Adelaide Holden to Shut Down for 25 Days

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Yes.. you can export a zillion cars a year but if you loose money doing it you'll go broke!
Holden have coped a wack from exporting.. just look at their financial position..

their current financial position isnt from losing money on exports.. its their exports that have kept them above water. it only costs about 12k to produce a commodore. its the lack of aussies buying the aussie versions of their cars. they cant shift them fast enough to cover the cost of producing them. guess u could say aussies have contributed to their current positions by buying cheaper/ and or better cars from overseas.

[SPK-250]

Holden dont really give a toss about manufacturing a car in OZ. If they did they would have likely spent 1 billion dollars developing a mid size 4 cylinder instead.

At the beginning of October Holden had 2 weeks shutdown, the shortfall of that was so did we (Walker Aus) and holden only sold just over 600 cars total in that fortnight!

Its funny because they were going to cut production next year by 200 odd cars, but instead they are now still going to make 600+ cars a day, but work less days a week.

Spare a thought for the people like myself who work in the OE parts supply area when Holden decide they only want to work 3-4 days a week. I can't see myself working a full 5 day week for the first 3-6 months of next year.

How good is that going to be for my pay packet??

[Dr Smith]

Maybe Holden's production down days and drop in build also has to do with the likelihood that many Holden dealers won't be able to stay in business if they can't get stock financing once GE money and GMAC close doors later this year.

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Maybe Holden's production down days and drop in build also has to do with the likelihood that many Holden dealers won't be able to stay in business if they can't get stock financing once GE money and GMAC close doors later this year.

Dealers need financing for floor stock and inventory.

If they have a full order bank their need for financing is much lower, the car's come in, get predelivered, registered, and sold quickly.

The problem is cars are NOT selling and dealers need to hold stock and finance what they are holding.

If Holden was interested in helpinig their dealers they would stop building to 'spec' and only build to order. Maybe that'd also clean up the 1,000's of 'dunnydores' they have sitting 'on grass' also.

I think the 'penny' has just dropped and they can see that sales are NOT going to magically increase on their own. Watch this space for a downbalance at Holden soon and lots of job losses.

They can't run at that daily rate and have a large number of down days for ever.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

their current financial position isnt from losing money on exports.. its their exports that have kept them above water. it only costs about 12k to produce a commodore. its the lack of aussies buying the aussie versions of their cars. they cant shift them fast enough to cover the cost of producing them. guess u could say aussies have contributed to their current positions by buying cheaper/ and or better cars from overseas.

It only costs 12K to build a commodore... Geez.. i heard it all now..

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Dealers need financing for floor stock and inventory.

If they have a full order bank their need for financing is much lower, the car's come in, get predelivered, registered, and sold quickly.

The problem is cars are NOT selling and dealers need to hold stock and finance what they are holding.

If Holden was interested in helpinig their dealers they would stop building to 'spec' and only build to order. Maybe that'd also clean up the 1,000's of 'dunnydores' they have sitting 'on grass' also.

I think the 'penny' has just dropped and they can see that sales are NOT going to magically increase on their own. Watch this space for a downbalance at Holden soon and lots of job losses.

They can't run at that daily rate and have a large number of down days for ever.

Its a dangerous situation isnt it... if Ford and Holden can't get finance for their Floor stock your local dealership will only need to be about the size of a milkbar.. come to think of it maybe dealerships will shut up their branches and open up in shopping centres with virtual walk-through showrooms but no physical stock as everything will be made to order with an 8 week lead-time...

[FGII-XR6]

in the mean time ford aus is expanding production at Geelong and continuing to develop the I6 a good step for all http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11241338
http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/latest/...plant-closure/

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

It only costs 12K to build a commodore... Geez.. i heard it all now..

i worked for 5 years for them dude. start to finish of costs involved just for the car itself is about 12/14k tops. that is at completion ready to drive. basic holden commdore delivered to dealers is about 22/24 k. this includes all of holdens own costs tacked on top of it. then the dealers try to flog them off and 35-37 k plus ORC

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

i worked for 5 years for them dude. start to finish of costs involved just for the car itself is about 12/14k tops. that is at completion ready to drive. basic holden commdore delivered to dealers is about 22/24 k. this includes all of holdens own costs tacked on top of it. then the dealers try to flog them off and 35-37 k plus ORC

Material costs maybe. NOT the cost of producing it from go to whoa !

