Australia's auto industry: from military paranoia to dreams of modernity

[KIWI-1]

American, Japanese, British and even European auto companies once made cars in Australia. There was a moment at which it even made sense to design a car just for the Australian market. But as Keri Phillips reports for Rear Vision, the industry, built on government subsidy and protection from competition, has fallen on tough times.

In May this year, Ford announced it would close its Australian operation in 2016. In June, one of the two remaining car makers, Holden, signalled that its workers would have to take a pay cut or risk their company following suit. In the last 12 years, Australia's three car makers—Ford, Holden and Toyota—have been given over $4 billion by state and federal governments. Yet it still seems to be an industry on life support.

John Perkins, author of Wheels and Deals: The automotive industry in 20th century Australia, says that government involvement from the very beginning made the car industry here inefficient and uncompetitive.

Rest of article is at:
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/...-myths/4808616

[Wretched]

...‘I believe that the assets in the Australian automotive industry are not nearly as uncompetitive as people think they are... [T]heir owners have no real strategic role for them in their world plans. I have argued for many years now that we should say to these companies; there is no more money for you unless you can team up with someone and give us some real confidence that you're trying to develop an Australian world car, that you're trying to give the Australian assets a credible footprint in your global operations.'

And that is how it should be, to get the money they need to show some real reasoning behind it.

[Raptor]

American, Japanese, British and even European auto companies once made cars in Australia....

I think that's the problem right there, and something the govt could have addressed.

There never was an Australian auto company making a car with global ambitions free from overseas parent company agendas.

Imagine that instead of Holden & Ford competing over the dwindling scraps of the local large car (& ute) market their resources had been pooled. This company then could have developed a Falcodore™ for local and overseas markets and competed instead with Toyota, VW, Mazda, BMW, MB etc etc.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Wretched

And that is how it should be, to get the money they need to show some real reasoning behind it.

Every dollar had to be accounted for. Also there needed to be a 3 in 1 investment. They have been knocked back in subsidies in the past.

Why aren't people up in arms when the mining industry don't pay tax on the fuel they use?

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by vztrt

Every dollar had to be accounted for. Also there needed to be a 3 in 1 investment. They have been knocked back in subsidies in the past.

Why aren't people up in arms when the mining industry don't pay tax on the fuel they use?

I can't see the comparison with the mining industry, all industries are subsidised in someway. But if you want to compare how much does the mining industry generate in terms of revenue back to the government vs the subsidies it receives?

The issue is the automotive industry here has done pretty much SFA over the last decade or two. The companies have shrunk, their manufacturing base has shrunk but want more $$ and for what? What are they really doing to "earn" those dollars? Where are their export deals, how are they innovating, what are they doing to expand markets and arrest the slide in sales or do they still want the same amount of money for a smaller amount of cars being manufactured?

The list goes on.

[karj]

Originally Posted by Raptor

I think that's the problem right there, and something the govt could have addressed.

There never was an Australian auto company making a car with global ambitions free from overseas parent company agendas.

Imagine that instead of Holden & Ford competing over the dwindling scraps of the local large car (& ute) market their resources had been pooled. This company then could have developed a Falcodore™ for local and overseas markets and competed instead with Toyota, VW, Mazda, BMW, MB etc etc.

Following in that line of thought... if Holden were to announce cessation of local manufacturing, could a business case be established for an auto company that is government owned (like Telecom, NBNCo, Aus Post)? We would already have a workforce with the necessary skills/training, and much of the infrastructure could be acquired through negotiation of the sale of assets from Ford & Holden shutdowns.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by karj

Following in that line of thought... if Holden were to announce cessation of local manufacturing, could a business case be established for an auto company that is government owned (like Telecom, NBNCo, Aus Post)?

Only if you want to buy your 'new' BF Falcon for $90k when it's ready next year?

The NBN Co last year released a revised corporate plan which admitted to a $1.5 billion cost blowout in the capital cost - to $37.4 billion - with a total cost to taxpayers of $44.1 billion.

The document also estimated the current 50 per cent delay to the schedule if continued would mean it would not be completed until 2025 - a delay of four years.

[big_landau]

don't give them money buy there cars, opps its too late.must have been too hard for the government to work that one out.i guess when Australians want to buy rubbish chinese cars this is what happens, australians simply don't support themselves or there country like others.
fast forward 10 years and lets see how many burnt out unrepairable little shittters are out there,maybe then people will want a quality built car that's actually comfortable and reliable, wait you wont be able to buy one.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by vztrt

Every dollar had to be accounted for. Also there needed to be a 3 in 1 investment. They have been knocked back in subsidies in the past.

Why aren't people up in arms when the mining industry don't pay tax on the fuel they use?

I have the Sydney harbour bridge for sale, would you like to buy it. Holden got $160 million from the feds and state government's because they said they were putting in $450 million of their own money to build the cruze here. There is no way $600 odd million was spent here to make the cruze (for a car that was already being made somewhere else at the time).

