Focus Idle Stop Start

Peterwl · 16-05-2016, 11:11 PM

I was at a Ford dealer having a look at a Focus for the first time. According to the sales rep, all of the Focus range, auto and manual have Idle Stop Start.

I obtained a glossy ( sales catalog ) for the Focus range and I can see no reference to it.

Does the current model Ford Focus ( auto ) have idle stop start ?

An owner will know !

Cheers all

Top_Ghia · 17-05-2016, 12:21 AM

Yes it does. You very quickly get used to it. It reacts quite quickly and after a short time you don't even notice it.
Those that haven't used it will tell you it's a death trap because you can't launch off the lights. In reality, by the time your foot moves from the brake to the throttle pedal the engine is running again and you're off.
And you can just switch it off for drag racing.

**DFB FGXR6** · 17-05-2016, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top_Ghia

Yes it does. You very quickly get used to it. It reacts quite quickly and after a short time you don't even notice it.
Those that haven't used it will tell you it's a death trap because you can't launch off the lights. In reality, by the time your foot moves from the brake to the throttle pedal the engine is running again and you're off.
And you can just switch it off for drag racing.

I can agree with this.

I had a loan Focus whilst my XR8 was being serviced. Was told it had stop-start and thought to myself "this is going to annoying".

Reality of it all its a very easy thing to live with and sitting at the lights in complete silence was kinda cool. I found it quite quick to respond and it would keep then engine running if the a/c was needed.

NormM67 · 17-05-2016, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top_Ghia

In reality, by the time your foot moves from the brake to the throttle pedal the engine is running again and you're off.

I have a manual and the engines running again before I even manage to select a gear after depressing the clutch. I see no reason to turn it off unless I'm in really heavy traffic that's continually stop start.

GTLEGEND · 17-05-2016, 11:36 PM

Its in the online brochure..

http://www.ford.com.au/cars/focus/pe...odule-features

Peterwl · 19-05-2016, 08:44 PM

Gentlemen,

Thank you for your replies, I am now informed.

Stropper · 08-07-2016, 07:09 PM

Hi...I have recently bought a 2016 Trend with the Idle stop feature. Yeah, good in practice but I for see a great problem in a few years. I had a 2011 Focus and apart from the gearbox, it was a good car. A year ago, I drove home from work, stopped the car, went inside for 3 minutes, went back out and the battery was flat. It died there and then. No warning. I do know a bit about batteries so checked it and it had less than 11 volts in it. I replaced it and all was fine. If this happens in the 2016 Focus with the idle stop, then you will not restart the engine and could be stranded in traffic. I dread my wife being in the situation on her own. Yeah, you can turn the feature off, but it resets to on again once you turn the key off and back on. You have to consciously turn it off every time. Of course, at times that will be forgotten. Ford don't give you the option to permanently disable this feature, so it looks like I will make some mechanical device to turn it off when the gear lever is put into drive. Not desirable, but what else can I do.

marg99 · 08-07-2016, 07:46 PM

These new fuel saving stop start features are all the same not just a ford issue, and cars are more sensitive to low voltages as well so a good battery becomes critical

Victor1 · 08-07-2016, 08:13 PM

Hey stropper,
I think that is a good call,and something to keep in mind.
As we all know a battery can die quickly or surrender slowly.
And if it dies slowly I Also agree that I don't my wife or daughters stranded at night alone because of a fuel saving device

4cyl_Turbo · 08-07-2016, 08:25 PM

If the battery voltage or condition doesn't meet a certain value/criteria, the stop/start feature is disabled. That criteria is set so it will disable stop/start well before impacting starting the car.

Victor1 · 08-07-2016, 08:29 PM

Well that's a relief,I hope your correct as batteries can be inconclusive in the deteriaton of voltage and amps

GTLEGEND · 08-07-2016, 08:34 PM

That is correct along with many other variables like if the clutch is left in (on a manual of course) it wont activate the start stop function, if the A/C is on and the cabin temp has not reached required temp on a hot day it wont stop and so on and so on... There are a lot of variables to be ticked before the engine cuts out...

