Design Focus - Sedans

[DFB FGXR6]

This is a subject that I have been thinking about for a while. With car companies focused on the demand for SUV’s, sales of sedans have plummeted over the last decade. With that, manufacturers that have continued to make sedans have tried to style them to grab the attention of the buyers and perhaps distract them from the pumped-up SUV on the other side of the showroom.

Some car companies have been successful to a degree at injecting style into an otherwise boring vehicle. Mercedes Benz hit the bullseye on the original CLS but in an attempt to keep it fresh, they over-designed it. And its the over designing of cars, and sedans in this case, that bugs me. Some cars have so many body lines and creases that they look like they have been in a fender bender.

Take the new Hyundai i30 sedan for example. Ok, so it looks new and different. But good looking? Hell no! The designers didn’t know when to stop!



So, are there any new sedans on the market that have been styled with restraint, good proportions and a lack of styling gimmicks? The Jaguar XE and XF come to mind, as does the current BMW 3 Series. Considering their front drive platform, the Volvo S60 and S90 are very well considered designs too.











These three sedans are my favorites of mine -

The E39 BMW 5 Series was a THE benchmark sedan of it’s time, the BA Falcon and VE Commodore both took inspiration from it in both design and engineering.



The VE Commodore. From a design perspective, the VE Commodore was almost spot on. The overhangs, proportions and glasshouse depth were perfect and every model in the range had a tough, solid look to it. I never want to own one but there is no denying Holden nailed it with the VE, in fact the subsequent VE Series 2 and VF only meddled with the design.



And my all-time favorite sedan design is the 2008 – 2016 Jaguar XF, the 2011 face-lift in particular. I believe this car looked better than the XE and second-gen XF. The proportions, the gorgeous long power dome bonnet, the short overhangs, the sloped roof line, and the shallow glasshouse edged in a thick chrome trim all earn it my admiration. I would love one of these in XF-R guise.





So, what are your sedan design favorites?

[fiestaz]

Design is personal taste. Many think the new Sonata looks fantastic, same with the i30. I’m on the fence until I see a real one.

Every sedan you have listed otherwise looks great in my eyes. I have a special spot for those Jags.
I would add the Mazda6 sedan to the list of great lookers.

[Franco Cozzo]

I like simple with some muscular flair, my example of great sedan design is the Chrysler 300 SRT:





Clean lines and without too many curves, high waistline with small glass on the sides.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Mercedes Benz hit the bullseye on the original CLS but in an attempt to keep it fresh, they over-designed it.

See, I disagree. I think the original CLS was among one of the ugliest cars Mercedes-Benz has ever produced. None of the proportions worked, in my opinion. Audi and BMW both do four-door coupes far better than Mercedes-Benz.

That is, until the current generation CLS, which is a looker, especially on the inside.

As for my personal favourites - I'm somewhat biased, but I'm still partial to the recently departed MD Mondeo hatch. To me, that's still a great looking car and still the best looking car in the segment.

Aside from that, I'll have to give it some thought. Despite the fact that the new i30 sedan is ugly, there are still plenty of good lookers in the segment.

[CyberWasp]

I know absolutely nothing about European Cars so can't comment on them.

But I will take the SRT from Franko and raise it to a Dodge Charger SRT which is the same body shell with subtle differences.





It was said many years ago that the Charger could be sold here with the 300's interior. Why they never did it we will never know. The name plate still has a following even thou it is a different context.

[smoo]

I think you’d struggle to find a better looking car out of the 1990’s than those E39s. Maybe an E38 with the M package.



I passed up the opportunity to buy a facelift E39 540i Sport the same as your pic above and picked up this instead. E34 535iS manual with the M treatment. Poor mans M5. As with the E39 I think the E34 is the best looking car to come out of the 1980s.

[mad2]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I like simple with some muscular flair, my example of great sedan design is the Chrysler 300 SRT:

image

image

Clean lines and without too many curves, high waistline with small glass on the sides.

my 'tastes' must have changed ..... somewhere?? i did love the look etc of the 300's ... now it's looks good but not my style.

Originally Posted by CyberWasp

I know absolutely nothing about European Cars so can't comment on them.

But I will take the SRT from Franko and raise it to a Dodge Charger SRT which is the same body shell with subtle differences.





It was said many years ago that the Charger could be sold here with the 300's interior. Why they never did it we will never know. The name plate still has a following even thou it is a different context.

or this one - https://www.dodge.com/charger/srt.html

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by CyberWasp

I know absolutely nothing about European Cars so can't comment on them.

But I will take the SRT from Franko and raise it to a Dodge Charger SRT which is the same body shell with subtle differences.

image

image

It was said many years ago that the Charger could be sold here with the 300's interior. Why they never did it we will never know. The name plate still has a following even thou it is a different context.

