Asking all the Mondeo Boffens

vztrt · 05-01-2008, 06:42 PM

Hey guys

Yesterday a friend and I went looking for a new small car for her (wants to upgrade her 05 ES Lancer). So we checked out every dealer in the area to see what she liked best. I suggested she take a look at the Mondeo (I actually wanted to see what they were like in the flesh myself). She saw the car and I know she is in love with it. So we went and spoke to the salesman and asked for the price on a manual. Problem is unless its the XR5T you cant buy a manual Mondeo.

So my question is will Australia be getting manuals in the lower spec Mondeo's before Oct this year (asked the salesman and he didn't no)?
If it isn't then the Mazda 6 will be replacing the Lancer.

And Auto is not an option, my friend (like me) hate auto's and only drive manual's.

Thanks

TheColonel · 05-01-2008, 07:04 PM

I doubt it will happen any time soon, since the range is still fresh and just launched and cars are only just starting to flow into the country.... what's wrong with getting the XR5?

vztrt · 06-01-2008, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheColonel

I doubt it will happen any time soon, since the range is still fresh and just launched and cars are only just starting to flow into the country.... what's wrong with getting the XR5?

About $10G's too much.

Turbodiesel · 06-01-2008, 10:57 AM

I doubt they would bring out manuals, since the the majority of the car's audience would be auto drivers.

Have you checked out a Jetta?

vztrt · 06-01-2008, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbodiesel

I doubt they would bring out manuals, since the the majority of the car's audience would be auto drivers.

Have you checked out a Jetta?

Told her to go to a VW dealership and have a look at some of the cars. But it seems she really wants the Mondeo.

waggaclint · 06-01-2008, 06:37 PM

if ya can wait until FEB the new mazda 6 is out then....well worth lookn at alot better than a mondeo.....the new mondeo is built on the old mazda6 platform.....there are some pics here.....http://yahoo.drive.com.au/Editorial/...eID=43300&vf=1

Ives · 06-01-2008, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waggaclint

the new mondeo is built on the old mazda6 platform.....

I'm pretty sure the upcoming Mazda6 is based on the same platform as the new Mondeo. And yes the Mazda6 would be a huge threat to the Mondeo. Ford should tweak the 2.3l Duratec to be more lively.

waggaclint · 06-01-2008, 06:44 PM

no the new mondeo is based on the old mazda6 the new 6 is a complete new car bigger engine 2.5l etc....there is a full review/road test etc in the latest wheels mag....

waggaclint · 06-01-2008, 06:48 PM

hear it is full road test hear they sound very good im lookn at getting a wagon.....http://wheelsmag.com.au/wheels/site/...2573C5001351E0 very nice best lookn new car 2008 i reakon....

Martyvan · 06-01-2008, 08:18 PM

This generation Mondeo is on a new platform.
New Mazda 6 is based on existing platform.
Next Generation M6 will be based on Current Mondeo platform, something about the new mondeo platform being the new basis for that class of car, through the FoMoCo empire...?
This has been discussed at length in other threads.....

As for the original question, the Mondeo may be available in a manual at some stage, potentially before October, but this will be an unknown until later in the year when sales have settled after the initial flood of orders and trickle of deliveries, probably about the same time they bring in the wagon (If it ever comes!)

Cheers
Martin

waggaclint · 06-01-2008, 08:53 PM

this from the article in the lastest wheels mag...

The new platform and body (which, Mazda emphatically insists, has absolutely no connection to the Ford Mondeo) uses more high- and ultra-high tensile steel than the previous unit for a tauter, tougher structure, and the front sub-frame now attaches through six (not four) bushings.

If ya read the whole article i think you will find they are a completly different car.....

TheColonel · 06-01-2008, 09:03 PM

Clint, you believe Wheels Mag??? Shame on you...

kiwijohn42 · 06-01-2008, 10:32 PM

A Mondeo is a small car? Felt pretty big to me, but compared to a Fiesta, anything would.

