09/10 Summer of Cricket

prydey · 27-11-2009, 04:08 PM

west indies are first up for 3 tests, 5 ODI's and a couple of T20's. i'm never sure with this current west indies squad whether they come for a good time and just play some cricket while they are here or if they do actually give 100% to their cricket. i'm a big fan of gayle though.

this is the trend setter last time he was here

1st test aussies seem well on top. its tea on day 2 - aus 8/480dec. WI 41/0 after 6 overs.

given their form against qld in the tour game, i'm not sure australia will need to bat again but i'm hoping we do and that WI put up some sort of a contest.

now for some debate over the selections.
i'm still not convinced watson is the right man to have at the top of the order. p.hughes is still young so i'm not fussed that he's not there but what happened to p.jaques? the guy should be out there for mine. the rest of the line up is pretty straight forward although s.clark might have replaced hilfy in my line up. i'm also a big fan of binga and as soon as he's fit, i'd like to see him back in there.

troy cooley needs to work on johnsons action. seam position is critical for a fast bowler and i'm yet to see him throw one down with anything less than scrambled seam. he tends to fall over in his action a lot as well. his pace is good but his release could be a lot higher if he stood up more and he would be a lot more consistant if he got his wrist/release sorted. not that i'm an expert. just an armchair, keyboard weilding critic

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g220ba · 27-11-2009, 04:37 PM

p.jaques took along time to get over a persistent back injury. i agree watson should not be opening as there better options but if they move him down the order someone has to make way for another opener.

Most will say mike hussey should make way but he appears to be coming good and making runs but if he fails this summer i feel it'll be all over for him.

g220ba · 27-11-2009, 05:04 PM

At 4/63 and australia on fire at the moment this could be very quick test.

prydey · 27-11-2009, 05:04 PM

aussies have had some sort of obsession with allrounders ever since freddie had a stellar series in 05. the selectors have been pro watson for some time, standing by him through a lot of injury. at the moment we have watson, north and to an extent johnson who fit the allrounder mould. if they play hauritz or a full time spinner, i think north can make way for watson although its tough as north is showing he's a great batsman.

unfortunately for hussey i feel you are correct 84ltd. even though his form of late, particularly in the short form of the game has improved a lot, the media will be on him as soon as he has a failure.

bring back australia A i say. there's easily enough talent out there and good enough to beat most international sides too.

back to the game at hand, WI are struggling - 4/63 and both referrals wasted on plum lbw's.

g220ba · 27-11-2009, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

back to the game at hand, WI are struggling - 4/63 and both referrals wasted on plum lbw's.

didn't really think about those referals did they. Although chanderpaul did have good reason to think he edged as he did hit his rear pad but nonetheless wasted referals.

prydey · 28-11-2009, 05:17 PM

this series is starting as expected. 1st test will likely be over before stumps on day 3.

i must say also i'm not a fan of the use of hawkeye in the referral system. i don't mind hot spot and to an extent 'snicko' (although that can pick up any noise and make it appear like an edge - a creak in the bat for example) but hawkeye is made up by a lot of assumptions regarding the ball's flight path. if they want to use it, the benefit has to go to the batsman surely. latest referral say hawkeye just nicking the outside edge of leg stump. how can that be given out?? i thought they said in the interview at lunch on day 1 that they were using the centre of the ball, not the edges, to determine if it was going to hit. controversy - here we come. not much will get said this series unfortunatel because its only west indies.

gtxb67 · 28-11-2009, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

i must say also i'm not a fan of the use of hawkeye . . . because its only west indies.

in the incident i believe you are referrering to, the umpire at the bowling crease made the decision. the third umpire was referred but because it was so close, it came back to the officiating umpire. he believed it was out and gave it that way - however, if the third umpire thinks it is too close to call and stays neutral, i guess it tells the officiating umpire that hawkeye says it probably would have hit the stumps and makes his decision more likely to go with the bowling team

i do feel that if it is too close to call, then no challenges should be wasted. from what i saw, it happened to the west indies on the first day. hawkeye had it just hitting the stumps and when referred back to the officiating umpire, the australian was given not out. i thought the west indies lost that challenge which seems a bit unfair. it should have to be in or out for a challenge to be used

