say the exact same thing after experiencing similar when I was there.

So why is Australia wasting $1B to supposedly cut down pollution when the richest country in the world is making most of it.
Money down the drain more like it

[mcflux]

Originally Posted by snowcone

So why is Australia wasting $1B to supposedly cut down pollution when the richest country in the world is making most of it.
Money down the drain more like it

China's actually making some fairly drastic changes to their energy sector right now, & this year appears to be the first year that global CO2 outputs have actually dropped (albeit negligibly), with China's actions being at the forefront of this.

[snowcone]

Well that's great news. We don't have to waste that Billion now.
A few new hospitals and some new infrastructure that is not in Sydney would be good please.
That last comment was for Baird who doesn't realise there is anywhere in NSW outside of Sydney.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by snowcone

Well that's great news. We don't have to waste that Billion now.
A few new hospitals and some new infrastructure that is not in Sydney would be good please.
That last comment was for Baird who doesn't realise there is anywhere in NSW outside of Sydney.

You mean state government issues and not federal?

[SpoolMan]

neither, the discussion isn't about any political party..

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by snowcone

So why is Australia wasting $1B to supposedly cut down pollution when the richest country in the world is making most of it.
Money down the drain more like it

Give me the $1,000,000,000 and ill make it go down the drain with hookers and fast cars

[superyob]

Down the drain???

[monzie]

You want real pollution? I'd be more worried about some crazy with a nuke.

[Tom Tucker]

If only the world's leaders were reading this instead of wasting their time with a useless climate agreement. Clearly they missed the news that the polar ice is thicker than ever before

[LTD Ute]

100% of 195 nations seem to agree there is a problem and commit to rectify.

How do the percentages stack up now?

[Maka]

Originally Posted by LTD Ute

100% of 195 nations seem to agree there is a problem and commit to rectify.

How do the percentages stack up now?

Strange that! I would like to see guaranteed the developing nations can only access the fund with genuine & proven physical efforts in reducing their pollution, not in anyway rorting the fund.

No pain no gain, no money!

cheer's, Maka

[superyob]

Originally Posted by LTD Ute

100% of 195 nations seem to agree there is a problem and commit to rectify.

How do the percentages stack up now?

Fairly poorly given the ratio of ecotards to lip service of populist leaders and mainstream majority with far more important matters to deal with in day to day life...

[LTD Ute]

Originally Posted by superyob

mainstream majority

Here's the truth bro

[OCTANEBOSS]

Originally Posted by superyob

mainstream majority

Whats an abattoir- baaaa

[superyob]

Brilliant repudiation of the climate lies...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PiFJ4AJagIw

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

People need to realise that this push by these closet commies has nothing to do with saving the planet. The impetus for action towards climate change comes from much higher up in the food chain than those genuinely concerned about the impact of humankind on the planet. As with the current war of terror, one simply needs to follow the money to see who will benefit the most from what could turn out to be the largest transfer of wealth in the history of civilisation.

I'm all for leaving the planet in a better condition than we found it, but this has nothing to do with mitigating the impact of people on the world.

Spot on. Putin has been calling out the US and the west as the founders of ISIS. Follow the money trail he says.

I like him, he has balls.

[flooded one]

Originally Posted by Romulus

Spot on. Putin has been calling out the US and the west as the founders of ISIS. Follow the money trail he says.

I like him, he has balls.

I agree. be good if more politicians where like this

[nuthin' fancy]

Originally Posted by Romulus

Spot on. Putin has been calling out the US and the west as the founders of ISIS. Follow the money trail he says.

I like him, he has balls.

Putin cannot be used as an example for anything. A bigoted, racist, greedy warmonger, but polictially savvy.

Doesn't mean he's worth the oxygen he consumes, though.

[Ford Falcon XR6]

Originally Posted by nuthin' fancy

Putin cannot be used as an example for anything. A bigoted, racist, greedy warmonger, but polictially savvy.

At least what you see is what you get with him better than the smoke and mirrors our local pollies rely on. Better the evil you know then the one you don't you know where you stand with a guy like Putin.