Victor1 · 08-07-2016, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTLEGEND

That is correct along with many other variables like if the clutch is left in (on a manual of course) it wont activate the start stop function, if the A/C is on and the cabin temp has not reached required temp on a hot day it wont stop and so on and so on... There are a lot of variables to be ticked before the engine cuts out...

If you have a trend without climate control the idle stop will come on.

Stropper · 08-07-2016, 08:50 PM

I dont know how the computer could detect the battery condition when the engine is running. With all the variables, it would make sense to allow the owner to determine if the engine shuts off or not. For the sake of a tea spoon of petrol and giving the starter and battery a hard time it seems counter efficient.IMHO. I will make my mechanical device to overcome this. It wont look pretty, but peace of mind is more important.

Victor1 · 08-07-2016, 08:56 PM

The future of stop start and disabling will be a thing of the past,all cars of the future will have this feature hard wired.
It will be interesting to view your modification to deactivate this feature.

WindsorXR · 08-07-2016, 09:33 PM

4cyl_turbo is right. Stop/Start needs a lot of different conditions to meet to enable. Some vehicle can have around 40 different parameters that effect stop/start. Battery voltage, steering wheel angle, gear, Climate control requirements, fuel level and temperature, outside air temperatures(High and Low)
I have also worried about long term effects of starting up so many times over the years, but we'll wait and see if it actually damages anything that bad. I think it will all be OK. It's probably part of the high mileage checks.

GTLEGEND · 08-07-2016, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stropper

I dont know how the computer could detect the battery condition when the engine is running. With all the variables, it would make sense to allow the owner to determine if the engine shuts off or not. For the sake of a tea spoon of petrol and giving the starter and battery a hard time it seems counter efficient.IMHO. I will make my mechanical device to overcome this. It wont look pretty, but peace of mind is more important.

The PCM has a battery monitoring system which is the little white box on the battery terminal. If the owner makes the decision on when it turns on/off or permanently turned off, then theoretically the vehicle no longer complies with the ADR's it was designed to meet and more importantly the emmissions target it is used to comply or stated to meet.

The temperatures the PCM uses is based on cabin temperature and ambient sensors, not auto climate control settings. So even on a Trend with manual controls it does not matter. It compares cabin to ambient temps, if the difference becomes too great, then it will not stop the engine.

Below is the description out of the owners manual of its operation.

AUTO-START-STOP

Note:For vehicles with auto-start-stop, the battery requirement is different. It must be replaced by one of exactly the same specification as the original. The system reduces fuel consumption and CO2 emissions by shutting down the engine when your vehicle is idling, for example at traffic lights.

The engine will automatically restart when you press the clutch pedal or when required by a vehicle system, for example to recharge the battery. To obtain maximum benefit from the system, move the transmission lever to neutral and release the clutch pedal during any stop of longer than three seconds. Using Auto-Start-Stop WARNINGS The engine may restart automatically if required by the system. Switch the ignition off before opening the hood or carrying out any maintenance. Always switch the ignition off before leaving your vehicle, as the system may have shut down the engine but the ignition will still be live.

The indicator displays in the instrument cluster. Note:The system only operates when the engine is warm and the outside temperature is within the operating temperature limits of the system. Note:If you stall the engine, and then press the clutch pedal within a short period of time, the system will automatically restart the engine.

Note:The auto-start-stop indicator will illuminate green when the engine shuts down. See Warning Lamps and Indicators (page 61). Note:When the auto-start-stop indicator flashes amber, shift into neutral or press the clutch pedal. Note:If the system detects a malfunction, it will switch off. Have your vehicle checked by an authorized dealer. Note:When you switch the system off, the switch will illuminate. Note:The system automatically turns on every time you switch the ignition on. To switch the system off, press the switch in the instrument panel. The system will only be switched off for the current ignition cycle. To turn it on, press the switch again. For item location: See At a Glance (page 9). To Stop the Engine 1. Stop your vehicle. 2. Shift into neutral. 3. Release the clutch pedal. 4. Release the accelerator pedal. The system may not shut down the engine under certain conditions, for example: • To maintain the interior climate. • Low battery voltage. • The outside temperature is too low or too high. • The driver door has been opened. • Low engine operating temperature. • Low brake system vacuum. • If a road speed of 5 km/h has not been exceeded. • The driver seatbelt has not been fastened. To Re-Start the Engine Note:The transmission must be in neutral.
Press the clutch pedal. The system may automatically restart the engine under certain conditions, for example: • Low battery voltage. • To maintain the interior climate.