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 01:27 AM

Cool thanks guys. I hope the instrument cluster in the new Mazda 6 isn't like the Mazda three as that was an awful design and put my friend of getting one (was thinking about sp23 until she saw the dash).

Martyvan · 07-01-2008, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Cool thanks guys. I hope the instrument cluster in the new Mazda 6 isn't like the Mazda three as that was an awful design and put my friend of getting one (was thinking about sp23 until she saw the dash).

One thing i dont like about the 6 is the current red features. Too bold is the colour, blue or green is what my preference would be, cant say i have checked out an SP though....

Quote:

Originally Posted by waggaclint

If ya read the whole article i think you will find they are a completly different car.....

If you read what i wrote thoroughly it is a completely different car. The next Gen M6 will be based on the mondeo platform, which is probably 4 years away from even seeing prototypes. The current Mondeo and the new 6 are built on different platforms.....

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martyvan

One thing i dont like about the 6 is the current red features. Too bold is the colour, blue or green is what my preference would be, cant say i have checked out an SP though....

Didn't have an issue with the colours, but the surrounds on the cluster that stick out a mile really made it a pain to see the numbers (in the day). But I love the response by the salesman where he said that it would light up at night...problem is the car would be driven in the day most of the time. But the pic below makes it seem that the new 6 might be the same.

Bossxr8 · 07-01-2008, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waggaclint

if ya can wait until FEB the new mazda 6 is out then....well worth lookn at alot better than a mondeo.....the new mondeo is built on the old mazda6 platform.....there are some pics here.....http://yahoo.drive.com.au/Editorial/...eID=43300&vf=1

Alot better than a Mondeo, what are you basing that on, an assumption. The Mondeo is a match for any competitor in the medium size class.

Swordsman88 · 07-01-2008, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Alot better than a Mondeo, what are you basing that on, an assumption. The Mondeo is a match for any competitor in the medium size class.

Couldn't agree more Bossxr8. Don't get me wrong i am a huge fan of the mazda 6 and i have also read the wheels review and many other stories and am sure it will be a great car, and a very serious threat to mondeo. But alot better, not likely.

Obviously availability of a manual, less weight and of course a torquier 2.5 litre version of the Ford/Mazda 2.3 (which, despite ho hum figures on paper compared to some competitors is a gem of an engine used in many FoMoCo vehicles around the world) means it will most probably be a better car in base petrol form at least. Certainly faster and burn less fuel. Of course handling will be right up there with mondeo too. I would say those two cars will dominate medium car reviews for a while yet.

Also, it should be noted the likely lack of a MPS version for a while yet, combined with no diesel until late this year, and then only in manual as well mean mondeo has distinct advantages in this area also, combined with fords quite sharp value for money. I have to go against the trend also and say i don't much like the new 6s styling - its not ugly at all, just doesn't impress me very much, particularly the rear end. Very japanese (as was stated by its designer - saying mazda should return to styling cars from its japanese roots) wheres mondeo is of course very european.

Finally, mazda continual statements that is shares nothing mondeo is marketing speak to keep themselves 'above' the poor ford brand. I love mazda and am happy they are a ford company, but all this well deserved succes is making them think the tail can wag the dog. The next new 6, as noted, will be based on EUCD platform, like mondeo (and many other ford cars, e.g. volvos etc.), whether the like it or not. This new 6 is on a heavilly updated version of CD3, but both EUCD and CD3 are based on the original CD platform from a decade or more ago, so are similar generally. Obviously with different sized engines, gear boxes and a wishbone front end versus mondeos struts, sure they are quite different. But that is like BA falcon versus Territory, different floorpans and bodies obviously, different front suspension etc. but same platform. Oh and all four of the cars in my example use control blade IRS, to prove my point! Either way, good times ahead for medium car buyers methinks! (oh, and death to camry, had to put that in!)

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

Also, it should be noted the likely lack of a MPS version for a while yet, combined with no diesel until late this year, and then only in manual as well mean mondeo has distinct advantages in this area also,

Well if this is the case, if the Mondeo doesn't have a manual by then it looks as if Ford will lose another sale.