i personally do like the idea of hawkeye, because the australians have received a lot of good decisions (and some very bad ones that lost us test series) and at least with a challenge system, it should shut the people up who constantly complain that we have been too lucky. we have been lucky at times, but the way we play not only creates more opportunities but also gives a much better chance of getting the close ones. at least hawkeye can take away the blatantly wrong decisions now. we may even see less ridiculous appealing form other sides, because if given out when not - the batsman can challenge and stay in - so hopefully it eliminates that need

prydey · 28-11-2009, 06:20 PM

the problem i have with hawkeye is its accuracy, particularly with spin bowling. all i'm saying is, if hawkeye says it is hitting the outside edge of the off or leg stump or just clipping the top of the bail, the benefit should go to the batsman. it shouldn't matter that the onfield umpire gave it out. if it gets reffered, the onfield decision becomes irrelevent and should be then given into the hands of the 3rd umpire.

the incident i was referring to originally, to the naked eye and even in replay looked very leg side. not many umpires would've raised the finger. this gould chap seems quite happy to put the finger up where many others don't. the commentators actually praised him for this 'an umpire prepared to give lbw decisions'. as long as he's consistant i guess.

hopefully the WI can rebound a little in adelaide and hopefully sarwan and taylor are fully fit. where's fidel edwards, or is he a ODI player only?

**kypez** · 30-11-2009, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

the problem i have with hawkeye is its accuracy, particularly with spin bowling. all i'm saying is, if hawkeye says it is hitting the outside edge of the off or leg stump or just clipping the top of the bail, the benefit should go to the batsman. it shouldn't matter that the onfield umpire gave it out. if it gets reffered, the onfield decision becomes irrelevent and should be then given into the hands of the 3rd umpire.

the incident i was referring to originally, to the naked eye and even in replay looked very leg side. not many umpires would've raised the finger. this gould chap seems quite happy to put the finger up where many others don't. the commentators actually praised him for this 'an umpire prepared to give lbw decisions'. as long as he's consistant i guess.

hopefully the WI can rebound a little in adelaide and hopefully sarwan and taylor are fully fit. where's fidel edwards, or is he a ODI player only?

I think if it does hit the edges of the wicket (hawkeye) it is given benefit of doubt to the batsmen (think there was such a decision in the NZ/Pak test).

Also, Fidel is injured. He aggrevated an injury playing IPL Champions trophy. Dont know if he will make it back in time for the tests.

Rodp · 30-11-2009, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

this series is starting as expected. 1st test will likely be over before stumps on day 3.

i must say also i'm not a fan of the use of hawkeye in the referral system. i don't mind hot spot and to an extent 'snicko' (although that can pick up any noise and make it appear like an edge - a creak in the bat for example) but hawkeye is made up by a lot of assumptions regarding the ball's flight path. if they want to use it, the benefit has to go to the batsman surely. latest referral say hawkeye just nicking the outside edge of leg stump. how can that be given out?? i thought they said in the interview at lunch on day 1 that they were using the centre of the ball, not the edges, to determine if it was going to hit. controversy - here we come. not much will get said this series unfortunatel because its only west indies.

I agree. Hawkeye to me is a fancy device to enhance the viewing pleasure and provide debate in the box by the commentators, it's not a device that should be used for adjudication. It has an error margin that is unknown each delivery. Used with a spin bowler I've seen laughable results. I'll accept its data on where the ball pitched as that's almost always before the predictive path but I still trust an umpire's judgement on hitting the stumps over Hawkeye.

If you're to believe Langer in Hobart against Pakistan, the edge that snicko picked up was a bat handle creak and not a tickle on the ball. Unless you're using a high speed camera, there's also the margin of error between frames and the spike in sound. Though I think it's a better tool than Hawkeye.

