FGX turbo police cars no longer have Brembos brakes

[b2tf]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

If these Brembos are so good and so expensive why don't the Cops swap them over for the standard brakes when they get their new pursuit cars?

Cops dont swing spanners and easier to just get rid of one car for a brand newy when the time comes.

[cycle myth]

I think:

Qld use standard brake package
NSW get brembo
Vic use standard brakes with upgraded pads

[joe8s]

How are NSW roads any more special than QLD and Vic

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by b2tf

Cops dont swing spanners and easier to just get rid of one car for a brand newy when the time comes.

I realise Cops dont swing spanners but they either have their own workshops or garages that do their service work.If Brembos cost a few thousand dollars it would be very economical to pay 3-4 hrs labour to have them swapped over.

[Blem]

Originally Posted by Bluey-GT

Standard brakes work perfectly well and are safe for safe driving. Start pushing the limits ( high speed pursuit or track work or consistent spirited driving ) and the standard brakes cook , they get spongy and their performance drops off dramatically. High performance brakes address these deficiencies for those that require it. Brembo brakes are an excellent piece of kit. Combined with good rotors , braided lines and high boiling point fluid , you can be confident that your brakes will not let you down whatever you do.

Equipping the HWP cars with big brakes might be expensive but IMHO I'd be $&)(:; my self driving at high speeds in our Falcons without em. You don't need em on the rear , but the front is a MUST have.

Just for what it's worth I've just flushed my brake fluid again for the 4th time in 60k. I've done about 15 track days in that period & have gone through 2 front rotors & now have 2 sets that I rotate between using & machining. Rears are still good in mm.
There is not a lot of difference in wet boiling temps between 5.1 dot down to 3.1. From memory (I just did pads, rotors & fluid 2 weeks ago) with basic fluid it goes up 20degs celcius.
240c - 3.1
260c - 4.1
280c - 5.1
Having said that one manufacturer claims the same spec range for their race fluid 4.1 to suit 5.1...$13/500mls
Also saw fluid for $60/500mls. That will suck moisture & need to be replaced very, very regularly.

[Revolver]

How do you even find them on carsales?

Did a search for Ford falcon FGX, with searched keyword as "Police", "Highway", "Patrol", "Highway Patrol" and nothing. Bubkis.

[Bluehoon]

Originally Posted by Revolver

How do you even find them on carsales?

Did a search for Ford falcon FGX, with searched keyword as "Police", "Highway", "Patrol", "Highway Patrol" and nothing. Bubkis.

Just search for XR6 Turbo's. Look at the rims.
If you see the BA 18" F6 rims and red calipers it's Ex Highway...

[AussieCJ7]

Originally Posted by Revolver

How do you even find them on carsales?

Did a search for Ford falcon FGX, with searched keyword as "Police", "Highway", "Patrol", "Highway Patrol" and nothing. Bubkis.

Just search for FGX XR Turbo and look at the pictures for the old F6 wheels

You can also filter out anything that is manual and any with the luxury pack (leather etc) as the police never take these options

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by joe8s

How are NSW roads any more special than QLD and Vic

As you're alluding to they're not. yet VIC seem to manage fine.

I think upgrading of brakes is legacy procedure for when the cars didn't have sufficient braking.

To go a bit Further there's no need for an FGX turbo or SS commodore.

Other countries seem to manage with base model cars & standard Brakes.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Bevsta007

As you're alluding to they're not. yet VIC seem to manage fine.

I think upgrading of brakes is legacy procedure for when the cars didn't have sufficient braking.

To go a bit Further there's no need for an FGX turbo or SS commodore.

Other countries seem to manage with base model cars & standard Brakes.

Yes- for standard accelerate to 130 kph and lights on and pull over fine.....

But high speed pursuit of a fast car- another matter....

Chasing a car to speeds of 200 kph and then stomping brakes to wash speed to 120 kph, accelerate to 200 kph, hard on brakes to lower speed, any pursuit with such high speeds standard brakes will not suffice. And neither will the brembo 4 pistons without pad upgrades....

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Yes- for standard accelerate to 130 kph and lights on and pull over fine.....

But high speed pursuit of a fast car- another matter....

Chasing a car to speeds of 200 kph and then stomping brakes to wash speed to 120 kph, accelerate to 200 kph, hard on brakes to lower speed, any pursuit with such high speeds standard brakes will not suffice. And neither will the brembo 4 pistons without pad upgrades....