Swordsman88 · 07-01-2008, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Well if this is the case, if the Mondeo doesn't have a manual by then it looks as if Ford will lose another sale.

This is also true. A lack of manual in base petrol and diesel mondeo obviously will lose ford some sales. Ford knew this and factored it in. Remember mondeo has been going well in europe so production limits what ford can get their hands on (anyone trying to get a new mondeo in australia will confirm waiting lists are in force). For example, the 2.3 with auto is a comparitively rare order in europe (reps use 1.8-2.0 litre manuals - and australians say the 2.3 is too slow!) where due to tax reasons a 2.3 is seen as big!!!

Same goes for diesel, where manuals are popular in europe (hence lack of auto in mazda 6 diesel). XR5 is also a very rare version in europe. Ford also knows most australians actually go for auto these days - part of the reason diesels aren't more popular has been the lack of auto/dsg versions until recently. My gut feeling, which could be completely wrong, is that ford will get just as many extra sales of a mondeo diesel because it has auto, as they lose for not having a manual base model. There have already been a few people on ford forums who have gone for the diesel/zetec instead of an XR5T partially because that car only comes in manual! Seems you can't win!

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

This is also true. A lack of manual in base petrol and diesel mondeo obviously will lose ford some sales. Ford knew this and factored it in. Remember mondeo has been going well in europe so production limits what ford can get their hands on (anyone trying to get a new mondeo in australia will confirm waiting lists are in force). For example, the 2.3 with auto is a comparitively rare order in europe (reps use 1.8-2.0 litre manuals - and australians say the 2.3 is too slow!) where due to tax reasons a 2.3 is seen as big!!!

Same goes for diesel, where manuals are popular in europe (hence lack of auto in mazda 6 diesel). XR5 is also a very rare version in europe. Ford also knows most australians actually go for auto these days - part of the reason diesels aren't more popular has been the lack of auto/dsg versions until recently. My gut feeling, which could be completely wrong, is that ford will get just as many extra sales of a mondeo diesel because it has auto, as they lose for not having a manual base model. There have already been a few people on ford forums who have gone for the diesel/zetec instead of an XR5T partially because that car only comes in manual! Seems you can't win!

Even if you could option it and have to wait 3 months for delivery would be fine (as the Lancer has been a good car for her, low maintainence, and less the 50,000k on the clock), she can wait that long to get it. The issue she has is that you cant buy a manual. But something like the VW Jetta you can (were gonna go have a look at one on Sat).

Swordsman88 · 07-01-2008, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Even if you could option it and have to wait 3 months for delivery would be fine (as the Lancer has been a good car for her, low maintainence, and less the 50,000k on the clock), she can wait that long to get it. The issue she has is that you cant buy a manual. But something like the VW Jetta you can (were gonna go have a look at one on Sat).

Yeah its a real pain when this happens. A mate of mine got really annoyed because ford didn't bring an XR5 focus here with alot of the options he wanted that are on the euro spec cars. In the end it looks like he will buy it anyway and just do mods afterwoods (lack of cruise control really got on his nerves, and i would agree given speeding nazis around these days!).

The jetta is a good car and not bad value considering VW build their cars really well. Major problem would be it is a fair bit smaller than a mondeo/new mazda 6 - is she after diesel or petrol, and also what size? I mean if you want a car that is bigger than a lancer than i wouldn't think a jetta is much bigger at all is it? Also, depends on budget i suppose, after all, if you don't mind a wait a mondeo XR5T would have to be tempting in this case would it not?

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

Yeah its a real pain when this happens. A mate of mine got really annoyed because ford didn't bring an XR5 focus here with alot of the options he wanted that are on the euro spec cars. In the end it looks like he will buy it anyway and just do mods afterwoods (lack of cruise control really got on his nerves, and i would agree given speeding nazis around these days!).

