Diesel or Petrol - Page 2

geckoGT · 18-03-2011, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

I don't think it's fair to compare a Turbo Diesel to a Petrol motor
Compare a Turbo Petrol (ie ecoboost) with a Turbo Diesel, now that's a real comparison

That is exactly the comparison I am making, 1.6L turbo petrol compared to a 2L turbo diesel. Quite a fair comparison considering the rest of the vehicle is the same.

Buntz · 18-03-2011, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Give Ecoboost a try, it might surprise you with diesel like torque and lots more horsepower....

The Barra 6 needs EcoBoost.

Franco Cozzo · 18-03-2011, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

The Barra 6 needs EcoBoost.

The Barra 6 should be diesel as well.

GTP owner · 18-03-2011, 04:10 PM

I would choose diesel over the petrol if all else is equal. They are becoming more popular - so resale is better. Just look at 4x4 to see that in action.
As for spare parts (such as the fuel pump), They should all be covered by warranty for at least 100,000km. So how long are you going to keep it?

I don't like the driving experience of diesels, but i prefer them in my daily cars. More reliable, further between services (the disco 4 is 24,000km between services!), and use less fuel.

Buntz · 18-03-2011, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Damo

The Barra 6 should be diesel as well.

I know right? BMW do it. How hard could it be?

phillyc · 18-03-2011, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Damo

The Barra 6 should be diesel as well.

Nearly was. Burela had a small team of engineers trying to do just that. I can only imagine the MASSIVE torque that it could've generated if left at 4.0L of capacity. Based off the outputs of the TDV6 2.7L in the new SZ Territory which has 140/440 add 50% and get 210kW/660Nm.

jpd80 · 18-03-2011, 04:52 PM

Last year, Ford Netherlands released Autogas versions of Fiesta, Focus Mondeo and C-Max,
if ever there was an opportunity to tap into alternate fuels in different vehicles, that would
appear to be a good starting point...

Buntz · 18-03-2011, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Nearly was. Burela had a small team of engineers trying to do just that. I can only imagine the MASSIVE torque that it could've generated if left at 4.0L of capacity. Based off the outputs of the TDV6 2.7L in the new SZ Territory which has 140/440 add 50% and get 210kW/660Nm.

I miss Burela. Hopefully he left Graziano a to do list.

If those estimated figures were accurate... it's be more powerful than BMW's 535d. And that's saying something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Last year, Ford Netherlands released Autogas versions of Fiesta, Focus Mondeo and C-Max,
if ever there was an opportunity to tap into alternate fuels in different vehicles, that would
appear to be a good starting point...

They'd be a hit here in Aus.

FGII-XR6 · 18-03-2011, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

The Barra 6 needs EcoBoost.

it already is the term "ecoboost is just a buzzword for getting more power out of a given engine size with a turbo so the XR6T is an ecoboost 6 because it gives V8 performance from a 6

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Diesel is better to drive, so much torque.

I'm a diesel convert, don't think I can go back to petrol engines after this.

It really depend on what you are looking for some people like the characteristics of a TD others prefer the characteristics of a petrol engine. they are two different types of engines with different characteristics so really one isn't better than the other as such it's just one is better in the eyes of an individual

Buntz · 18-03-2011, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au3xr6

it already is the term "ecoboost is just a buzzword for getting more power out of a given engine size with a turbo so the XR6T is an ecoboost 6 because it gives V8 performance from a 6

It's not performance focused like the I6T is. EcoBoost uses lean burn techniques to always make sure that it always burns the least amount of fuel possible, with a greater air mix. But it also delivers great performance.

The EcoBoost uses a twin turbo setup so that it's burning more air than fuel throughout the entire rev range.

This is how I understand it anyway. I don't think EB even uses intercoolers.

FGII-XR6 · 18-03-2011, 05:26 PM

the ecoboost 4 will bring the 4 banger as close to 6 cylinder performance as the I6 turbo gets to V8 performance. just because the 4 won't be a tyre shreading monster doesn't mean the comparison is wrong. the I6 turbo is a more economical way to get the power levels of a larger engine does that sound like what they are looking to acheive with the ecoboost?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

It's not performance focused like the I6T is. EcoBoost uses lean burn techniques to always make sure that it always burns the least amount of fuel possible, with a greater air mix. But it also delivers great performance.

The EcoBoost uses a twin turbo setup so that it's burning more air than fuel throughout the entire rev range.

This is how I understand it anyway. I don't think EB even uses intercoolers.

Buntz · 18-03-2011, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au3xr6

the ecoboost 4 will bring the 4 banger as close to 6 cylinder performance as the I6 turbo gets to V8 performance. just because the 4 won't be a tyre shreading monster doesn't mean the comparison is wrong. the I6 turbo is a more economical way to get the power levels of a larger engine does that sound like what they are looking to acheive with the ecoboost?

It wasn't really. The I6T came in when V8 Fairmont's, and LWB Fairlanes were being made. Just another performance addition to the lineup. Plus it doesn't really add bring as good a fuel efficiency because it's not EcoBoost tuned. You need direct injection and twin turbos, or a twin scroll.

EcoBoost is more than just clapping out a small engine.