The only one that I trust explicitly would be hotspot but I have seen a single occasion where the angle of the bat masked the hotspot from the camera. It doesn't lie though. If you touch the ball it will leave a heat signature. It's just a matter of getting the right angle to see it.

prydey · 30-11-2009, 08:33 PM

hilfenhaus out of 2nd test, bollinger to replace him, mckay 12th man. looks like clark and lee will only get back in when all other options are exhausted.

also for the WI - jerome taylor is done for the series and sarwan should be fit to play.

prydey · 04-12-2009, 05:00 PM

well, 2nd test is underway and gayle is still in IPL mode. 26 off 23 and gone early. they are travelling ok at 235/4 although there was just a bit of controversy regarding these referrals again.

chiv chanderpaul appeared to nick it and caught behind. umpire gave it not out, ponting goes upstairs, hotspot shows nothing on the bat although the slow replays do appear to show a deflection in the flight of the ball. i assumed that any contact with the bat would show up as a hotspot regardless of how fine. there was a noise but the bat also hit the pad.

oh well, woops another wickt. 3/235 to 5/239 in one over plus nash is retired hurt but apparently will bat again.

hopefully they can see the day out and put at least 350 - 400 on the board. wishful?

prydey · 04-12-2009, 05:44 PM

another referral, this time the onfield umpire is overturned. in my opinion it should never have been given out anyway as it was an lbw that hit on the thigh pad. once upon a time if it hit above the knee roll it was too high. 3rd umpire overturned it so correct decision in the end.

gee i gotta stop this, another wicket falls while i'm posting on AFF and its bravo as well. damn.

Cobra · 04-12-2009, 10:36 PM

Are they showing it live in Adelaide? I wouldn't mind watching it tomorrow for a bit.

g220ba · 05-12-2009, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobra

Are they showing it live in Adelaide? I wouldn't mind watching it tomorrow for a bit.

i think they start showing it live about 10mins before the tea session.

prydey · 05-12-2009, 07:29 AM

yeah, 3pm till stumps.

prydey · 05-12-2009, 03:12 PM

451 fitst innings total for WI. pretty good effort i thought. still lots of room for improvement. at least it garauntees this test will go longer than 3 days! i'm not anti aussie, just like a contest, so i'd love to see the aussies bundled out for a similar total.

g220ba · 05-12-2009, 06:51 PM

This series really needed the Windies to show a bit of metal with bat and make that 451. The only problem they have now is its still a great batting pitch and australia's made a fantastic start.

I think if they can go to perth having drawn this game there may be a bit more interest in it. Still at this point it's anyones game.

prydey · 05-12-2009, 11:06 PM

the adelaide oval pitch is known as a great batting track and history shows a lot of big scores here but it also shows there are very few draws. les burdett = world class.

looking forward a bit, pakistan are making nz look average so hopefully they bring their A game too.

prydey · 06-12-2009, 06:15 PM

well well, who'd have thought WI would lead by 12 after the 1st innings. game on? hopefully they don't lose a wicket tonight.

g220ba · 06-12-2009, 06:20 PM

i really would prefer that channel 9 would show the whole days play.

Good on the Windies for showing some fight. I think they're putting a lot of people in their place by putting up a good fight. Everyone said after the first test the series would be a whitewash easily, now however it can go either way. Just the sort of series test cricket needs.

prydey · 08-12-2009, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 84ltd

Just the sort of series test cricket needs.

agreed. i think its great for world cricket and particularly WI cricket.

can they pull off the win? they got 10 wickets in a day on day 3, can they do it again on a pitch that is showing signs of being difficult to score on. bad news is, it rained most of the night and i'm not sure on todays forecast. i'm pretty sure the ground has pretty good drainage so if it doesn't rain anymore, play shouldn't be shortened too much.

gayle needs to go out and just swing the bat for half hour or so. 300 ahead should almost be enough. you need to keep the carrot dangling. to win you need to be prepared to lose. big day for roach and benn.

i would love to see WI get up for a win.

g220ba · 08-12-2009, 09:23 PM

well it was a good fight but i think in the end the Windies just didn't have enough fire power to pull it off. It also looks like the pitch held together well.

Michael clarke, brad haddin and shane watson all played great innings on the last day. Also Dwayne bravo and Chris Gayle also deserve congratulations.

I think the Windies also could have declared overnight and had the whole day to bowl at the aussies but missed a trick and batted too long essentially leaving too many for Aus to consider chasing on a 5th day Adelaide pitch.

Now we look forward to Perth in a couple of weeks and then Pakistan on Boxing Day. What looked like a pretty boring summer of cricket is starting to get interesting.

prydey · 08-12-2009, 10:26 PM

hopefully the waca pitch has some pace and bounce. roach was nudging the mid 150's. thats pretty sharp.

