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The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
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19-05-2011, 02:20 PM | #1 | |||
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Nothing for Ford...
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19-05-2011, 02:22 PM | #2 | ||
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Umm, dude, Ford received GCIF money for Ecoboost and the new LPG engine.
Not that there is anything wrong with that, contrary to how Drivel.com.au have made it out to be. That was the whole point of the Green Car Innovation Fund - to encourage local car makers to introduce green vehicle technologies.
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19-05-2011, 02:55 PM | #3 | |||||
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His own statement - Quote:
Why isnt their some rational journalist out there, that could put a few simple economic questions to Kim Carr, and get him to prove his own stupid statements. Quote:
2) A consortium who is going to try and prove that an electric commodore can be made (not for production, just to prove it). 3) A 4 cylinder cruze, that Holden is going to sell for over $1700 more (when adding extras), than it was selling for when it was imported. Mcdonalds get more bang for its buck when one of its junior staff figured out that cutting the pickle in 2.3 mm slices was more efficient than 2.4 mm slices, than australia will get out of Kim Carrs green Car fund. Last edited by bobthebilda; 19-05-2011 at 03:03 PM. |
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19-05-2011, 02:57 PM | #4 | ||
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Yeh lets keep proping the automotive industry year after year.
They dont prop the rest of us up.. What a joke! |
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19-05-2011, 03:12 PM | #5 | |||
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Aluminium panels, interesting. I wonder which panels they hope to change?
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19-05-2011, 03:22 PM | #6 | ||
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I would think bonnet, boot and maybe front quarters? We will see if it eventuates and what additional cost it brings to the car.
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19-05-2011, 03:25 PM | #7 | ||
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I remember they were blowing their trumpet before the GFC about experimenting with plastic front 1/4 panels...so if they are going with aluminium it makes sense all the hanging panels (bar the doors) will be ally.
Will the FGII get the plastic boot floor this time?
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19-05-2011, 03:25 PM | #8 | ||
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Next prediction, Volt will be built in Australia from 2016.
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19-05-2011, 03:28 PM | #9 | |||
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Pretty clever getting Green Car funding for the Aluminium panels, because if the major parts of the VF facelift - fenders, boot and bonnet are aluminium it means that the funds are also used to make cosmetic changes to the car. |
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19-05-2011, 03:29 PM | #10 | |||
The 'Stihl' Man
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19-05-2011, 03:31 PM | #11 | |||
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19-05-2011, 03:33 PM | #12 | ||
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Going from this pic, the VE already has a plastic spare wheel well:
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19-05-2011, 03:34 PM | #13 | ||
Lukeyson
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GM have plastic panel experience with the Saturn brand. There was a lot of marketting for it, especially about the panels popping back out when hit, but since Saturn was one of the GM brands that were switched off, I suspect plastic panels are not an attractive option....
Lukeyson
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19-05-2011, 03:36 PM | #14 | |||
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I'd imagine other companies like AUDI who use a lot of aluminium body components spend squillions on their inherent design characteristics to ensure their cars take the lighter weight / lesser strength aluminium into consideration ???? Could be barking up the wrong tree here , but aluminium body panels are surely not as rigid - have same tensile strength as their steel brethren ???? In which case - how much extra weight would be needed to add additional safety equipment back into the car to meet exceed safety standards ???
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19-05-2011, 03:39 PM | #15 | ||
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I dont think panels make a huge difference in crash, not the boot and front quarters. The bonnet skin would be nothing, but the frame would need re certification.
Im pretty sure front quarters add stuff all to safety...happy to be proven wrong though. Where al is used compare to steel its ultimate tensile is not as huge factor as its mainly for cosmetic reasons. When you start talking doors and bonnet frames/structures its different.
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19-05-2011, 03:41 PM | #16 | |||
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19-05-2011, 03:43 PM | #17 | |||
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If company's can use plastic then Al is fine. IIRC Jag use Al extensively. But thats why I questioned what extra price goes on RRP.
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19-05-2011, 03:45 PM | #18 | |||
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I'm thinking the front guards here..... Quarters would probably be fine.
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19-05-2011, 04:08 PM | #19 | ||
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What would the weight difference be between steel and aluminum? Is it really worth the cost involved?
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19-05-2011, 04:12 PM | #20 | ||
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I know Ford was involved in a new high tensile steel that was meant to be thinner than the current steel but stronger.
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19-05-2011, 04:12 PM | #21 | |||
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If your looking at frames/structures then its worth it, but costly. I dont know why the locals havent pushed plastic further.
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19-05-2011, 04:12 PM | #22 | ||
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Well, good on Holden for gaining the grant, they've showed initiative. The grants were available, and they've scooped them up...smart business move.
As usual the Sydney Morning Herald has picked a headline that will attract more readers...and it seems to have worked in their favour, again...despite the papers lack of substance and journalistic ability.
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19-05-2011, 04:14 PM | #23 | ||
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Rolled steel has a weight of approx 7800 kg a cubic metre. Aluminium has a weight of 2600kg a cubic metre. ie Aluminium is roughly 1/3 the weight of rolled steel. To get a weight saving of 7% on a 1700kg Commodore, you need to knock off 119 kilograms. 119/2 x 3 = Thus the current weight of the steel panels they are looking to replace are 178 kilos, to be replaced with 59 kilo aluminium panels.
At a rough guess, they are taking out $170 of steel, and putting in $427 of aluminium. So adding about $260 of metal to the car. But I am pretty sure they will also need to change alot of the tooling too. Its hard not to be a cynic with these announcements, so I am pretty sure we will find out (in 2013) that the panels they were referring to were the Holden badges on the front and rear of the car. |
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19-05-2011, 04:25 PM | #24 | |||
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Unless you're talking about this carbon nanotube stuff Ford US said they were fiddling with?
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19-05-2011, 05:46 PM | #25 | ||
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I can see it now on tin foil ...
Recycled Holden...Lol...
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19-05-2011, 06:56 PM | #26 | ||||
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But front quarters I'm not sure about. I know the Nissan X-trail has plastic front quarters. So might just be nothing. Quote:
............. I'm not really sure about the innovation part of this. I guess the fuel savings got the grant over the line. But they met the criteria and got their panels subsidised. I'm just wondering what costs of repairs will be with these panels and how much will insurance premiums be for these cars.
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19-05-2011, 06:57 PM | #27 | |||
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Holden to dress Commodore in aluminium
http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mell...25789500195BBC Quote:
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19-05-2011, 06:59 PM | #28 | |||
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http://www.caradvice.com.au/119455/h...nt-investment/
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19-05-2011, 07:17 PM | #29 | ||
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Won't have to worry about rust anymore.
Hope Ford follows suit. We won't have all the rust threads on here from FG / Territory owners with more use of aluminium.
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Regards Bobby Current Cars: 2000 AU2 Fairmont (2019-current) 2003 BA1 Falcon Divvy Van (2017-current) 2009 VW Mk6 Golf 118TSi (2020-current) Previous Cars: 2003 MCX10R Avalon VXi (2017-2020) 1995 EF1 Falcon GLi (2016-2019) 1997 XH2 Falcon Van OPT20 (2016-2019) 2006 BF Fairlane Ghia (2013-2018) 2001 AU3 Futura (2010-2013) 1996 EL Fairmont (2008-2010) 2004 BA XR6 (2005-2008) 2001 AU2 Forte (2005-2006) 1988 EA Fairmont Ghia (2003-2005) 1984 AR Telstar TX5 Ghia (2001-2005) |
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19-05-2011, 07:19 PM | #30 | ||
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hmmm, i personally think now they are getting ahead of the competition.
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