Legal advice needed for re-birthed fpv tyhpoon

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 04:25 PM

Hi all, long time forum stalker, first time poster. As the topic States, im looking for a lawyer or someone that specialises/has had expierience in car re-birthing. I'm sure people will have lots of questions and it is a very long story so without going into too much detail, I got stung and bought a re-birthed car and it has been taken off me by the nswp. The person it was stolen from was paid out by the insurance policy so it's now owned by the Nrma. I have quite a bit of money in this car including a new engine and at the moment it's looking like I'll loose it all....hence the reason I'm after some solid legal advice.

Thanks for any help that anyone can give ! Once this is all sorted hopefully I'll have my car back and I'll have to properly introduce myself !

blackf6 · 28-09-2014, 04:26 PM

Go and talk to a lawyer buddy.

xxx000 · 28-09-2014, 04:30 PM

Not your car so you won't get it back

LG17 · 28-09-2014, 04:37 PM

The only way you have any chance of recompense is if you bought it through a licenced motor dealer.

Auslandau · 28-09-2014, 04:40 PM

Unfortunately ..... XXX is correct. It isn't your car. It stinks I know. Lots get caught up in these. Buy a stolen car unsuspecting but it does belong to someone else and most of the time it is the insurance company or original owner.

By all means though as it might be worth it, get it from the horses mouth for a solicitor. Any would do as it is something that wouldn't be a too specialised area.

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teak81

Go and talk to a lawyer buddy.

I definitely will be mate, unfortunately the few I have called sound like they have no idea and I had to explain what re-birthing was to one. That's why I was asking here in the hopes someone has dealt with this situation before or can recommend a lawyer.

NX74205 · 28-09-2014, 04:45 PM

As others have said, you will not get the car back, notwithstanding any money you may have spent on it. The car was never yours nor was it ever the seller's either.

You may have a cause of action against the seller to recover some money, but I doubt you'll get it all back. You'll need to speak to a lawyer about that.

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 04:46 PM

Yeah everyone I have talked to has told me the same, that the car will always go back to the original owner, in this case the insurance company, the only reason I haven't given up on it completely is because I have put an engine in it and want to atleast get that back. I purchased the car with a blown engine and put a new one in it, so if they want the car back I'd like my engine back and they can have a blown engine the same way I got it to begin with. That's what I'm hoping for anyway.

I've actually asked to talk to the insurance company and even negotiate a price with them instead of them sending it to auction which they will do anyway. atleast that way my money isn't completely wasted even if I have to spend some more

LoudPipes · 28-09-2014, 05:11 PM

My brother had his car registered and stolen in NSW.

Eleven years later it was recovered, this was about eight years ago.

Rego records showed it had been owned by three people since it was stolen.

After it was stolen it was registered by two owners in Queensland.

The Police took the car from the third owner who tried to register it in NSW and gave it to the insurance company who in turn asked my brother if he’d like to buy the car back.

He declined and the car was sent to auction.

I can’t see why the insurance company wouldn’t be willing to sell to you if you offered them a price similar to market value.

Though I doubt if the insurance company will allow you to remove or recoup any value you've put into their car.

ltd · 28-09-2014, 05:12 PM

Mate, as everyone has stated, the car was never yours or the sellers to begin with. I'd go after the seller, he should be charged with obtaining money by deception and being in possession of stolen goods. If you know who the seller is get all your paperwork from the sale and go down to the police station to file an incident report. This may also curry favour with the insurance company that you are the innocent party in this, and they might be more amenable to reaching an agreement with you for the sale of the stolen car.
Do you know who the seller is?
Was it a car yard or a private sale? If not was it done at the sellers home?

**tut0r** · 28-09-2014, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltd

Mate, as everyone has stated, the car was never yours or the sellers to begin with. I'd go after the seller, he should be charged with obtaining money by deception and being in possession of stolen goods. If you know who the seller is get all your paperwork from the sale and go down to the police station to file an incident report. This may also curry favour with the insurance company that you are the innocent party in this, and they might be more amenable to reaching an agreement with you for the sale of the stolen car.
Do you know who the seller is?
Was it a car yard or a private sale? If not was it done at the sellers home?

