is it worth supercharging a 6? - Page 4

4.9 EF Futura · 28-02-2006, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiddy

Where does the actual bracket mount to the motor on a 6?

Some pics on the CAPA site:

http://www.capa.com.au/kits_ford.htm

EDIT: If anyone's got a copy of the installation manual, would be worth a read.. i have the V8 one here....

EDIT AGAIN: Any reason why the EF/EL 6cyl vortech bracket isnt usable?

stiddy · 28-02-2006, 07:27 PM

thats what I was thinking about the EF/EL, I thought the layout of the belts and pulleys on the front of the motors are exactly the same??
meaning the same bracketry from a Vortech EF/EL kit should bolt straight up to the AU?

I'll get mine and my sisters cars side by side over the weekend and have a real close look and get back to you on it..

Racecraft · 28-02-2006, 08:11 PM

the difference is in the compressor housing, brackets and bolts

stiddy · 28-02-2006, 08:18 PM

oh ok, damn..

**Mechan1k** · 28-02-2006, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AUII_SE_Ute

Tibbo, when were you gonna tell me you were supercharging?

Mechan1k, I fired off an e-mail to Snort a little while back and they told me that it wasn't worth their time and money to release a supercharger kit. Have they changed their minds?

Joe from Crescent was speaking to the guy from Snort (sorry I forgot his name) on the phone the other day ... and the guy from Snort asked him if Joe still had the guy interested in the I6 S/C kit (ie: me) .... Joe said yeah ... even if i wasn't interested Joe was going to get a kit anyway and fit it to another vehicle he had in mind.

Snort said the kit is very very close to being ready for production ... just a little more testing is needed before it is available.

Kenny ... I'll let you know when i hear more information in regards to it.

Tibbo's PD unit was pretty heavy as well .. and the bracket was kinda larger than i expected ... the entire kit inc. packaging weighed around 20kg (80% of the weight would have been the S/C)

Tibbo .... good to hear you got it all there in one piece ... I packaged it up well with foam and "FRAGILE" tape ... LOL

It looked a fairly simple package as well ... there's not really that much involved in it ... looked like a straight bolt-up kit ... on thing now is for cooler and plumbing which looks to be the harder part of the install.

4.9 EF Futura · 01-03-2006, 11:02 AM

I imagine snort will be purchasing the supercharger units from CAPA? But if they are able to reduce the cost of "everthing else" i.e. pulleys and brackets - it should be a competetively priced product.

Yeah - FMIC plumbing is always going to be mre difficult than a straight forward sc-tb setup like mine... other stuff like "re-jigging" the PCV system is fairly straightforward (happy to run anyone through this if you dont have instructions).

EDIT: Oh and the hot tip i have when it comes to sourcing belts (dont be too suprised if you shred one or two... a belt which looks perfectly aligned may not be!) is to hit up places like the consolidate bearing company (if you have them in your state) or any other place that sells bearings/belts. Just get the measurement (i.e. 6pkxxxx where xxxx is the length of the belt in mm) and grab a gates from one of these trade suppliers. About 50% of what CAPA will charge...

TheSneakiness · 01-03-2006, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

Joe from Crescent was speaking to the guy from Snort (sorry I forgot his name) on the phone the other day ... and the guy from Snort asked him if Joe still had the guy interested in the I6 S/C kit (ie: me) .... Joe said yeah ... even if i wasn't interested Joe was going to get a kit anyway and fit it to another vehicle he had in mind.

Snort said the kit is very very close to being ready for production ... just a little more testing is needed before it is available.

Kenny ... I'll let you know when i hear more information in regards to it.

Thanks mate.

**Mechan1k** · 04-03-2006, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

I imagine snort will be purchasing the supercharger units from CAPA? But if they are able to reduce the cost of "everthing else" i.e. pulleys and brackets - it should be a competetively priced product.

Yeah - FMIC plumbing is always going to be mre difficult than a straight forward sc-tb setup like mine... other stuff like "re-jigging" the PCV system is fairly straightforward (happy to run anyone through this if you dont have instructions).

EDIT: Oh and the hot tip i have when it comes to sourcing belts (dont be too suprised if you shred one or two... a belt which looks perfectly aligned may not be!) is to hit up places like the consolidate bearing company (if you have them in your state) or any other place that sells bearings/belts. Just get the measurement (i.e. 6pkxxxx where xxxx is the length of the belt in mm) and grab a gates from one of these trade suppliers. About 50% of what CAPA will charge...

