LPG, The End!!

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by TMC

Companies like Kia are taking sales away. Friends of ours always drove Falcon wagons and then fitted them with LPG. It came time for an upgrade recently. No Falcon wagon. Let's take a look at diesel Territory then. Too expensive. Bought a diesel Kia Sorrento (More power and torque than Territory and from a 2.2TDi 4 cyl). I think a lot are going down this sort of route.

I know someone looking at getting a new car on novated lease, he'd love an XR6 but the resale value after 3 years is the deal breaker!

[prydey]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

I know someone looking at getting a new car on novated lease, he'd love an XR6 but the resale value after 3 years is the deal breaker!

personally i think this is a cop out. resale is actually pretty good on falcon, esp xr6.

[mike_nofx]

To go into more detail, (I know very little of novated leases) apparently once 3 years is up you have the option to buy out the vehicle at 50% of the new cost. I believe this figure doesn't change for cars with varying resale values.

Anyway a guy I work with is looking at a car to lease for 3 years, buy out at 50% of original price, sell the car at a higher price than the buy out (where a high resale matters) pocket a few $$ and take out a new novate lease, with the profit dollars going towards new lease repayments.

The problem with a falcon lies in that the 50% buy out after 3 years maybe higher than or identical to, actual value of a 3 year old falcon.

As far as resale values go, Falcons would have to be the worst.

As I said, I know little to none on novated leases, I'm letting my work mate do the research and if the figures add up I may also take out a novated lease.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

As far as resale values go, Falcons would have to be the worst.

don't agree. new falcons are available from $33k drive away. a 2009 FG xr6 with average km is still fetching $18k+, with many closer to $20k. that puts resale at 55-60%. as far as resale goes, that is pretty good for most cars.

[2011G6E]

When they can export gas in bulk to overseas countries for cents a liter, it's criminal the amount they force the public in the place it's produced. At least in countries that produce oil they look after their own public first and charge bugger all for petrol...

[prydey]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

When they can export gas in bulk to overseas countries for cents a liter, it's criminal the amount they force the public in the place it's produced. At least in countries that produce oil they look after their own public first and charge bugger all for petrol...

cng?? not lpg.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by prydey

don't agree. new falcons are available from $33k drive away. a 2009 FG xr6 with average km is still fetching $18k+, with many closer to $20k. that puts resale at 55-60%. as far as resale goes, that is pretty good for most cars.

Here's an article, a few months out of date yes but it actually singles out XR6 as one of the worst for resale

http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and..._your_next_car

[Ducati888]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

To go into more detail, (I know very little of novated leases) apparently once 3 years is up you have the option to buy out the vehicle at 50% of the new cost. I believe this figure doesn't change for cars with varying resale values.

Anyway a guy I work with is looking at a car to lease for 3 years, buy out at 50% of original price, sell the car at a higher price than the buy out (where a high resale matters) pocket a few $$ and take out a new novate lease, with the profit dollars going towards new lease repayments.

The problem with a falcon lies in that the 50% buy out after 3 years maybe higher than or identical to, actual value of a 3 year old falcon.

As far as resale values go, Falcons would have to be the worst.

As I said, I know little to none on novated leases, I'm letting my work mate do the research and if the figures add up I may also take out a novated lease.

That's mostly correct, but the 'balloon payment' is variable based on the length of the lease and the car you end up with. You can lease for two to five years if you want. The balloon payment at the end may well be less than the car's market value, but it may be more as well. If you make a profit, any extra is taxable. The way around that is to sell/trade the vehicle at the balloon payment level have the dealer take the balance off the price of the new vehicle as a 'discount'. Then the new lease will start at a lower price, with lower payments per month.

One other thing to remember is that just because you can lease a car, doesn't necessarily make it good value or expedient to do so. That's an indiviual's choice.

[FacultY]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

I know someone looking at getting a new car on novated lease, he'd love an XR6 but the resale value after 3 years is the deal breaker!

XR6 holds their value pretty well, its the XT's which struggle to get 15k after 3 years.