Agreed! Best course of action like you have done is contact NRMA and see if something can be worked out, also at this point I would be hunting down the guy who sold it to you to see if he was indeed innocent or the one who stole it and chasing him up for the money through court if you cannot get the car back from NRMA...

Either way file an incident report against the seller/car yard as you don't want this biting you in the ***, be as proactive as possible and keep searching for lawyers who actually know what you're talking about.

Goodluck mate, sorry to hear must be a really **** situation to be in.

BENT_8 · 28-09-2014, 05:23 PM

Talk to the insurance company.
Explain the engine change, did you get it re registered with the new engine number?
If so, and you have proof of purchase of the replacement engine then you may be able to negotiate a purchase price, using your ownership of the motor as bargaining strength, for the vehicle based on market value for a non drivable(blown motor etc.) example.
All the insurance company will want is as much as they can recover with the least amount of hassle.

LoudPipes · 28-09-2014, 05:41 PM

When it comes to their profits, insurance companies can be cold but will usually take any reasonable amount offered as they often do with write-offs.

If they paid out on a vehicle that was in good working order when it was stolen they possibly won’t care who damaged it or repaired it after the fact.

That’s not their problem.

They definitely would not want the auction value decreased by having the motor pulled so your best bet is to try and buy the vehicle off them otherwise I see you losing out on all counts.

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltd

Mate, as everyone has stated, the car was never yours or the sellers to begin with. I'd go after the seller, he should be charged with obtaining money by deception and being in possession of stolen goods. If you know who the seller is get all your paperwork from the sale and go down to the police station to file an incident report. This may also curry favour with the insurance company that you are the innocent party in this, and they might be more amenable to reaching an agreement with you for the sale of the stolen car.
Do you know who the seller is?
Was it a car yard or a private sale? If not was it done at the sellers home?

Thanks for the input, as soon as the car was taken off me i made a statement with the police and told them absolutely every bit of info i could, this was in january, the latest contact ive had with them is they belive it was the owner before me and they have a warrant out for him. I dont know him personally. Ive given the police all the recipts for all the work done and parts etc. Unfortunately it was a private sale and it wasnt done at his house

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Talk to the insurance company.
Explain the engine change, did you get it re registered with the new engine number?
If so, and you have proof of purchase of the replacement engine then you may be able to negotiate a purchase price, using your ownership of the motor as bargaining strength, for the vehicle based on market value for a non drivable(blown motor etc.) example.
All the insurance company will want is as much as they can recover with the least amount of hassle.

ive been asking the police to talk to the insurance comapny rep but they dont want to give me that info for some reason at the moment, ive made it clear to the police that i want to try and sort this out without court though so hopefully they dont stuff me around. When the new engine was put in i had a blue slip done and it was passed so yes the new engine was registered to the car. I do have receipts for it all aswell.

What youre saying is pretty much best case scenario for me at the moment, thats eaxcatly what im hoping will happen, what would be good is if i could find out how much a 2007 typhoon goes for at auction with a blown engine so i have an idea what i will have to pay the insurance company, unfortunately not many wreckers want to say how much they get thier cars for from the auctions.

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoudPipes

When it comes to their profits, insurance companies can be cold but will usually take any reasonable amount offered as they often do with write-offs.

If they paid out on a vehicle that was in good working order when it was stolen they possibly won’t care who damaged it or repaired it after the fact.

That’s not their problem.

They definitely would not want the auction value decreased by having the motor pulled so your best bet is to try and buy the vehicle off them otherwise I see you losing out on all counts.

this is the part the has me worried and thinking i may need a lawyer, they could turn around and just say get stuffed in regards to the engine, but surely i must have some right to it, again though im not sure, im really just hoping they want to sort it out quickly and pain free to re-coup some cash and that i dont get an ******* of an insurane rep that wants 30k for the wreck.

MNM96 · 28-09-2014, 06:53 PM

So, OP, who did you buy it from, did you get insurance, does your insurer cover you for a "stolen" car. REVS?

nstg8a · 28-09-2014, 07:05 PM

I would have thought if you have proof of purchase for the replacement motor then they would have to at least have that back? Otherwise aren't they basically stealing it off you?

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNM96

So, OP, who did you buy it from, did you get insurance, does your insurer cover you for a "stolen" car. REVS?