FGII-XR6 · 18-03-2011, 06:09 PM

we'll have to agree to dissagree

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

It wasn't really. The I6T came in when V8 Fairmont's, and LWB Fairlanes were being made. Just another performance addition to the lineup. Plus it doesn't really add bring as good a fuel efficiency because it's not EcoBoost tuned. You need direct injection and twin turbos, or a twin scroll.

EcoBoost is more than just clapping out a small engine.

Buntz · 18-03-2011, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by au3xr6

we'll have to agree to dissagree

Agreed.

**DJM83** · 18-03-2011, 06:26 PM

This thread has nothing to do with the Ecoboost motor thanks.

I must admit Lynton those Minis have some poke i had some fun this arvo with one, although not as quick as my focus it went pretty good (Cooper S)

mik · 18-03-2011, 09:04 PM

just looked up 2.0l t deisel and found approximate serviceing cost on a peugot, how would that compare to the equivelent petrol?

Warranty: three-year / 100,000km warranty. Diesel particulate filter is included under warranty, and must be changed at 160,000km.
Service costs: Service intervals are every 12 months or 20,000km. Minor services are priced at $475, major services at $761.

a link to the page...
http://www.themotorreport.com.au/512...ad-test-review

blueoval · 18-03-2011, 11:15 PM

Interesting stats mik. Cheers for that info. This will help me also when it comes to me purchasing my little TD powered car.

gz1 · 18-03-2011, 11:17 PM

Diesels are not all the same. There is a huge difference in service requirements, economy, and service costs between different makes and models.
I have a Diesel cruze auto bought new approx 3 months ago, which is the first diesel car I have owned and now I am a diesel convert. I bought this as it was the cheapest diesel with decent trim and safety levels just to "dip the toes in the diesel" so to say and see if liked the concept. And because diesel Teritory was not available at the time.
I don't think I would go back to petrol now. Largely because now I can do Sydney - Canberra - Sydney on <35 litres without having to drive like a grandma, and partly because of the way it drives with the large amounts of low down torque.
Only shortcoming is the massive turbo lag, (0-100 time of 12 secs 8 of which are spent getting 0-5, at least that's what it feels like not real figures.)
The diesel rattle is distinctive at first, however I have grown used to it and now find it quite likeable.
The service intervals are every 15,000 k's and it has not had it's first service yet, so I can't say what the costs are, however looking at standard pricing I don't expect it will be more than an equivalent petrol car. Beware of some diesels that require service every 5,000 k's as that could get expensive.
The Diesel particulate filter is self cleaning and has a lifetime warranty, whatever lifetime means. (By usual definitions when it breaks its dead so its the end of it's life and hence out of warranty.)

Matty4 · 19-03-2011, 09:04 AM

You should PM mowog
He has one of each type of Mini you are contemplating

chevypower · 19-03-2011, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

I know right? BMW do it. How hard could it be?

Thanks Clarkson!

Franco Cozzo · 19-03-2011, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gz1

Diesels are not all the same. There is a huge difference in service requirements, economy, and service costs between different makes and models.
I have a Diesel cruze auto bought new approx 3 months ago, which is the first diesel car I have owned and now I am a diesel convert. I bought this as it was the cheapest diesel with decent trim and safety levels just to "dip the toes in the diesel" so to say and see if liked the concept. And because diesel Teritory was not available at the time.
I don't think I would go back to petrol now. Largely because now I can do Sydney - Canberra - Sydney on <35 litres without having to drive like a grandma, and partly because of the way it drives with the large amounts of low down torque.
Only shortcoming is the massive turbo lag, (0-100 time of 12 secs 8 of which are spent getting 0-5, at least that's what it feels like not real figures.)
The diesel rattle is distinctive at first, however I have grown used to it and now find it quite likeable.
The service intervals are every 15,000 k's and it has not had it's first service yet, so I can't say what the costs are, however looking at standard pricing I don't expect it will be more than an equivalent petrol car. Beware of some diesels that require service every 5,000 k's as that could get expensive.
The Diesel particulate filter is self cleaning and has a lifetime warranty, whatever lifetime means. (By usual definitions when it breaks its dead so its the end of it's life and hence out of warranty.)

Yep, my Focus is a diesel as well, first time, its great how they drive. I'm staying diesel I reckon, something like a TDV6 in a small car would be great.

**buggerlugs** · 19-03-2011, 10:59 AM

Have 4 turbo diesels in the family now. 3.2lt Pajero and 3.2ltTriton, 2.2lt Mercedes Sprinter Van and 4.9lt Mitsubishi Canter Light Truck. Love them all. Normally off load after 5-6 years or 150,000ks other than the sprinter. Servicing is a piece of cake. Do the lot myself. Sprinter has done 494,000ks. In it's life it's done an injector and a clutch...................... I rest my case......

geckoGT · 19-03-2011, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty4

You should PM mowog
He has one of each type of Mini you are contemplating

Are you sure he has countryman, it was only released 2 weeks ago and there is a 3 month wait on delivery. I think he probably has Cooper hatch, which would still be very interesting for comparison as Cooper s has a 1.6 turbo petrol and Cooper d has a 1.6 turbo diesel. I have not driven Cooper d but I have driven the BMW 120d and it was quite impressive, especially the in gear acceleration.

Personlly I like the idea of the diesel but the cost is my hang up, it has to be the best option from a cost perspective for me.