UAW wants to unionise Toyota US plants.

[vztrt]

Obviously there is a lot resistance from Toyota.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/06/20/n...oyota-dealers/

New UAW president urges picketing Toyota dealers

by Jonathon Ramsey (RSS feed) on Jun 20th 2010 at 11:03AM

No, as a matter of fact, we didn't think Bob King's newly minted tenure as UAW president would begin like this. King was elected just last week, and he's already called for the membership's first major action: picket their neighborhood Toyota dealers. Why? To put pressure on Toyota to let its U.S. factory employees unionize, especially after the messy closure of the NUMMI facility– and while the UAW is at it, Volkswagen, Honda, Hyundai and Kia factory employees need to unionize as well.

The plan is for UAW members to "adopt" a local Toyota dealer and picket in front of it. In a speech, King said, "We're going to pound on Toyota until they recognize the First Amendment rights of their workers to come into the UAW," and "We're going to show these corporations that if they are unjust to our members that they are going to pay a price." Since dealers are franchise operations that can't really affect corporate policy, the hope has to be that Toyota will simply wish to avoid more PR hassle and sit down with the union.

King is determined to raise membership by getting the import factories unionized (curiously, no mention of Mercedes-Benz or BMW in any reports), as well as suppliers, so that the body has more wage- and concession-bargaining power. And he's not just looking to auto workers to help with this push – he's suggested retirees and other non-factory workers help on the picket lines. Of course, American International Automobile Dealers Association has come out with Gatling guns blazing against the move.

After a couple of years of Gettelfinger's quieter realpolitik, an immediate switch to ruckus tactics is a bit of a surprise. But hey, that's what a president with a landslide victory feels his people want, so let the drums boom. One can only hope that all the noise doesn't bring the whole house down...

[Source: Automotive News – sub req'd | Image: Carlos Osorio/Getty]

[SteveJH]

And if they cause enough of a problem i'm guessing Toyata and Kia etc would all just close their US factories and import from their other factories. Seems kinda counter-productive.

[mik]

i hope the union gets in , it might level the playing field a bit, i`d be surprised if they would pack up shop and go.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by SteveJH

And if they cause enough of a problem i'm guessing Toyata and Kia etc would all just close their US factories and import from their other factories. Seems kinda counter-productive.

They wouldn't pack up, the US market is to big for them to shut up shop. The UAW will effect their bottom line as they will want better entitlements. They can also cause strikes which is a big problem in production especially if you sell everything you make.

[Wretched]

I hope for one Toyota keep up the fight. UAW is nothing but trouble.

[quimby]

Originally Posted by Wretched

I hope for one Toyota keep up the fight. UAW is nothing but trouble.

Exactly. Look at the problems faced by the 3 US automakers. Most of their problems are union related. Sure they've made some bad decisions, but the UAW are not a good union to be involved with. So much so that the Teamsters have been battling with them for the last few years for members. The Teamsters have been able to poach UAW members quite easily.

Unions are nothing but trouble and have no place in modern society.

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by quimby

Unions are nothing but trouble and have no place in modern society.

Hasn't taken long for someone to turn the thread to rubbish.

Unions are the foundation corner stone for our current lifestyle.

Just as easily you can get bad unions & members as you can get bad bosses & industries.

[sarrge2001]

Originally Posted by phillyc

Hasn't taken long for someone to turn the thread to rubbish.

Unions are the foundation corner stone for our current lifestyle.

Just as easily you can get bad unions & members as you can get bad bosses & industries.

A bit harsh.......just because his views don't agree with yours doesn't make them rubbish.

Personally, the only time I ever asked for union intervention they were a total waste of space.

But as you pointed out, it's like everything.....there's good and bad in all areas.....

[flappist]

Originally Posted by phillyc

Hasn't taken long for someone to turn the thread to rubbish.

Unions are the foundation corner stone for our current lifestyle.

Just as easily you can get bad unions & members as you can get bad bosses & industries.

You mean the "I deserve everything now, should not have to work for it and someone else should pay for it" 21st century lifestyle?

I was in a union for several years (ETU) and have personally seen what goes on. I have also employed people for many years and personally seen what goes on.

Until you have done both you have only ever really seen one side of the story......

[Smoke Pursuit]

Unions are more about the people who run them then the actual people they are supposed to protect. I wouldnt waste my money being part of one.