Thanks for that extra info ... I am looking at going no cooler and stay low psi anyway. But will look into going to CBC and geting spare belt ... if you shred a belt ... what happens ... you just run no boost???? ... or will it effect LPG running when there is no boost???? Just wondering.

When you got it aligned correctly .... has the belt lasted for a while ... I take it is a good idea to keep a few belts in the vehicle at all times.

4.9 EF Futura · 06-03-2006, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

Thanks for that extra info ... I am looking at going no cooler and stay low psi anyway. But will look into going to CBC and geting spare belt ... if you shred a belt ... what happens ... you just run no boost???? ... or will it effect LPG running when there is no boost???? Just wondering.

When you got it aligned correctly .... has the belt lasted for a while ... I take it is a good idea to keep a few belts in the vehicle at all times.

Hey. Sorry for the delay.

The effects of destroying a belt will depend on how they are setup on the engine. For the V8 - you modify the belt system and the supercharger is given its own belt, which it shares with the power steering pump:

Therefore, if i shred a belt, i can limp home with no boost and no power steering. certainly not the end of the world - water pump, alternator and air con still work fine. Just look like a bit of a w*nker with supercharged badge lol.

I think on the I6, you still run a serpentine for everything... so if you shred a belt then you're in a spot of bother... so yeah id definately keep a spare on board... but the only reason belts shred like that is an alignment issue. I dont keep a spare but can lug it down to CBC with no boost/power steering if needed....

No idea on implications for lpg sorry - i dont touch the stuff!

Current belt has been on for nearly 12 months and still looks perfect.

Racecraft · 06-03-2006, 04:35 PM

yea, something I was thinking about on mine, I'll just carry the factory belt as a back-up as you can nearly change them by hand.. If the supercharger belt dies, I can get around on the stocker until I source a newie.. But once my belt arrives from CAPA I'm off to CBC to grab a spare just in case

4.9 I take it yours was a complete CAPA kit? If it was I have the same Vortech regulator? Can you squeze the camera in and get me any shots of the plumbing? Did you remove the factory reg and then run that or just run it after the stocker? .. Does you reg also come with two 'solenoids' ... I have nfi what they'd do and where they get wired into along wioth the vacuum lines

ANd a pic or explaination of the modded PVC set-up would be handy too

Thanks mate

Mechanik:-- Your LPG ECU will adapt to no boost easy enough, it won't be a worry

Racecraft · 06-03-2006, 05:01 PM

here is a pic of the bracket for Stiddy

It would be easy to just by the Powerdyne bracket with the pulley spacers for an AU then cut it into 2 sections. (where the blue line is).. Then make a new section that marry's up to the Vortech and weld it to the locating half you kept... Saves making the whole thing and you get the pulley spacers and locations spot on.

stiddy · 06-03-2006, 05:11 PM

Thanks heaps for that mate.
*saves to favourites*

The Vortech wouldnt sit too much different would it, rather than being mounted to the left on the bracket, its mounted to the top
so cut down the blue line, rotate anti clockwise 90*, and weld back up for a vortech..

thanks for taking the time do draw that up Tibbo.

4.9 EF Futura · 06-03-2006, 05:12 PM

No dramas. Looks like my povo-ar*e hosting has run out of bandwidth but we'll work around that.

Bracket looks good (shoulda painted mine lol) - just make sure that seam is nice and strong!

Yeah mine is a complete CAPA kit, self fitted of course.

I do have a vortech rising rate fuel regulator or FMU for our northern american counterparts... pretty blue one which is setup for 12:1.

Plumbing is fairly simple, the theory is beautiful. Fuel comes from the pump and enters the fuel rail, passes through the standard regulator and then returns to the tank. The FMU comes into the scene AFTER the standard regulator... i.e. you cut the return line and have the fuel go from the standard regulator to the FMU then to the return line.

Therefore, standard fuel pressure until boost kicks in, at which point the reg starts ramping up fuel pressure. My FMU is a 12:1, standard fuel pressure is 38psi I think... therefore FMU isnt really doing anything until 3.2psi boost... i.e. 3psi x 12 = 36psi... the FMU isnt doing anything as standard reg maintains pressure at 38psi.... but at 3.3psi, FMU is making pressure in rail 39.6psi... all the way up to 7.5psi boost where my fuel pressure is 90psi. Lol, I bet the injectors love that...

The fitting on the bottom goes to the return line, the fitting on the side/front goes to the fuel rail/regulator and the fitting on top is for a vac/boost line. Mount it where ever there is room. Mine is on the firewall but shock tower is another popular place to mount them.