The car was purchased privately, I didn't have insurance on it but my understanding is that it wouldn't have mattered if I did anyway because it wasnt the vehicle it was said to be ? I didn't know that there are any insurance policy's that actually cover you for this sort of thing ? When I purchased the vehicle I was told that it wasn't a genuine typhoon and that it was just a replica. It had the complete typhoon driveline, bodykit and interior. The fact that is was a replica and had a dead engine meant it was going cheap another reason I thought It was a good deal, old saying of "if it's too good to be true, it is" comes to mind. I did 3 different revs checks and all came up clear saying it was a 2006 xt falcon which made sense because I was told from the start it was just a replica.

naddis01 · 28-09-2014, 07:13 PM

So the revs check came up clear (not stolen) prior to purchasing? If so, this is the angle I would be pursuing with your legal representative.

Stefan · 28-09-2014, 07:24 PM

How the hell did they find your car was re-birthed?

The numbers are obviously clear, belonging to a 06 XT?

Why don't the cops just pick up the seller? Didn't you get his details?

XR Martin · 28-09-2014, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

So the revs check came up clear (not stolen) prior to purchasing? If so, this is the angle I would be pursuing with your legal representative.

REVs check doesnt guarentee to tell you whether a car is listed as stolen or not, only if its encumbered (ie someone has a lien on it)

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 07:34 PM

yes mate, did 3 different checks on it and they all came back clear, unfortunately revs checks arent worth the paper they were printed on in my case, the chassis number than i checked i was fine, but the chassis number i checked wasnt the actual car....if that makes sense.

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

How the hell did they find your car was re-birthed?

The numbers are obviously clear, belonging to a 06 XT?

Why don't the cops just pick up the seller? Didn't you get his details?

when i went and had the blue and pink slip done it passed both, but im guessing the inspector must have picked something up and told the rta to inspect the vehicle because i had 4 of them on my doorstep that afternoon. As soon as they plugged the computer in under the dash it told them the true identity of the car.

yes thats right the numbers on the xt were clear thats why the rev checks didnt show anything either. The biggest mistake i made was that ive seen alot of written off/damaged cars re-shelled or turbo running gear put in non-turbos so it didnt sound sus to me. I shouldnt have touched it without receipts or pictures of the build.

All of the sellers details were passsed along to the police and its still being investigated atm, very long process unfortunately

danzvtil · 28-09-2014, 07:45 PM

You've done your dough im afraid....
NRMA wont give 2 hoots about money you have spent on it, at BEST, if the original owner doesn't want it back(or insurance have already paid out)you may be able to make an offer to buy the vehicle (again, for the second time) or
Start legal proceedings against the person you bought it from as a civil case, which of course wont lead to anything because they will have no assets, and the legal costs will far exceed the possible reward even IF you have a judgement in your favour.

nstg8a · 28-09-2014, 08:07 PM

If it's now running false or incorrect vin numbers can it ever be legally registered?

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 08:29 PM

I don't believe so

Vallidium · 28-09-2014, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danzvtil

You've done your dough im afraid....
NRMA wont give 2 hoots about money you have spent on it, at BEST, if the original owner doesn't want it back(or insurance have already paid out)you may be able to make an offer to buy the vehicle (again, for the second time) or
Start legal proceedings against the person you bought it from as a civil case, which of course wont lead to anything because they will have no assets, and the legal costs will far exceed the possible reward even IF you have a judgement in your favour.

Yeah I know the Nrma couksnt care less, they will just want as much money as possible back. But I'm pretty confident that legally the engine is mine. At the least I should be able to give it back to them in the condition that it came to me. So give them back a stuffed engine and take the parts back that I put on it obviously replacing them with the stabdard bits and pieces. This would still mean i loose the purchase price but atleast I get back what is rightfully mine. And yes your spot on about chasing up the guy I purcahsed it from, it wouldn't wven be worth the hassle of going to court to get back $1 a week till the piece of **** dies. Hopefully they just agree the engine is mine and we can work out a price out of auction.

**tut0r** · 28-09-2014, 08:44 PM

I think you must still have some entitlement to the engine regardless if NRMA 'doesn't give a ****'....

**Silver Ghia** · 28-09-2014, 08:46 PM

Do you still have the engine that was in it? Can you get it back if you haven't got it anymore?