Countdown to new LPG I6 - Page 9

PoweredByCNG · 31-03-2011, 12:18 AM

Just to clear things up, the upcoming problems aren't legal problems and they're not teething problems either. The problem is more serious than that.

Martys-Bionic-XR · 31-03-2011, 12:24 AM

isnt the government going to be taxing LPG much heavily, i heard doubling of the current price.

Chilliman · 31-03-2011, 12:53 AM

If Ford can't get LPG Falcon back out into the market soon then they may as well start preparing to close down Australian manufacturing operations - yes its that serious!

Just what is the nature of a problem that is rearing its head at what must be the 11th hour?

PoweredByCNG · 31-03-2011, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cm27456

isnt the government going to be taxing LPG much heavily, i heard doubling of the current price.

2.5c/L increase per annum from 1 July this year until 2015 when the excise will be capped at 12.5c/L. Petrol in comparison has a 38c/L excise.

PoweredByCNG · 31-03-2011, 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chilliman

Just what is the nature of a problem that is rearing its head at what must be the 11th hour?

Don't quote me, but the problem does not lie within Ford. The problem lies with one of the companies that is contracted to supply Ford with components. I can't go any deeper into the subject.

Martys-Bionic-XR · 31-03-2011, 01:16 AM

supplying company is goin down the shoot?

Buntz · 31-03-2011, 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WOTDAH

The diff bush is on sedan (IRS) I was referring to the UTE. The IRS can handle a 335kw GT so I doubt the LPG I6 will destroy it.

With Autogas available in most places in Australia, and current petrol prices being what they are. Would it be prudent for Ford to included LPi on more than just XT and G6?

Swordsman88 · 31-03-2011, 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoweredByCNG

Don't quote me, but the problem does not lie within Ford. The problem lies with one of the companies that is contracted to supply Ford with components. I can't go any deeper into the subject.

I understand you can't go any deeper due to confidences. It is great you are able to provide insider information but if you are unable to provide evidence than it may be best to keep it to yourself. THis is purely based on the image it sends out to people (including those that aren't members but just surfing the forums) that Ford (by implication evne though its a supplier) can't get their stuff together.

With this system being the first of its kind by a manufacturer in this country (and to my knowledge the first dedicated factory fitted system in the world) there were always going to be a range of teething problems. If the technical ones are overcome (at some expense knowing ford's internal powerpack standards) and the legal hurdles taken care off (gov wouldnt' want to have an anti local car manufacturing image on their hands) than i think ford will get it to market no matter what ASAP. If a supplier (worse case) went under then it would be like the DSI situation with the auto gearboxes. Ford effectively bailed them out to keep production going in the medium term. LPG (and this sytem in particular) is too important to ford to not make it work.

Only other issue would be some sort of technical problem with a part from the supplier. But that would only delay the car a few months into production and given alot of the system is the same as aftermarket LPI systems already in use i can't see there being much left to go wrong..... Of course as i said you can't provide any evidence then we can't really say much more....

bobthebilda · 31-03-2011, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cm27456

supplying company is goin down the shoot?

They may have to increase the size of that shoot. Apart from the rumoured issues with supplier for the LPG, theres another one (and this one has over $100 million in yearly turnover, but not just with Ford), that may have the rug pulled from under it by authorities for inability to meet financial requirements.

Most suppliers are doing worse than at the height of GFC.

PoweredByCNG · 31-03-2011, 03:43 AM

All I can add is that the the supplier of the LPG fuel delivery system for the EcoLPI engine (Orbital Autogas) is not involved in the latest round of issues.

XR Martin · 31-03-2011, 10:11 AM

Sounds like the tanks then....

Buntz · 31-03-2011, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoweredByCNG

All I can add is that the the supplier of the LPG fuel delivery system for the EcoLPI engine (Orbital Autogas) is not involved in the latest round of issues.

Whatever it is... I hope Ford can find another supplier.

If I had the dough. I'd lay it down on an LPi Falcon as soon as released.

jpd80 · 31-03-2011, 03:28 PM

This wouldn't be the first time Ford has struggled with suppliers in trouble,
I recall a few years ago they had to give money to a supplier in advance to
get their parts, I think it was brackets or something for power steering or A/C?

It's also a worrying sign when companies like Bosch start relocating manufacturing overseas...

Buntz · 31-03-2011, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

This wouldn't be the first time Ford has struggled with suppliers in trouble,
I recall a few years ago they had to give money to a supplier in advance to
get their parts, I think it was brackets or something for power steering or A/C?