The jetta is a good car and not bad value considering VW build their cars really well. Major problem would be it is a fair bit smaller than a mondeo/new mazda 6 - is she after diesel or petrol, and also what size? I mean if you want a car that is bigger than a lancer than i wouldn't think a jetta is much bigger at all is it? Also, depends on budget i suppose, after all, if you don't mind a wait a mondeo XR5T would have to be tempting in this case would it not?

She's happy with the size of the lancer (short girl so it's not gonna bother her), the only things that she defenetly wants is that it looks good (to her), is a manual, has a boot (she was in an accident with a hatch and doesn't trust them). She could have ordered an XR5T on Friday but $48k drive away is a bit high for a mid sized Ford. She was happy with the look of the base model (would just option a sunroof and driving lights) but due to fact that you couldn't buy it in a manual stopped her from buying it that day.

Swordsman88 · 07-01-2008, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

She's happy with the size of the lancer (short girl so it's not gonna bother her), the only things that she defenetly wants is that it looks good (to her), is a manual, has a boot (she was in an accident with a hatch and doesn't trust them). She could have ordered an XR5T on Friday but $48k drive away is a bit high for a mid sized Ford. She was happy with the look of the base model (would just option a sunroof and driving lights) but due to fact that you couldn't buy it in a manual stopped her from buying it that day.

48k for a mondeo XR5T does sound a bit steep. Were there any options on that, i would have thought with on roads about 45-46k? Looks like will just have to move on then, damn shame but happens all the time and as long as people have a legitmate reason (and no manual is a good one!) i completely agree that a good car sometimes just isn't right for a given person.

Might be worth showing her some photos of new mazda 6 to see if she like the look of it, if she does then a manual mazda 6 sounds like a good bet to me (apparently will be available in base and mid spec model as a manual sedan). Don't know pricing/spec level as yet but should be competitive. Of course, could be a manual lower spec mondeos coming some time this year (wouldn't surprise me if a wagon came along as well) but one would think it would be close to the october deadline if they did (that is one year after initial launch, the earliest ford is likely to change/add any new models).

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

48k for a mondeo XR5T does sound a bit steep. Were there any options on that, i would have thought with on roads about 45-46k? Looks like will just have to move on then, damn shame but happens all the time and as long as people have a legitmate reason (and no manual is a good one!) i completely agree that a good car sometimes just isn't right for a given person.

Might be worth showing her some photos of new mazda 6 to see if she like the look of it, if she does then a manual mazda 6 sounds like a good bet to me (apparently will be available in base and mid spec model as a manual sedan). Don't know pricing/spec level as yet but should be competitive. Of course, could be a manual lower spec mondeos coming some time this year (wouldn't surprise me if a wagon came along as well) but one would think it would be close to the october deadline if they did (that is one year after initial launch, the earliest ford is likely to change/add any new models).

The price was with a sunroof.
I've sent her the link earlier in the thread in regards to the mazda 6, so she can have a look at that. Funny enough it all seemed like she was gonna go pick up the new lancer VR but the huge butt and the nose that stuck out put her off. The Mondeo was never on her mind till she saw it, almost contemplated an auto, but talking to the salesman at Ford (who was a fellow manual driver) knew that she wouldn't be happy with the Auto. But like stated earlier Ford has until october to get a manual out here.
The kicker is if the new Falcon comes out looking as good as the Mondeo, then she might even get one of them (if there still isn't a manual Mondeo). She's driven mine a few times and the only problem I could see is that the car might be a tad big for her.

Swordsman88 · 07-01-2008, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

The price was with a sunroof.
I've sent her the link earlier in the thread in regards to the mazda 6, so she can have a look at that. Funny enough it all seemed like she was gonna go pick up the new lancer VR but the huge butt and the nose that stuck out put her off. The Mondeo was never on her mind till she saw it, almost contemplated an auto, but talking to the salesman at Ford (who was a fellow manual driver) knew that she wouldn't be happy with the Auto. But like stated earlier Ford has until october to get a manual out here.
The kicker is if the new Falcon comes out looking as good as the Mondeo, then she might even get one of them (if there still isn't a manual Mondeo). She's driven mine a few times and the only problem I could see is that the car might be a tad big for her.