Are you certain standard brakes cannot do this, with a pad upgrade?

besides how often do these 200KPH chases occur? pretty sure they pull out these days and let technology catch them.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Bevsta007

Are you certain standard brakes cannot do this, with a pad upgrade?

besides how often do these 200KPH chases occur? pretty sure they pull out these days and let technology catch them.

I do know from my experience that Brembo 4 pistons with standard pads brake fade bad in this scenario.

Standard brakes with upgraded pads- who knows, but standard brakes will not have the braking capacity of large discs and 4 piston brembos. Pulling out speed hard from 200 does not simply involve a linear double the energy involved when pulling from 100 kph.

Braking from 200 kph actually involves 4 times the kinetic energy one has when travelling at 100 kph....that's why one needs big discs and strong calipers with multiple pistons...

[Trump]

Originally Posted by asagaai

I do know from my experience that Brembo 4 pistons with standard pads brake fade bad in this scenario.

Standard brakes with upgraded pads- who knows, but standard brakes will not have the braking capacity of large discs and 4 piston brembos. Pulling out speed hard from 200 does not simply involve a linear double the energy involved when pulling from 100 kph....

My FG XR6T had DBA4000's (T3) rotors, Ferodo DS pads and braided lines, it had stopping power like no other Falcon short of a Brembo 6/4 FPV. Repeated stops to stationary from ludicrous speed (on private roads and yes it was a Spaceballs reference ) didn't induce any fade and braking was consistently good.

I'm not sure about the rest of the country, but the police here won't engage pursuits anymore if the speed is over 140km/h (so I have been told).

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by joe8s

How are NSW roads any more special than QLD and Vic

NSW police have a stricter brake test than the other states.

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

I realise Cops dont swing spanners but they either have their own workshops or garages that do their service work.If Brembos cost a few thousand dollars it would be very economical to pay 3-4 hrs labour to have them swapped over.

I know the SS police cars in my area get serviced at the local Holden dealer. The police don't service them themselves.

[joe8s]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Yes- for standard accelerate to 130 kph and lights on and pull over fine.....

But high speed pursuit of a fast car- another matter....

Chasing a car to speeds of 200 kph and then stomping brakes to wash speed to 120 kph, accelerate to 200 kph, hard on brakes to lower speed, any pursuit with such high speeds standard brakes will not suffice. And neither will the brembo 4 pistons without pad upgrades....

Police shouldn't be driving at speeds of 200kms on public roads endangering the safety of the public

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by joe8s

Police shouldn't be driving at speeds of 200kms on public roads endangering the safety of the public

Simple traffic offence - you probably right.

But chasing a violent offender who is armed and will be a danger to community- well that is debatable...

[Whitey-AMG]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

My FG XR6T had DBA4000's (T3) rotors, Ferodo DS pads and braided lines, it had stopping power like no other Falcon short of a Brembo 6/4 FPV. Repeated stops to stationary from ludicrous speed (on private roads and yes it was a Spaceballs reference ) didn't induce any fade and braking was consistently good.

I'm not sure about the rest of the country, but the police here won't engage pursuits anymore if the speed is over 140km/h (so I have been told).

Its the swept area available from the larger rotors coupled withbthe additional clamping force of the multiple piston calipers thats a big favtor as well. Braking distances are dramatically reduced. Add that to the advantage of less fade and the bigger brakes are a much better performance and safety proposition in normal and spirited driving.
Falcons are very heavy and its only in an emergency stop situation that you realise what 5 extra metres really means.
Id fork out for bigger and better brakes and tyres over other mods on the car every single time.... no brainer.

[joe8s]

Originally Posted by joe8s

Police shouldn't be driving at speeds of 200kms on public roads endangering the safety of the public

Originally Posted by asagaai

Simple traffic offence - you probably right.

But chasing a violent offender who is armed and will be a danger to community- well that is debatable...

I'm not being a smart *** here but ...
I'm Just wondering if you still consider it "debatable" if a high speed police car or the idiot that they are chasing hit and killed a family member of yours ..... would you still think that????

[Trump]

Originally Posted by Bluey-GT

Its the swept area available from the larger rotors coupled withbthe additional clamping force of the multiple piston calipers thats a big favtor as well. Braking distances are dramatically reduced. Add that to the advantage of less fade and the bigger brakes are a much better performance and safety proposition in normal and spirited driving.
Falcons are very heavy and its only in an emergency stop situation that you realise what 5 extra metres really means.
Id fork out for bigger and better brakes and tyres over other mods on the car every single time.... no brainer.

