Idle-stop starter motors...life span?

[ryeman]

How do you achieve lifetime economy if the starter motor gets a hammering or is there something completely different in the system?

[mik]

I guess your reffering to wearing items on the motor as it up and runs from a dead stop? Starter, bearings, etc?

[ryeman]

Originally Posted by mik

I guess your reffering to wearing items on the motor as it up and runs from a dead stop? Starter, bearings, etc?

Yeah, I'm inclined to think its just not worth the hassle unless they have reinvented the normal starting system. I would have thought ring gear wear would be a significant problem not to mention the starter pinion etc.

[GT2]

Most are getting away from using the starter.
They detect which cylinder is pressurised, inject fuel, and ignite.

[ryeman]

How long would the pressure last sufficient to start?
And would the life span of that system be compromised by engine wear?

[GT2]

Originally Posted by ryeman

How long would the pressure last sufficient to start?
And would the life span of that system be compromised by engine wear?

Not sure, but that's how Mazda do it.
The other way is with windings around the flywheel surrounded by magnets.
The flywheel becomes the starter so to speak.

Originally Posted by Bluehoon

One has to ask why we dropped and flooded our markets and they protect theirs. Surely...

[mik]

You would think they would need an electric oil pump or something for the engine bearings wouldn't you? Firing the engine up loaded with no oil pressure for for a second or two you would think cause accelerated wear on them? Or is there a delay before moving off?

[Mickxr8]

For what gain ? , fuel economy ? , kinda hoped this was banned when it 1st came out yrs ago , picture a person waiting to turn into traffic on a busy highway , gap appears , nail it , nothing happens for a second then you launch into the highway too late and get creamed . only gonna get worse as driving skills keep getting dumbed down .
Just my 2c

[baboon]

Audi A1?

[nb_351]

I can't see the benefit of it
What's going to happen when the system starts getting gremlins and won't start, or tries to start in gear of people leave their car in gear when it switches off
More of a pain paying for that stuff than the 1% of fuel economy it's going to save

[K93George]

Quick research indicates the only part to suffer measurable wear is the battery. Some of the systems such as the one Mazda incorporates don't even use the starter motor. Cars utilising the Start-stop system also run an electrical motor to power the accessories as the engine will be switched off. The delay is estimated to be "a fraction of a second" for petrol engines, this however doesn't apply to hybrids which have no delay.

Manual transmissions engage the system by having the car stopped and the clutch depressed, the gear lever put into neutral, the clutch is then released and the engine stops. "The engine won't stop if the car is moving, even if the aforementioned steps are followed. The engine restarts when the clutch is depressed prior to selecting a gear to move the car."

Considering my Falcon at its best consumes 0.9lt per hour at idle it would presumably take an entire 1 hour of idling to save 1lt of fuel with this system. No doubt the initial take off is what uses the most fuel, not the idle. What I'm getting at is an electric motor for take off is far greater then a Start-stop option but I'll gladly accept any proven innovation that works like this Start-stop system.

[ryeman]

I can see it giving the ever so desirable placard consumption figure, but in the real world of actual lifetime ownership will it significantly save the owner money after taking into account initial and repair/service costs not to mention potential ecu issues that may result..
Great in a lab but in the real world of ownership?

[mash again]

didnt like it in the old golf buggy i was driving!

[baboon]

"lifetime of the starter motor" economy...

[UKXR8]

My wife's company car, a Passat has the stop-start system in it, very clever. The stop start won't work if the car is left in gear. Only takes as long as it takes to depress the clutch pedal to start the engine again.
Not sure how much fuel it saves, but so far the car has done over 60,000 miles and there have been no issues with it whatsoever, still on original battery etc.
It does take a bit of getting used to though!

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by GT2

Most are getting away from using the starter.
They detect which cylinder is pressurised, inject fuel, and ignite.

Which vehicles use this system??

[ryeman]

That's not going to work after 5 mins at a rail crossing !

[Resurrection]

[flash]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfxLexBzcqw[/flash]

[GT2]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Which vehicles use this system??

Mazda

Originally Posted by prasac

Cops are Tops NA it's not that huge a pickup but u will definitely notice it that's for sure.



what trans oil do the BTR use?

Originally Posted by Neale

I've driven the XR5 mondeo, awsome!! & that sound mmmm

I would buy one over a Falcon if I needed a bigger car.

The next gen Mondeo will be more of a global car being sold as the Fusion in the states. I can see the day when the Mondeo/Fusion will also replace the Falcon if you look at Fords history with the Fiesta & Focus going to a global platform.

[ryeman]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

[flash]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfxLexBzcqw[/flash]

Do they use a pressure accumulator ?

[flappist]

http://www.howstuffworks.com/fuel-ef...top-system.htm

[ryeman]

But they don't explain how pressure is maintained over time particularly with inevitable wear. An accumulator would do it I guess .

[last fairlane]

Like GT said that the Mazda uses one preasurised cylinder then fuels and sparks it and it fires
well guess what Ford had that system back in 1916
it was called the T model Ford and you could adjust the timing handle
and if it was in the right spot the motor would fire
so nothing really new just re invented using computers and such

[Elks]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Which vehicles use this system??

Originally Posted by Cruzycuzz

You've got a blower I guess the AMG doesn't stand much of a chance?

Benz use it extensively. It's in most of the diesel models and, Most new or revised models have it including the bi turbo ML63, CLS63 and forthcoming E63.

You do get use to it, but it thankfully does have an override switch. The worst part is you lose all your boost pressure so even when it restarts, it's in lethargic mode. I've driven it extensively and I hate it.

[Elks]

Originally Posted by Mickxr8

For what gain ? , fuel economy ? , kinda hoped this was banned when it 1st came out yrs ago , picture a person waiting to turn into traffic on a busy highway , gap appears , nail it , nothing happens for a second then you launch into the highway too late and get creamed . only gonna get worse as driving skills keep getting dumbed down .
Just my 2c

Yep, that's exactly how it works. Two years later, It still scares the crap out of me daily.