Bearman · 09-12-2009, 08:11 AM

A competitive showing from the Windies is just what the doctor ordered. It was an excellent contest and I hope it represents the Windies turning the corner.

Roll on 3rd test!!

World cricket needs a strong West Indies team.

prydey · 09-12-2009, 08:16 AM

3 centurions so far and all WI. Barath, bravo and gayle.

thats something that has been lacking in the aussie side for a while now and thats regular 100's. used to be at least one centurion every match, sometimes wvery innings.

prydey · 20-12-2009, 03:23 PM

well the 3rd test has been rn and won by the aussies but not without a stiff fight from the WI again, and not without controversy either.

for me its highlighted something that happens time after time, and thats touring parties not allowing themselves enough preparation time in the country before the 1st test. most visiting sides arrive only days before they are due to play a test series. probably due to the volume of cricket being played but it really hurts them.

WI can be extremely proud of their efforts in the 2nd and 3rd tests. no one expected them to compete, let alone come within 5 wickets (in adelaide) and 35 runs (perth) of victory.

still no aussie centurians and 4 for WI.

the referral system is a joke. whatever happened to giving the benefit to the batsman?? why is hotspot considered not definitive technology and yet lbw's are being given based on hawkeye!!

last wicket of the test today. hotspot showed no evidence of a nick, slow mo's showed no evidence of a change in the flight of the ball or the revolutions on the ball and yet it was still given out. a commentator made an interesting point. what if billy bowden had given it not out and ponting appealed it? would it have been overturned and still given out or just left.
not good enough for me. still a bit of work to do.

i don't believe you can give a man out just because hawkeye says its going to hit the top of leg stump. i don't believe hawkey is that accurate.

oh well, on to pakistan now. hope they can put up enough fight to last 5 days in each match.

g220ba · 20-12-2009, 04:20 PM

Yeah it turned out to pretty good series. In reference to the centurians for australia, if we remeber the ashes series Australia won in terms of stats (most centuries, leading run makers and top wicket takers) and still lost the series.

The referral system is there mainly for the blatantly obvious incorrect decisions but the players haven't learned how to use it correctly yet. The australians didn't seem to use all that often that game. In terms of todays referal i think it came down to the fact there was no definitive evidence to prove it was not out. It happened in adelaide when hot spot showed no mark on the bat but it appeared to deviate on 1 replay so was given out.

The game just doesn't need every single umpiring decision to be reviewed. A better system would be to allow the umpires to call for a referral if they're unsure of a decision as in a catch close to the ground.

Doug Bollinger seems like a player that should be held on to for a while. Always give 100% and has that intensity to play hard. I think they should've given a couple of younger players like phillip hughes and steve smith a go in this series as they're the future of australian cricket.

Lets look forward to a hard fought series against pakistan and of course another australian victory.

gtxb67 · 20-12-2009, 05:56 PM

to me the referral system is working great. from what i can see the third umpire does not make any decision unless they know for sure. much like the officiating umpires for run out/stumpings. at present the officating umpire makes a decision based on their feel/instinct/sight/hearing etc. and then if there is a challenge, the third umpire has the right to over turn it, if it is a totally wrong decision. if the third umpire cannot tell for sure, then the officiating umpire's decision stands - either in or out
i think it is the best compromise for a tough job. if the officiating umpire make a certain mistake, it is fixed, otherwise his decision stands. there is no reason for him to be out there if his decision is not the one that matters

g220ba · 20-12-2009, 06:14 PM

What the referral system has proved this series is how good the umpiring has been. Very few of the umpires decisions have been overturned. Ian Gould has proven to be one of the best umpires in the game at the moment getting the most difficult decisions right when it mattered.

There was a bit of spite in that series with both Shane Watson and Sulieman Benn acting like a pair of kids. For Benn all he had to do was get back to his mark and continue bowling, unfortunetly he decided arguing was a better option for him and as so was penalised. Watson didn't really need to laugh in gayles face, It really was a poor sight for any cricket fan but bowlers celebrations are really becoming a joke lately.

The referral system will be a hot topic for while to come. Maybe it'll just take a bit getting used to for the players.