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25-07-2021, 02:48 PM
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#1 | ||
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Lukeyson
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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I'm investigating whether the WS Fiesta front struts can be swapped onto a WQ Fiesta.
Why? (1) The WS uprights use 2 x Bolts to mount to the knuckle, rather than WQ Sleeve-and-pinch arrangement. With Cammed bolts this lends itself much more readily to camber adjustment. (2) The WS 12mm / 120mm spaced brake mount is different to the 10mm / 90mm spaced mount on the WQ. This is the same mount setup for later model ST brakes. so upgraded brake kits are more readily available. The Wilwood 6 spot 310mm kit for around $1400Aud shipped would fit, for example. I have a WQ 1.6 strut, a WS 1.6 Strut and a WQ XR4 strut to compare here. I'm taking some measurements at the moment and will report back my findings. Some gotchas already. (1) The WS strut needs to come from a car with a VIN starting with WF0 - the German Built PCD108 models. Getting a malaysian Built WS means PCD 100. (2) The sway bar mount on the strut seems identical between the WQ and WS. (3) The brake line is slightly different, the WS brake line would be needed to correctly tie to the strut. Some other minor observations - the 1.6 WQ Fiesta has a bigger gap between the axle centre and the lower king pin face. The WS knuckle and the XR4 knuckle however appear the same. The steering arms between all 3 - while extraordinarily difficult to measure - all appear around the same. The height above the axle line, the setback from the hub front face, and the distance from the knuckle centre to the centre of the steering pin all appear damn close if not identical. The full upright length from the top of the upright to the bottom of the kingpin is close to identical on the WQ 1.6 and the WS. The XR4 just shorted by a couple of cm. The rotors on the 1.6 WQ and the WS are the same part numbers and 258mm dia. The XR4 is of course a 278 mm rotor. All other hub dimensions are the same. I have WS knuckles with ABS sensors so will be checking shortly whether the plugs are compatible. Both WQ and WS knuckles have the same lower king pin arrangement and are compatible. Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 05:27 PM
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#2 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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Some comparison images of the Knuckle:
XR4 left Front Knuckle, some side on, above, and from the front:    WQ 1.6 LH front knuckle fromt side, above and front:    And finally a LH front WS upright - side and front.   Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 05:34 PM
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#3 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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The sway-bar mount on the WQ and WS uprights are in pretty much the same location.
WQ Strut with sway bar:  WS Strut with Sway Bar mount in pretty much the same location:  Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 06:27 PM
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#4 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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The ABS sensors are different, so some trickery will be required there.
This image shows the connector for the WS ABS sensor on the left, the WQ sensor connector on the right.  Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 06:36 PM
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#5 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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The sensors are just marginally different too:
WS on left, WQ on right:  WS on left, WQ on right:  WQ on top, WS on bottom  Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 09:04 PM
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#6 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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So the answer looks to be to use a WS Sensor and loom - since they are all Hall Effect sensors anyway, and the bearing and driveshaft is all the same between WQ and WS - and crimp a watertight WQ connector on the end of the WS sensor loom. The connector is a TE 2-1437712-5, which is available at AU.mouser.com, but the pins and the seals are not.
Interestingly, that Connector appears to be the same 2-pin type as used on the Power Window motors! Anyways, Aliexpress to the rescue, and the connectors, pins AND seals are all available for the price of a packet of chips. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001...c00EmX3go&mp=1 Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 09:20 PM
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#7 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 09:33 PM
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#8 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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Wilwood 6-spot calipers with 310mm 2-piece rotors. Question marks exist over whether Wilwood is street legal in Australia, but people are reporting them being engineer approved OK.
  Available on eBay for $1400AUD shipped at time of writing: https://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_...7755_&device=c Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 09:36 PM
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#9 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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The Stoptech Brakes on SparesBox would fit. But we're talking over $3k for those....
 https://www.sparesbox.com.au/part/st...83-343-4300-71 Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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25-07-2021, 09:44 PM
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#10 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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Of note, the calipers themselves on the WS and WQ are not the same. I thought I could swap the carrier over from the WS and use the WQ caliper still, but the distance between the caliper sliding pins is significantly different and there's no way at all to swap them.
Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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18-08-2021, 12:55 PM
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#11 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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New discovery - the Tie rod end Ball Joint is also different. The WQ steering arm tapered hole is much smaller than the WS. I will acquire some WS tie rod ends to investigate. In fact I might get a whole rack to compare, seems cheaper that way. The WS has the power assistance in an electric motor in the steering column under the dashboard, so the WS rack itself is unassisted. I have read that there have been some WS to WQ EPAS conversions in the UK - might be worth a sticky beak...
Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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18-08-2021, 02:58 PM
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#12 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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Cleaned up ready. The hope is to swap some XR4 coils onto WS struts and see how the thing settles ride-height wise.
 I have already swapped an XR4 Disc rear end onto my shed hack - but it was missing the brake lines, so I'm going to have a go at re-using the drum-brake flexi lines and making up a small section of hard line to meet up with them - which means learning how to do the bends and double flares correctly. Lots of mistakes will be made at first I am sure....  Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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27-08-2021, 06:20 PM
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#13 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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WS tie rod ends are here. They have just about the exact same key dimensions other than the diameter of the ball join pin itself.
WS strut install using XR coils and WS tie rod ends Installation attempt scheduled for tomorrow..... Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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28-08-2021, 06:03 PM
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#14 | ||
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Lukeyson
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maitland, NSW
Posts: 2,584
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Struts are on. Tie Rods are on. It looks like this comination might have it sitting a bit tall with XR4 springs and WS struts. With this WS knuckle arrangement, it might actually need proper Mk8 ST struts to get it to the right height. It's not lowered off the hoist yet so we'll see.
The old WQ driveshafts were in the knuckles the tightest I have ever seen! I had a puller fully tensioned up using the air gun, and was banging on it with a lump hammer, moving it half a mm each iteration. I was so glad when I finally got them out. Longest part of the day was spent just on those bloody axles in the knuckles! With it mostly back together, I was nearly at the point of un-hoisting today, but the front right bearing was not repressed into the knuckle right and is going to need the driveshaft re-installed to hold it into place. I was hoping to leave the shafts out ready for when I pull the motor out of it in the coming months, but not any longer. I'm also waiting on some brake pads for the rear disc setup I swapped in so I can park it on a hill, so they need to arrive before I roll it out for the moment (and get on with some other work). The front WS brake caliper hoses also nip up perfect to the WQ fixed line endpoints. Seems like it was meant to be. I still don't have the right XR4 rear brake lines as mentioned before, but my brake line and flare tool have arrived, so I'll take a crack at making those up tomorrow too.  Lukeyson
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If the human brain was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it. |
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30-04-2024, 03:26 PM
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#15 | ||
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Starter Motor
Join Date: Apr 2024
Posts: 10
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I just saw this thread, I have a WQ Fiesta.
I'm interested in a pathway to upgrade the shocks/struts. How did your suspension/brake swap go? Can you update us on what you figured out? Thanks! |
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WQ or XR4 Front Strut swap to WS Front Struts
Re: WQ or XR4 Front Strut swap to WS Front Struts
Linear Mode