Yep these things are epic too, you'd think this would have been a shoe-in for our market but it seems not.

Such an epic looking car.

I like my hot hatches with 3 doors, larger cars as sedans with 4 doors and my utes American

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by smoo

I think you’d struggle to find a better looking car out of the 1990’s than those E39s. Maybe an E38 with the M package.

image

I passed up the opportunity to buy a facelift E39 540i Sport the same as your pic above and picked up this instead. E34 535iS manual with the M treatment. Poor mans M5. As with the E39 I think the E34 is the best looking car to come out of the 1980s.

image

I love the E38 as well, I used to have an E38 735iL Highline, nice car, It was too slow though, it was what the Lebonator replaced.

I'm sure the 750iL would have been a bit peppier

[FTE217]

EClass, E63 velvet sledgehammer
Latest Audi A5 Quattro - balance
Current M8 and these
https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/det...6638752/?Cr=98
2012 Maserati Quattroporto GTS Sport - very cool
Porsche Panamera GTS
Check out this 4door
https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/det...9194105/?Cr=64

[smoo]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I love the E38 as well, I used to have an E38 735iL Highline, nice car, It was too slow though, it was what the Lebonator replaced.

I'm sure the 750iL would have been a bit peppier

Oh yeah, didn’t a failed timing chain claim the life of yours?
While I used the M spec as an example I think the base models are spot on. Everything in proportion, everything flows. No awkward contrasting lines or shapes.



I don’t think any car has aged as well as the E60 M5. Huge road presence. They came out in 2003 but wouldn’t look out of place as a 2013 model. Stood the test of time better than 5 year old awkwardly styled Korean and Jap stuff. How’s that Hyundai **** box in the OP going to look in three years time. Cadogan will rate it.





Alfa 159 is a good looker with the right OEM wheels. Front overhang is a bit excessive but not a deal breaker imo.

[Polyal]

So many good example, for the modern stuff and what is available in Australia.

GOOD

Alfa Romeo
Peugeot
BMW (although gone a bit down hill IMO)
Volvo
Jaguar (but boring)


NOT-SO-GOOD

Mercedes (RIP, to curvy and bland)
Hyundai (Same, honestly put Merc badges on it and it would be hard to tell)

Audi is in the middle, which seems to be their brand ethos.

Notable mention to the VF/VF2 SS, I wish Ford made the equivalent.

The E39 BMW M5 though, my god, the best ever, nothing will beat that for all round package. You can keep your V10 and poofy automatic.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by smoo

Oh yeah, didn’t a failed timing chain claim the life of yours?
While I used the M spec as an example I think the base models are spot on. Everything in proportion, everything flows. No awkward contrasting lines or shapes.

image

I don’t think any car has aged as well as the E60 M5. Huge road presence. They came out in 2003 but wouldn’t look out of place as a 2013 model. Stood the test of time better than 5 year old awkwardly styled Korean and Jap stuff. How’s that Hyundai **** box in the OP going to look in three years time. Cadogan will rate it.

image

image

Alfa 159 is a good looker with the right OEM wheels. Front overhang is a bit excessive but not a deal breaker imo.

image

Timing chain was noisy on start up initially for a few seconds then it quitened up, I think it was the plastic guides.

Something I didn't like was how that M62 V8 made its power, it had no torque down low, you had to really get stuck into it to get it to move acceptably, mine was only the 3.5L variation though.

Relied too much on gearing and stuff like variable valve timing to mask it's circa 2000kg weight and small capacity, I feel the M73 variation would move it better without relying on fancy tricks.

Maybe a 745iL would have been significantly better with the bigger capacity of 4.4L

The rest of the car was really nice though.

[XRtowcar]

Obviously only one photo needed.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by smoo

Oh yeah, didn’t a failed timing chain claim the life of yours?
While I used the M spec as an example I think the base models are spot on. Everything in proportion, everything flows. No awkward contrasting lines or shapes.

image

I don’t think any car has aged as well as the E60 M5. Huge road presence. They came out in 2003 but wouldn’t look out of place as a 2013 model. Stood the test of time better than 5 year old awkwardly styled Korean and Jap stuff. How’s that Hyundai **** box in the OP going to look in three years time. Cadogan will rate it.

image

image

Alfa 159 is a good looker with the right OEM wheels. Front overhang is a bit excessive but not a deal breaker imo.

image

The E60 5 Series is an interesting one.

It was hated by most when new. But as you say, it has aged very well. In fact the following two generations of 5 Series appear bland in comparison. Does this sound familiar? Cough! AU Falcon. Cough!

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

The E60 5 Series is an interesting one.