[BOSHOG]

ill never pay into a union. i prefer to let me work habits speak for themselves. i dont need to ride on my workmates coattails and i dont expect mine to be ridden on either.

every man for himself works for the hardworkers

[phillyc]

Not that I need to justify my position to you. But don't shoot arrows when you also don't know who you are shooting at. You have been deliberately facetious on the first point. Annoyingly so.

Originally Posted by flappist

You mean the "I deserve everything now, should not have to work for it and someone else should pay for it" 21st century lifestyle?

Never have agreed with that. I'm working hard to buy and pay off my investments and live in a crap house that I bought 12 years ago at age 21 with the money I put aside from age 15 with my part time then full time jobs. Bit like i did my trade, then did my engineering on top of that. Then do the best I can at my role to improve my circumstances. Yep. Everything now...

Originally Posted by flappist

I was in a union for several years (ETU) and have personally seen what goes on.

I have seen what goes on in unions, and i've seen what goes on in places that aren't. Again, it's balance. To many on both sides say 'me, me, me'.

Originally Posted by flappist

I have also employed people for many years and personally seen what goes on. Until you have done both you have only ever really seen one side of the story......

I've worked as self employed person, a contractor and as an employee. But apart from paying contractors to do some work i've never been in the position of business owner.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by quimby

Exactly. Look at the problems faced by the 3 US automakers. Most of their problems are union related. Sure they've made some bad decisions, but the UAW are not a good union to be involved with. So much so that the Teamsters have been battling with them for the last few years for members. The Teamsters have been able to poach UAW members quite easily.

Unions are nothing but trouble and have no place in modern society.

I'm not really a union person, but if you do look at whats happened with the big three during the resturcturing the unions and workers have made alot of concessions to get the three profitable.

Also you can't just blame the unions for their problems. Poor managment was the cause of the three getting in trouble. Look at Ford, Mullaly comes in when Ford were stuffed, he re-organised the company changed their priorities and to a lesser extent culture and now they are really kicking goals. Making profits in one of the hardest financial climates, and getting the company back on it's feet.

[castellan]

There are unions and there are unions.
Unfortunate we got the system off the pommy bast@$#&% and there commo criminally insane hog wash.
Just one of the idiotic things is, they support incompetent workers, and totally disregard the company's health. let alone the nations.
Why are People so happy to buy products from downtrodden people in other countries.

[mik]

as a young buk i always had a lookout towards employment as try heaps of different jobs, that attitude changed later in life, but my point ....... in 30 years+ in the work force either as my own boss or gainfully employed in many different occupations i have seen both sides of the coin, and anyone that says all unions are the spawn of satan and all employers are the angels of the world need to get out a bit more.

[irish2]

Originally Posted by castellan

Why are People so happy to buy products from downtrodden people in other countries.

If we didn't have unions we would be the downtrodden people selling the 2c goods.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by SteveJH

And if they cause enough of a problem i'm guessing Toyata and Kia etc would all just close their US factories and import from their other factories. Seems kinda counter-productive.

I'm inclined to agree. The US market isn't so extra-special to Japanese and Korean automakers that they cant set up shop somewhere in Mexico or South Korea and still sell cars in the US from those plants. The "buy American or else" mantra has been dying a slow death like our own, before too long Americans will find it perfectly acceptable to buy an import much like the rest of the world does.

[SteveJH]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

I'm inclined to agree. The US market isn't so extra-special to Japanese and Korean automakers that they cant set up shop somewhere in Mexico or South Korea and still sell cars in the US from those plants. The "buy American or else" mantra has been dying a slow death like our own, before too long Americans will find it perfectly acceptable to buy an import much like the rest of the world does.

Especially since the Profit margins in the US for cars are incredibly low already. I was reading an article with an interview of the CEO of one of the European Car companies (forget which one). They were thinking about trying to enter the US Market, but hadnt done it previously as its not a profitable market due to the US Car Buyer's expectations of insanely low prices for new cars.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by SteveJH

Especially since the Profit margins in the US for cars are incredibly low already. I was reading an article with an interview of the CEO of one of the European Car companies (forget which one). They were thinking about trying to enter the US Market, but hadnt done it previously as its not a profitable market due to the US Car Buyer's expectations of insanely low prices for new cars.

Small cars yes, bigger cars no, trucks/pick-ups can bring in big money.

[SteveJH]

Originally Posted by vztrt

Small cars yes, bigger cars no, trucks/pick-ups can bring in big money.

I believe it was one of the French or Italian car companies, fairly sure they *mostly* make smaller cars....