[fte50]

Irrespective of where or how many times over its been made elsewhere, what do you imagine the cost of setting up a complete dedicated production line for Cruze would cost - 600 bucks ???

[Lotte]

Errrmmm.... Startup production costs can be bloody high.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by fte50

Irrespective of where or how many times over its been made elsewhere, what do you imagine the cost of setting up a complete dedicated production line for Cruze would cost - 600 bucks ???

How much did it cost us per Cruze produced?

[mik]

just my opinion of course, bit i think you have to take into account, politicians decided to put Australia at the bottom of the competitive ladder with the "fair trade agreement",
they have continued to destroy manufacturing by loading our businesses with lead weights around their ankles with higher costs and flooding cheap imports at every opportunity, while in public they cry crocodile tears and give out a few poultry hand outs,
the fact is as plain as the nose on your face manufacturing is the sacrificial lamb, our politicians made an agreement with united nations ..............or what's the other name? "the new world order" to give 3rd world countries a business advantage over Australia, this was done in the 70's and signed off by politicians from both major parties without the voters consent , it is all documented , and it is still happening.
Don't expect any meaningful change from our politicians other than the usual rhetoric "oh you have to become more efficient" in front of the public, if our manufacturing came up with a magic doorway to pump out a profitable item, a falcon, commodore, a steel girder, alloy ingot, etc,etc, the powers that be would find a way too to knoble the **** out of it.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by mik

just my opinion of course, bit i think you have to take into account, politicians decided to put Australia at the bottom of the competitive ladder with the "fair trade agreement"

We all know that the TAFTA removed tariffs on imports. What did it do for exports?

[fte50]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

How much did it cost us per Cruze produced?

Don't know Holden's pricing - even though im entitled to my 30% discount I choose to drive Fords.

[fte50]

Originally Posted by mik

just my opinion of course, bit i think you have to take into account, politicians decided to put Australia at the bottom of the competitive ladder with the "fair trade agreement",
they have continued to destroy manufacturing by loading our businesses with lead weights around their ankles with higher costs and flooding cheap imports at every opportunity, while in public they cry crocodile tears and give out a few poultry hand outs,
the fact is as plain as the nose on your face manufacturing is the sacrificial lamb, our politicians made an agreement with united nations ..............or what's the other name? "the new world order" to give 3rd world countries a business advantage over Australia, this was done in the 70's and signed off by politicians from both major parties without the voters consent , it is all documented , and it is still happening.
Don't expect any meaningful change from our politicians other than the usual rhetoric "oh you have to become more efficient" in front of the public, if our manufacturing came up with a magic doorway to pump out a profitable item, a falcon, commodore, a steel girder, alloy ingot, etc,etc, the powers that be would find a way too to knoble the **** out of it.

That is as plain, real and factual as it gets. Unfortunately many folks don't believe we live in a lie, they know better, they know the truth - they watch reality tv.

[Struggo]

Originally Posted by mik

just my opinion of course, bit i think you have to take into account, politicians decided to put Australia at the bottom of the competitive ladder with the "fair trade agreement",
they have continued to destroy manufacturing by loading our businesses with lead weights around their ankles with higher costs and flooding cheap imports at every opportunity, while in public they cry crocodile tears and give out a few poultry hand outs,
the fact is as plain as the nose on your face manufacturing is the sacrificial lamb, our politicians made an agreement with united nations ..............or what's the other name? "the new world order" to give 3rd world countries a business advantage over Australia, this was done in the 70's and signed off by politicians from both major parties without the voters consent , it is all documented , and it is still happening.
Don't expect any meaningful change from our politicians other than the usual rhetoric "oh you have to become more efficient" in front of the public, if our manufacturing came up with a magic doorway to pump out a profitable item, a falcon, commodore, a steel girder, alloy ingot, etc,etc, the powers that be would find a way too to knoble the **** out of it.

Spot on.

For those whom are unaware check out, The Lima Agreement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Lima

http://fairdinkumradio.com/?q=node/20

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPnKJUu07rE

http://austeaparty.com.au/web/lima-declaration/

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by Wretched

And that is how it should be, to get the money they need to show some real reasoning behind it.

The Automotive sector has returned more to the Government then has been invested. Far more. They don't need to justify any money taken on that account, but it would be good to see more money get invested to get a higher more secure output that a world vehicle would bring.

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

But as Keri Phillips reports for Rear Vision, the industry, built on government subsidy and protection from competition, has fallen on tough times.

Oh really Keri Phillips? Because to anyone with half a brain who has looked into the issues facing the Australian Automotive industry, it can be plainly seen that they haven't so much as been protected, as they have been stripped naked and thrown headlong at the competition - to speak metaphorically.

But lets not talk facts, that's not what journalism is nowadays. In today's world it is simply another packaged product, made appealing (not factual), manufactured, marketed, and sold. A vehicle to put advertisements in our hands which make money. The ABC should really know better.