Working the lines is very simple. On mine, they come up from under the car on the passenger side and are bolted to the side of the engine bay - i imagine yours will be similar?? They are metal at this point. What you do is remove the rubber sections between these hard lines and the hard metal lines on the engine and attach your own lines, of course instead of going from the std regulator to the return line, they go from the standard regulator to the FMU and then to the return line.

Dont forget to disable the fuel pump, run the car until it stalls before you go cutting the hoses off

They hold pressure after the engine has stopped...

No idea bout the solenoids?? Might have to ask CAPA about that one... see if they'll fax you a copy of the installation manual.

OK, PCV system... this is for the V8 but I6 probably similar. The V8 has a vent hose from the oil filler cap - this may be in the rocker cover on an I6?? Either way - this is NOT the line that has the actual PCV valve in it. The line with the actual PCV valve doesnt need to be touched.

When standard, the hose from the oil filler neck goes to the throttle body.

If this were left as is, if boost entered the crankcase via the PCV valve, it would vent back to the TB and therefore the entire crankcase would be pressurised... bad for main seals, bad if you want the dipstick to stay where it is and probably bad for your safety.

So you disconnect the vent line from the TB and block the connection on the TB where this hose was fitted. Instead of going from the crankcase (oil filler/rocker cover/whatever) to the TB, this vent needs to come from the crankcase and be plumbed into the inlet tubing BEFORE the blower.

Picture worth a thousand words:

Im sure one of your TQE bretheren can help you identify which hose on the I6 needs to be disconnected from the TB.

Also, for high boost setups - often need to run more than one of these, or fit a larger hose... i guess that's where trial and error/experimentation/cursing comes into it...

Any of this make sense? Sorry... trying to do a few things at once here

Racecraft · 06-03-2006, 05:16 PM

no problems mate,, to save a few hassles you could just get one of the 'universal'
Vortech brackets 4.9 mentioned earlier in the thread and use half of that.. just get the belt first so you know how far from the engine the blower pulley needs to be

Mark351 · 06-03-2006, 05:17 PM

Or, keep the Powerdyne bracket, and get one of the XB-1A gear driven superchargers that can push up to 18psi (fits in the same bracketry).

EFFalcon · 06-03-2006, 05:18 PM

it'd be the one that runs from the rear of the rocker cover then connects to the underside of the t/b.
plumb that to before the s/c and it should be fine.

4.9 EF Futura · 06-03-2006, 05:21 PM

Thanks for the clarification john.

BTW the gear driven powerdynes are a little exxy.... in fact, belt driven powerdynes cost more than vortech sq's lol.

Picture of fuel lines here:

Worth double/triple checking... you dont wanna f--k that part up

Racecraft · 06-03-2006, 05:21 PM

Yea that makes sense, same principle as my EL except there is a catch can in there somewhere.. The reg solenoids have me stumped, I'll go without atm and see what happens :P

Thanks 4.9, champion

stiddy · 06-03-2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathXR

Or, keep the Powerdyne bracket, and get one of the XB-1A gear driven superchargers that can push up to 18psi (fits in the same bracketry).

XB-1A, never heard of such animal?

At the moment im set on a S-trim, but thats not going to happen till after GnD have had their way with my car.
then when the funds allow, the s/c talk gets put into action.

4.9 EF Futura · 06-03-2006, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiddy

XB-1A, never head of such animal?

http://www.powerdyne.com/gear_driven.htm

Apparentley they noisy... like the vortechs of days gone bye.

Mmmm.... blower whine....

stiddy · 06-03-2006, 05:29 PM

what would be noisier S-trim or the AB-1A?

mmm blower whine indeed, but I want a whine not a scream lol

4.9 EF Futura · 06-03-2006, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiddy

what would be noisier S-trim or the AB-1A?

mmm blower whine indeed, but I want a whine not a scream lol

Is that an older vortech... i.e. before the V-2 SQ's hit the scene? Excuse the french but they are f--ken loud. Never seen a powerdyne XB in the flesh.. imagine they would be similar. Even some of the SQ's make a bit of noise. All i hear from the Powerdyne belt driven is the noise of the extra belts and the massive amount of air being sucked into the pod lol.

Either way, the whine from gear driven is louder at idle than at high rpm as far as i know... its a creepy sound tho.

stiddy · 06-03-2006, 05:46 PM

Yeah the S-Trim was before the V-2 SQ's and the like..
lol and yeah they are bloody loud, give you goosebumps when they drive passed.