[castellan]

Originally Posted by irish2

If we didn't have unions we would be the downtrodden people selling the 2c goods.

Thats right! but why do we buy off the countries without unions.
I am all for unions.
But the poor dumb aussies have no hope with our type of unions. never had and never will. there are other countries with great unions and no one runs them down, because they are competent.
Not incompetent fat morons just after your money and stand over dictating fools.

[castellan]

Originally Posted by mik

as a young buk i always had a lookout towards employment as try heaps of different jobs, that attitude changed later in life, but my point ....... in 30 years+ in the work force either as my own boss or gainfully employed in many different occupations i have seen both sides of the coin, and anyone that says all unions are the spawn of satan and all employers are the angels of the world need to get out a bit more.

Yes that is so True!

[b0son]

Originally Posted by vztrt

I'm not really a union person, but if you do look at whats happened with the big three during the resturcturing the unions and workers have made alot of concessions to get the three profitable.

But lets look at the non-US car companies who didnt go bankrupt. UAW NOT involved in those operations. Perhaps we want to look at the role ridiculous wages played in US car companies profitabilities.

Concessions aside, its a safe bet that when the economy and car sales are on the improve, the UAW will start pushing their barrow again.

[Ghiadude]

This argument will not be resolved on this forum. It has raged for an eternity and will continue to do so and so are the days of our lives.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by b0son

But lets look at the non-US car companies who didnt go bankrupt. UAW NOT involved in those operations. Perhaps we want to look at the role ridiculous wages played in US car companies profitabilities.

The non union car companies were paying more to their employees then the Big 3. It was the benefits where there was a lot more waste.

As for why GM and Chrysler went into bankruptcy (Ford would have had they not brought Mullaly in) was poor management. The US is such a huge market yet GM (using them as an example) couldn't make a profit when they were the highest selling make in the US.

[aussie muscle]

wasn't it GM who said you don't need to make a good car to make good profit?

all this talk of usa cars+unions reminds me of the movie 'working class man' where a japanese maker takes over a usa plant. hilarious.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0091159/

[Adamz Ghia]

I've never understood why on forums (not just this one), when someone is saying how good unions are, no one says boo, but the moment someone bags them, you have the few that jump up and down and say how rubbish the conversation has become. If you can't handle a different opinion to yours, go and hide in your room.

History will show that the UAW helped Ford avoid going under by giving them some concessions. But don't be so naive (to be polite) to think that once Ford (and GM and Chrystler) are on the improve they wont be banging on their doors again wanting what they gave up back and then some. It's the way the union works over there.

And what these union thugs plan to do with the dealers is plain stupid. There is no logic in it. If the dealers can't sell cars, they don't get paid. The UAW is willing to punish these people who work at the dealers to benifit (if you could call it that) their mob. I have a hunch that given Toyota employees get a higher rate of pay, should they become unionised they will picket for them to get the same benifits as the Big 3 and also try to get the higher rte of pay from Ford and the other 2. I might be way off, but just a hunch.

[vztrt]

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/07/13/u...-ny-says-king/

UAW picketing at Toyota dealers to start in CA and NY says King

by Chris Shunk (RSS feed) on Jul 13th 2010 at 5:58PM

The recently-crowned king of the United Auto Workers, President Bob King, has a monumental task before him: reverse the decades-long decline in UAW membership. To do that the UAW will likely need to make inroads at transplant automaker plants, and to accomplish this goal King promises to be more active in staging demonstrations than in the past, and an early target is Toyota and California. Automotive News reports that the UAW is organizing protests in front of several Toyota dealerships in the Golden State to draw attention to the recently closed NUMMI plant in Fremont, CA.

The facility, which was making the Toyota Corolla and Matrix until it was shuttered in April, was the only unionized facility producing Toyotas in North America. The closing of NUMMI, which happened in part because General Motors pulled out of its agreement with Toyota during its bankruptcy in 2009, left thousands of UAW workers without a job. Toyota has since sold the NUMMI facility to Tesla Motors, who will utilize only a portion of the plant and hire around 1,000 workers. Toyota did spring for a considerable severance package of nearly $300 million for the laid-off workers when the plant closed.

Of course the group most upset about the upcoming protests is the American International Automobile Dealers Association. AIADA president Cody Lusk claims that the protests will only hurt small businesses that supply plenty of American jobs, adding
"An assault on America's auto retail industry will only serve to highlight the disconnect between the UAW and reality."

[Source: Automotive News - Sub. Req. | Mark Ralston/AFP/Getty]