It was hated by most when new. But as you say, it has aged very well. In fact the following two generations of 5 Series appear bland in comparison. Does this sound familiar? Cough! AU Falcon. Cough!

There are some "cheap" E60 M5's getting around, but the potential repair bill on that V10 is a worry. I guess you could always LS it when it popped.

[Bossxr8]

I like the look of the Porsche Taycan.




And the Alfa Guilia is gorgeous too.

[FTE217]

yes agreed both very very nice.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by Polyal

There are some "cheap" E60 M5's getting around, but the potential repair bill on that V10 is a worry. I guess you could always LS it when it popped.

You need to replace the word potential with inevitable.

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

The E60 5 Series is an interesting one.

It was hated by most when new. But as you say, it has aged very well. In fact the following two generations of 5 Series appear bland in comparison. Does this sound familiar? Cough! AU Falcon. Cough!

Base model E60s look a bit crook but have probably stood the test of time better than E class, A6 and Falcon/Commodore etc. M Spec have aged well, but miss out on the flared wheel arches, bumpers and 19" wheels of the M5 which makes it stand out, imo.

[DFB FGXR6]

Opinions on the new Genesis G80?





That grill looks far too chintzy and vulgar for me. The whole car looks like one of the cheap Chinese copies.

[Franco Cozzo]

I quite like it, except the rear of the car has too much AU Falcon going on with that oval it has going

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Opinions on the new Genesis G80?

image

image

That grill looks far too chintzy and vulgar for me. The whole car looks like one of the cheap Chinese copies.

I don't mind the new stuff Genesis has released.

On the waiting list to test drive the GV80. ONLY thing I don't like about it is the side glass for the 3rd row - that upward triangle theme is used in most of what Hyundai has to offer - especially when they are trying to distance themselves from their parent company.

They should have boxed it out and made it bigger like the other premium SUV brands.

As for sedans - some look really good while others get it really wrong.

I really like the Kia Optima - it has nice proportions but then you look at the Hyundai i45 and it just looks all wrong.

I really don't like the squat down nose and bum up in the air boot lid look.

The Toyota Echo had that, looked out of proportion.

I liked the big bulky look of the older Lexus sedans like the LS430

From some angles the quite unknown Kia Magentis looks like a slightly smaller Lexus LS430 - perhaps that's one of the reason why I liked the look of that sedan as well.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Opinions on the new Genesis G80?

image

image

That grill looks far too chintzy and vulgar for me. The whole car looks like one of the cheap Chinese copies.

God awful. They have tried way too hard to make a statement, but that statement is "everybody look over here, and see how hiddeous I am".

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I quite like it, except the rear of the car has too much AU Falcon going on with that oval it has going

How people see things differently....
No where near like an AU unless your joshing all I see is more like a Audi A7 Sportback, look one up
https://www.google.com/search?q=audi...nt=firefox-b-d

From the back 3/4 shot looks ok imo, that front is way overdine grill wise, they copied Audi from back why not copy it more at front as well then it would look alot better.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by FTE217

How people see things differently....
No where near like an AU unless your joshing all I see is more like a Audi A7 Sportback, look one up
https://www.google.com/search?q=audi...nt=firefox-b-d

From the back 3/4 shot looks ok imo, that front is way overdine grill wise, they copied Audi from back why not copy it more at front as well then it would look alot better.

Yeah, it's a dead ringer for the A7 Sportback for sure.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by FTE217

How people see things differently....
No where near like an AU unless your joshing all I see is more like a Audi A7 Sportback, look one up
https://www.google.com/search?q=audi...nt=firefox-b-d

From the back 3/4 shot looks ok imo, that front is way overdine grill wise, they copied Audi from back why not copy it more at front as well then it would look alot better.

Oval shape on the rear of the car:





They both end with that oval shape where the tail lights and boot/bumper meet, look at the shape the spoiler and the top of the rear bumper form on the G80.

[M&Ms]

I traded in my XR8 for what I think is the best looking sedan out there. Even when I had my mind made up, the dealer tried to convince me to buy the Stelvio (SUV version) that he had sitting in the showroom instead!

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Oval shape on the rear of the car:

image

image

They both end with that oval shape where the tail lights and boot/bumper meet, look at the shape the spoiler and the top of the rear bumper form on the G80.

Maybe if you squint, after having sand rubbed in your eyes. While looking directly into the sun.

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Maybe if you squint, after having sand rubbed in your eyes. While looking directly into the sun.

yer nah Franco, you have a vivid mind, round/curves vs straight square lines with slight curve and hips more robust but no worries.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by FTE217

yer nah Franco, you have a vivid mind, round/curves vs straight square lines with slight curve and hips more robust but no worries.

There's a plainly obvious oval going on there on both cars, right on the back of them both