Agreed, however a stock Brembo setup (OEM rotors and pads, non-braided lines) will not be as effective during heavy braking as an FG with a setup as I had. Put on some DBA's, Ferodo's and braided lines and there's another four metres gained in stopping distance.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by joe8s

I'm not being a smart *** here but ...
I'm Just wondering if you still consider it "debatable" if a high speed police car or the idiot that they are chasing hit and killed a family member of yours ..... would you still think that????

Hey joe8s

You are not being a smart *** - is a real issue and ought be debated...

Likewise- would it be debatable if police called off a chase of a killer, or a terror suspect, who subsequently went and blew away innocents- what would their family think of the police calling it off, with the flipside argument that had the police pursued and apprehended- then the crim would have been stopped and lives saved.

But- myself- I personally am not in favour of police engaging in high speed car chases unless there is some exceptional circumstance involved, ie if police were on the tail of some terrorist who had blown up a bomb or on the tail of a serial killer like Milat- I would hope that they would not call off the chase- and would hope they were in a performance car with decent brakes..

But for 95% of the cases generally I agree with you- technology and passive aggressive model is better employed......

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by cycle myth

I think:

Qld use standard brake package
NSW get brembo
Vic use standard brakes with upgraded pads

Surely every police car has upgraded pads, regardless of general duties or HWP.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

Agreed, however a stock Brembo setup (OEM rotors and pads, non-braided lines) will not be as effective during heavy braking as an FG with a setup as I had. Put on some DBA's, Ferodo's and braided lines and there's another four metres gained in stopping distance.

Are the DBAs and Ferodos better than the kit rotors and pads that come with the 4 piston Brembo set up?

[Trump]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Are the DBAs and Ferodos better than the kit rotors and pads that come with the 4 piston Brembo set up?

It's chalk and chese. The only negative of the DBA/Ferodo combo is increased brake dust. The wheels are filthy after a couple of weeks.

[GO FURTHER]

I have the DBA T2's slotted rotors on the front of my XR6T and Bendix Ultimates on all four wheels. It's approximately a $600 upgrade if you do it yourself without the labour cost.
4/6 pot Brembos of course would be better, but $6,000 is alot to pay for the upgrade.
I can tell you, that it makes a massive difference over the stock rotors and pads.
Yes, the Ultimates are dusty, but I am of the opinion that if you want great stopping power and bite then you are going to have to put up with dusty pads.
The more abrasive the pad material surface is, the more dust you will get, they go hand in hand.
What I like about the Ultimate pads is unlike some other performance pads, they bite hard from cold... And that is what you need in a daily road car.
Pads that work best once you get some heat into them, are better suited for the track.

[cycle myth]

Originally Posted by FPV GTHO

Surely every police car has upgraded pads, regardless of general duties or HWP.

No.

Specification is subject to the direction of the customer.

Typically only HWP cars would get the attention.

[AussieCJ7]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Hey joe8s

You are not being a smart *** - is a real issue and ought be debated...

Likewise- would it be debatable if police called off a chase of a killer, or a terror suspect, who subsequently went and blew away innocents- what would their family think of the police calling it off, with the flipside argument that had the police pursued and apprehended- then the crim would have been stopped and lives saved.

But- myself- I personally am not in favour of police engaging in high speed car chases unless there is some exceptional circumstance involved, ie if police were on the tail of some terrorist who had blown up a bomb or on the tail of a serial killer like Milat- I would hope that they would not call off the chase- and would hope they were in a performance car with decent brakes..

But for 95% of the cases generally I agree with you- technology and passive aggressive model is better employed......

Actually i think a well publicized limit they wont chase over just encourages more idiots who think they will get away espec if stolen plates etc


Encouraging our cops to use there training and judgement of conditions collateral damage risk etc is much better option.


Also consider the amount of distance to catch up if a police car is traveling at signpost 100kph in one direction an some one doing 130 goes the other way, they actually need pretty sharp acceleration to close that distance we are not a small country our cops do need high speed capability.

The tree hugging do gooders that never leave the city struggle to comprehend but there is a place for highway patrol in fast cars just the same as 4x4's with bull bars and other accessories both of which have a positive impact on safety far more than any camera ever will.


When you been helping at an accident or worse still been in it and the emergency services are over 45mins away at an avg speed of 150+ then I am damn happy we put them in the a quick car with the best brakes that can affordably be spec'd on them