It's also a worrying sign when companies like Bosch start relocating manufacturing overseas...

A carbon tax doesn't help either.

jpd80 · 31-03-2011, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

A carbon tax doesn't help either.

Especially if people start arguing that fuel excises should be directly related to the carbon produced,
this would lead to increased biased towards diesel vehicles at the expense of petrol and LPG.

Paxton · 31-03-2011, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

This wouldn't be the first time Ford has struggled with suppliers in trouble,
I recall a few years ago they had to give money to a supplier in advance to
get their parts, I think it was brackets or something for power steering or A/C?

It's also a worrying sign when companies like Bosch start relocating manufacturing overseas...

Let's see -

Ajax Spurway
Venture Plastics (formerly Ford)
BTR/ION

These are only a few of the suppliers (that I can remember off the top of my head) that Ford have bankrolled to guarantee supplies. Don't think they wouldn't do it again if the alternative was stopping supply. Halting that production line costs millions of dollars a day.

Bossxr8 · 31-03-2011, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

With Autogas available in most places in Australia, and current petrol prices being what they are. Would it be prudent for Ford to included LPi on more than just XT and G6?

LPi will be available on XT, G6, G6E and XR6, plus utes.

Paxton · 31-03-2011, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

LPi will be available on XT, G6, G6E and XR6, plus utes.

So no delay then?

Road_Warrior · 31-03-2011, 05:47 PM

Personally I'm calling BS.

Paxton · 31-03-2011, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Personally I'm calling BS.

Me too.

Bossxr8 · 31-03-2011, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

So no delay then?

Nope. If something happens to a supplier later down the track then that will be dealt with if it happens, they won't just stop the program on a maybe.

ATM its all systems go.

vztrt · 31-03-2011, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

Let's see -

Ajax Spurway
Venture Plastics (formerly Ford)
BTR/ION

And the rest. Ford have dealt with suppliers going under a fair bit. Sometimes they help them otherwise they make sure they find someone to keep producing what they need to not stop the production line.

phillyc · 31-03-2011, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Nope. If something happens to a supplier later down the track then that will be dealt with if it happens, they won't just stop the program on a maybe.

ATM its all systems go.

Great news.

Paxton · 31-03-2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Nope. If something happens to a supplier later down the track then that will be dealt with if it happens, they won't just stop the program on a maybe.

ATM its all systems go.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Great news.

Exactly. I think there is too much riding on this (in terms of sales and money wise), to let it go like that.

ratter · 31-03-2011, 07:07 PM

PoweredbyCNG has mentioned a very strong rumour in the trade at the momment that appears to be true, how it affects ford, time will tell

Road_Warrior · 31-03-2011, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratter

PoweredbyCNG has mentioned a very strong rumour in the trade at the momment that appears to be true, how it affects ford, time will tell

Given the contrary information provided in this thread by people who have first hand knowledge of the project, I am inclined to believe that this rumour is either a) based on old information or b) malicious.

Buntz · 31-03-2011, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Nope. If something happens to a supplier later down the track then that will be dealt with if it happens, they won't just stop the program on a maybe.

ATM its all systems go.

Yey... LPi is the sex. More sex than EcoBoost. So it seems priority assessing isn't lacking at FoA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

LPi will be available on XT, G6, G6E and XR6, plus utes.

Awesome. I'd love an LPi XR6.... or maybe a G6, depends how I choose, Sports or Luxury?

JPFS1 · 31-03-2011, 09:03 PM

There are many more suppliers out there willing to come to the party. It's not the first time Ford have had to switch suppliers... RGOR, Petrol Tanks etc are recent ones, just means there's a whole lot of testing that has to happen again and gives you an idea as to the things that can delay programs.

Buntz · 31-03-2011, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPFS1

There are many more suppliers out there willing to come to the party. It's not the first time Ford have had to switch suppliers... RGOR, Petrol Tanks etc are recent ones, just means there's a whole lot of testing that has to happen again and gives you an idea as to the things that can delay programs.

Yeah... you can get LPi aftermarket parts if you're resourceful. And if you're as resourceful as FoA.... you'd have a short list of alternative suppliers.

ratter · 31-03-2011, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Given the contrary information provided in this thread by people who have first hand knowledge of the project, I am inclined to believe that this rumour is either a) based on old information or b) malicious.

Malicious - always a possibility and 1 reason I have not posted earlier as did not want to appear this way.

Old information - On the asics website this week and we have have done several quotes this week for possible customers that had cars booked in with another company that now longer can do their conversions.

Hopefully it will be sorted out.