Add labour and overhead, then fixed costs, and tooling and R&D and you're talking about 24 g. Wholesale is about 28g.

If the total cost of a car was 12 g they would retail for 20 !!

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Material costs maybe. NOT the cost of producing it from go to whoa !

Add labour and overhead, then fixed costs, and tooling and R&D and you're talking about 24 g. Wholesale is about 28g.

If the total cost of a car was 12 g they would retail for 20 !!

Exactly..

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Material costs maybe. NOT the cost of producing it from go to whoa !

Add labour and overhead, then fixed costs, and tooling and R&D and you're talking about 24 g. Wholesale is about 28g.

If the total cost of a car was 12 g they would retail for 20 !!

lol if you read my post....thats exactly what i said.. and dealers make waaay more then you think. the good dealerships will survive eitherway.


guess we'll know in 3-6 months wether they will stay or go.

[irlewy86]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Its a dangerous situation isnt it... if Ford and Holden can't get finance for their Floor stock your local dealership will only need to be about the size of a milkbar.. come to think of it maybe dealerships will shut up their branches and open up in shopping centres with virtual walk-through showrooms but no physical stock as everything will be made to order with an 8 week lead-time...

Reminds me of the Renault dealer in Redcliffe Qld, Showroom floor just big enough for a Megane and a Kangoo, a single bay service department and no yard. Didn't think you could make money on a dealership so small.

[TurboUteris]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

i worked for 5 years for them dude. start to finish of costs involved just for the car itself is about 12/14k tops. that is at completion ready to drive. basic holden commdore delivered to dealers is about 22/24 k. this includes all of holdens own costs tacked on top of it. then the dealers try to flog them off and 35-37 k plus ORC

22/24k!!!! 35-37k!!! L O L! plus!...LMFAO

So your telling me Holden dealerships run with profit margins of 10-13k?
Get a grip mate.

: : : : : :

[Gobes32]

Direct labour (operators, painters, engine builders) costs per car are actually very small, it's the indirect labour (first aid, transport, site maintenance) costs that kills you.

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by TurboUteris

22/24k!!!! 35-37k!!! L O L! plus!...LMFAO

So your telling me Holden dealerships run with profit margins of 10-13k?
Get a grip mate.

: : : : : :

man this conversation is going in circles. i dunno how many poeple on here own their own business but yes. they run big margins. their operating costs are built into that profit margin from that 10-12k they pay overheads, wages, servicing etc. anyone here know how much it costs to run a dealership? its not ur local deli where all overheads are small so profit margins can be small as well. as u get to pricier and pricier goods, the profit margin goes up.

look eeryone has their own opinion and im sure some people on this forum work for dealerships and ford. im sure if they wanted to they could shed some light. if im wrong ill eat my own left nut :

[mik]

when does the three week closure start ? Elizabeth plant usually closes for 3 weeks just before xmas so the engineers can do line maintenance, although with all the down time they may be up to date with maintenance, if not it could be a six week holiday.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by mik

when does the three week closure start ? Elizabeth plant usually closes for 3 weeks just before xmas so the engineers can do line maintenance, although with all the down time they may be up to date with maintenance, if not it could be a six week holiday.

They wont be taking 3 weeks in one block, they will run 3 or 4 day weeks.

[SPK-250]

Holden are having just under 5 weeks off over Xmas(as are Ford), resuming work on the 14 of January 2009. Once back at work is when those 25 down days will start happening, the first one as early as the Australia day weekend a week and a half later.

[mik]

bad news for people paying stuff off.......

[EgoFG]

Holdens 2007 Revenue from all exports is about 1.6 billion
http://www.trademinister.gov.au/rele...08/sc_072.html
They fall short of giving a number of cars exported
Some of the export $ would be from 'parts' Do they still export engine only ?

This is significantly less than the projections and plans from 2001
http://www.autoweb.com.au/cms/A_5350...wsarticle.html

[homegrown]

holdens are desperate for sales. alls you have to say is i know a guy that knew a guy that had a holden and you'll get 30% off.
the yanks get there G8's which is loaded up SS with sunroof dvd player for 30k and we pay 55 or 60k for the same thing with different badges. the US say we'll buy so many with heaps of options and holdens will cave and take the deal.
holdens have become bums of the automotive industry, they have to take every dollar they can skab.
i work there and see the cost cutting thats going, we'll be bringing in our own toilet paper soon.