Victor1 · 08-07-2016, 10:12 PM

Yep start stop is better than us mere humans.
Thanks for that legend

vztrt · 08-07-2016, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marg99

These new fuel saving stop start features are all the same not just a ford issue, and cars are more sensitive to low voltages as well so a good battery becomes critical

The cars with stop start are designed to be able to start at really low voltages. So wouldn't be worried.

But as discussed there is a sensor that monitors the battery.

CatonaPC© · 09-07-2016, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stropper

I dont know how the computer could detect the battery condition when the engine is running. With all the variables, it would make sense to allow the owner to determine if the engine shuts off or not. For the sake of a tea spoon of petrol and giving the starter and battery a hard time it seems counter efficient.IMHO. I will make my mechanical device to overcome this. It wont look pretty, but peace of mind is more important.

I think whatever 'fix' you have in mind might make things worse and possibly void your warranty. Keep in mind, though, that both the battery and starter motor are of a more robust design to factor in the more frequent starts. It is, of course, new technology and nobody knows what potential issues (if any) may arise in future years.

Some owners have gotten into the habit of pressing the 'OFF' button after starting the car. So, if you feel inclined, that would also be your best solution.

As for that 'teaspoon' of fuel you claim they system saves by leaving it on, this video of an actual road test shows it's a BIG teaspoon.

Mercury Bullet · 09-07-2016, 02:29 PM

I've also read that the battery and starter motor are designed to accommodate this feature.

I've had one as a loan car too. I must admit I'm not a fan. I wasn't told the car had this feature and I crapped myself when it switched off at the lights.

I couldn't find the switch to disable it but soon worked out if you use minimal pressure on the brake, just enough to hold you and no more the engine will keep running.
I was in seriously bad peak hour traffic. It's probably better when the traffic isn't constantly stopping.

Stropper · 09-07-2016, 04:28 PM

No amount of reassurance I get will convince me. I have tested hundreds of batteries in my occupation and I know they fail any time, but most during winter . I see a dark, cold, wet winters morning and me or my wife stuck at the lights on the Hume Highway with a lot of traffic around...

I have looked at the situation, and Ford have conveniently placed a 12v outlet beside the gear lever and just above the switch, so it is easy to rig up a micro switch with a solenoid that operates the switch when the gear lever is moved into drive. Quick fit as I intend to make all hardware come off the 12v plug. Quick to remove as well. I cant see this voiding any warranty either. I have just replaced my finger with a solenoid.

Victor1 · 09-07-2016, 04:49 PM

Will it look ugly?
Switches/solenoids and such.
Much easier to just press the idle stop button on start up,once your in the habit of doing it all is good

Top_Ghia · 09-07-2016, 06:17 PM

Maybe start a class action against Ford. It's all the rage.

fiestaz · 09-07-2016, 06:44 PM

Sounds a bit warranty questioning to me... Any warranty issues you may have will have Ford saying but you put this solenoid etc in place so pay up. Like insurance companies, will always find a way out.
Better off just pressing the off button if its that much of a concern,

CatonaPC© · 09-07-2016, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stropper

. . . so it is easy to rig up a micro switch with a solenoid that operates the switch when the gear lever is moved into drive,

Stop/Start works in Park as well as Neutral. It is a good bet that whatever happens between the driver seat and the engine first goes through an ECU, so I can't see a micro switch or solenoid bypassing the 'smarts' of the car. Assuming it could be rigged up, there remains the unanswered question of whether the ECU would notice something wrong and just not allow the car to start at all.