Gee, and i thought the new lancer looked hot! Obviously everyone has their own preferences. Plenty of info over in the orion hub about new falcon, including lots of revealing shots of the car in spy/leaked photos, certainly is inspired by mondeo styling but not exactly the same. Not sure whether the new falcon will even offer a manual lower spec models, might only be sports variants, which might also confuse matters. Sorry to say but i do feel for you loyal manual guys - outside of sports models (and even some of those) the manual is slowly but surely dieing - DSG boxes might be the only future for manuals at all!

I am a fan of modern autos, the ZF in a falcon makes as good a case as possible for an auto, and the mondeos is almost as good. Still, when i do drive a manual it always reminds me of the many benefits (lower fuel burn, more control etc.). Fords tiptronic autos are quite good these days, so might almost be worth going for a test drive of a mondeo diesel or something - it might be good enough to overpower the lack of a true manual.

vztrt · 07-01-2008, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

Gee, and i thought the new lancer looked hot! Obviously everyone has their own preferences. Plenty of info over in the orion hub about new falcon, including lots of revealing shots of the car in spy/leaked photos, certainly is inspired by mondeo styling but not exactly the same. Not sure whether the new falcon will even offer a manual lower spec models, might only be sports variants, which might also confuse matters. Sorry to say but i do feel for you loyal manual guys - outside of sports models (and even some of those) the manual is slowly but surely dieing - DSG boxes might be the only future for manuals at all!

I am a fan of modern autos, the ZF in a falcon makes as good a case as possible for an auto, and the mondeos is almost as good. Still, when i do drive a manual it always reminds me of the many benefits (lower fuel burn, more control etc.). Fords tiptronic autos are quite good these days, so might almost be worth going for a test drive of a mondeo diesel or something - it might be good enough to overpower the lack of a true manual.

I know enough about the new Falcon (you to work there just before the first mules came out), unfortunatly I only saw CGI's of it and never the real thing.

I've driven a few of the ZF's and in two days I was over it and wanted my clunky manual back.

Swordsman88 · 08-01-2008, 01:47 AM

[QUOTE=vztrt]I know enough about the new Falcon (you to work there just before the first mules came out), unfortunatly I only saw CGI's of it and never the real thing.

I've driven a few of the ZF's and in two days I was over it and wanted my clunky manual back.[/QUOTE

Clunky manual hey? Well the ZF definitely won't suit then!

At least can always wait for most of the year to have a looksee at what has come out over the next ten months or so. Here's hoping the new falcon can show some of the class the mondeo clearly has!

Bossxr8 · 08-01-2008, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

The price was with a sunroof.
I've sent her the link earlier in the thread in regards to the mazda 6, so she can have a look at that. Funny enough it all seemed like she was gonna go pick up the new lancer VR but the huge butt and the nose that stuck out put her off. The Mondeo was never on her mind till she saw it, almost contemplated an auto, but talking to the salesman at Ford (who was a fellow manual driver) knew that she wouldn't be happy with the Auto. But like stated earlier Ford has until october to get a manual out here.
The kicker is if the new Falcon comes out looking as good as the Mondeo, then she might even get one of them (if there still isn't a manual Mondeo). She's driven mine a few times and the only problem I could see is that the car might be a tad big for her.

The Mondeo is just about the same size as a Falcon, even slightly bigger in some areas.

I agree with her assesment of the Lancer, some people like the styling but I hate the shovel nose on it.

vztrt · 08-01-2008, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

The Mondeo is just about the same size as a Falcon, even slightly bigger in some areas.

Fair enough, I thought it was big for a mid size but always thought the Falcon was bigger.

You seem to have more contacts at Ford (unfortunatly my marketing contact is no longer there), do you have any idea if a Manual will be available for the Mondeo?