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by homegrown

holdens are desperate for sales. alls you have to say is i know a guy that knew a guy that had a holden and you'll get 30% off.
the yanks get there G8's which is loaded up SS with sunroof dvd player for 30k and we pay 55 or 60k for the same thing with different badges. the US say we'll buy so many with heaps of options and holdens will cave and take the deal.
holdens have become bums of the automotive industry, they have to take every dollar they can skab.
i work there and see the cost cutting thats going, we'll be bringing in our own toilet paper soon.

Fords are exactly the same at the moment, every dollar is counted and people are leaving left, right and center. However, we are led to believe that is for the betterment of the company and that cost cutting now ensures we have a bright future. It seems Holden are only being forced to take this action now. For a while now, we have had down days, down balancing etc, to ensure we did not have a glut of cars we could not sell. And it seems to have worked really, really well. No one could have foreseen the circumstances we find ourselves in now but all we can do is battle on and live to fight another day.

[homegrown]

your definately right, we'll keep battling on. and your right about no one seeing this coming when holdens brought out the VT and that car was such a hit and everyone was working saturday and sundays and off getting massive loans no one would ever think that we would be in this predicament toady. im sure there was a few that were sceptical tho. but ive been told in the 80's they had a situation just as bad as today if not worse and they pulled thru so chins up to everyone in the car bizzo.

also sometimes i wish i was working for fords than i wouldn't have to give away our free holdens posters and books we sometimes get

[SPK-250]

Originally Posted by mik

bad news for people paying stuff off.......

Yeah but its easy for the people at Holden to say yes to having down days as they are getting paid 60% of the wage for the days they have off, thats pretty attractive ifyou ask me!

At Walkers the union are trying to get the same thing happening in regards to making it easier for people to have time off when needed instead of using up all facets of leave and such. Due to not many people having much leave because of a lot of stand downs all ready been and gone it makes it hard for the people with ie 2 kids and 1 income.

[TurboUteris]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

man this conversation is going in circles. i dunno how many poeple on here own their own business but yes. they run big margins. their operating costs are built into that profit margin from that 10-12k they pay overheads, wages, servicing etc. anyone here know how much it costs to run a dealership? its not ur local deli where all overheads are small so profit margins can be small as well. as u get to pricier and pricier goods, the profit margin goes up.

look eeryone has their own opinion and im sure some people on this forum work for dealerships and ford. im sure if they wanted to they could shed some light. if im wrong ill eat my own left nut :

I would start sharpening the knives and preparing a sauce,as your new nickname is about to become lefty.

Most dealerships have a profit margin of about 10%(in new car's),plus factory incentives which can sometimes take the margin out to about 20%.But due to the competitive nature of the market the retained profit is usually around 5% on average.You would be surpised to know that the current average retained profit across the board (in Sydney atleast) is around $500-$1200 per car including PD.(pre delivery)
The manufacturers then pay the dealer's a holdback after the car is delivered,but that is usually no more than $1500.The new car dept of dealerships havent made money for a long time and usually rely on Finance kickbacks,aftermarket,used cars then make the cream from parts and service.

Dont you think if they did pay say 15k for a brand new Commodore that some dealers would advertise them for say 16k drive away.?I know I would and just clean up the market,relying on the huge numbers I would do and pump the finance etc.

[BENT_8]

Talking to a mate today, he tells me to expect big changes in March, back to 1 shift.

[SPK-250]

Yeah i, or we, at work thought as much coz we'll do the same thing if that does indeed happen

[vztrt]

According to a collegue that worked there during the VY days, they were getting worried back then about the market. So hate to think what the boys at the top are thinking now.

[homegrown]

Originally Posted by vztrt

According to a collegue that worked there during the VY days, they were getting worried back then about the market. So hate to think what the boys at the top are thinking now.

its funny you mention the top dogs because the ceo has retired, he was an australian with a huge passion for the plant. why hasn't anyone that deserves the spot replaced him yet. they're getting substitutes from the states and its basially a rotating position. its like they know something is up so they wont commit anyone to the job.

[vztrt]

Well look how long it took for Ford Oz to get someone decent at the top job.