[Ducati888]

I wonder if that will be the case moving on though. The poverty pack Falcons & Commodores used to the be the cars of choice for fleets, and three years later they were sold through auction houses at pretty low prices (although big fleets got pretty hefty discounts on them in the first place). Now that the trend is away from the big family 6, and hence there are far fewer available at the end of the three year period, maybe resale values will hold up a bit better.

Just a thought.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Here's an article, a few months out of date yes but it actually singles out XR6 as one of the worst for resale

http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and..._your_next_car

the problem with glass's guide and redbook etc is they base it on the inflated RRP prices. RRP for FG XR6 used to be nearly $45k, even though actual sale prices were around $37k. currently rrp is still around $40k and yet actual advertised sale price for new is as low as $33k.

real world resale is much much better than that 37% they claim. like i said, its over 50% real world.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Ducati888

That's mostly correct, but the 'balloon payment' is variable based on the length of the lease and the car you end up with. You can lease for two to five years if you want. The balloon payment at the end may well be less than the car's market value, but it may be more as well. If you make a profit, any extra is taxable. The way around that is to sell/trade the vehicle at the balloon payment level have the dealer take the balance off the price of the new vehicle as a 'discount'. Then the new lease will start at a lower price, with lower payments per month.

One other thing to remember is that just because you can lease a car, doesn't necessarily make it good value or expedient to do so. That's an indiviual's choice.

The other thing to remember is FBT is based on the purchase price and that initial value cannot be changed until after the fourth year.
So a four year old novated lease vehicle attracts the same amount of FBT as it did when new - doesn't seem right hey.

I wonder if leasing a two year old vehicle is becoming more attractive to people rather than a new vehicle
as the purchase price would be much lower to begin with but the vehicle still drives like new..

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

I know someone looking at getting a new car on novated lease, he'd love an XR6 but the resale value after 3 years is the deal breaker!

tell him to buy a 1 year old one from a dealer , and lease that .

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

To go into more detail, (I know very little of novated leases) apparently once 3 years is up you have the option to buy out the vehicle at 50% of the new cost. I believe this figure doesn't change for cars with varying resale values.

Anyway a guy I work with is looking at a car to lease for 3 years, buy out at 50% of original price, sell the car at a higher price than the buy out (where a high resale matters) pocket a few $$ and take out a new novate lease, with the profit dollars going towards new lease repayments.

The problem with a falcon lies in that the 50% buy out after 3 years maybe higher than or identical to, actual value of a 3 year old falcon.

As far as resale values go, Falcons would have to be the worst.

As I said, I know little to none on novated leases, I'm letting my work mate do the research and if the figures add up I may also take out a novated lease.

that methos works if it can be done . good luck . most cars are considered old now at 5 years and nobody wants one . so at 3 years old everyone wants a bargain , go to a dealer and have a look at 2 and 3 year old cars and see what your mate will be competing with .

[Dave3911]

Originally Posted by graham7773

dave 3911, I'm not very sure what you are talking about but both the VT Commodore and the AU Falcon had anLPG option. My brother owned cabs even earlier than those and had LPG fitted from new. I am sure that the cab pack options installed on the models I mentioned included LPG systems

Um.... I think your a bit confused. I never said anything about previous models, nor is it relevant to talk about them. You couldn't buy a brand new AU Falcon or VT Commodore in 2011. So it's impossible to count them in new car stats for 2011..

My point was that nobody had any BRAND NEW FROM FACTORY on sale for the majority of 2011 as holden was waiting on their new LPG system (just released) and Ford didn't release EcoLPI until the end of the year. So surely that accounts for the drop in sales - rather than the LPG dooms day that the article is suggesting.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by prydey

don't agree. new falcons are available from $33k drive away. a 2009 FG xr6 with average km is still fetching $18k+, with many closer to $20k. that puts resale at 55-60%. as far as resale goes, that is pretty good for most cars.

I think he's looking at depreciation in terms of actual dollars lost which puts the figure at $12,000 to $15,000
Now compare that with a $20,000 I-4, after three years they're worth $12,000 to $14,000 so the depreciation in lost
dollars is $6,000 to $8,000, remembering that as a leasee, this is the money you are burning on payments and interest.

[RASER]

[quote=prydey]the problem with glass's guide and redbook etc is they DON'T BUY CARS, dealers and wholesalers do.[/quote]

FIXED