5 yearly driving tests

[AWD Chaser]

http://www.news.com.au/national/test...-1226134432212

DRIVERS could be forced to retake their driving test every five years to protect motorcyclists after soaring numbers of deaths.

MPs heard increasing motorcycle use has seen a higher number of serious injuries and and road deaths.

On Saturday, a motorcyclist was killed after being hit by a car leaving a Melbourne car park.

A law firm has told the Victorian Parliament there was a big need for licence refresher courses.

"Other road users need to accept that motorcyclists are entitled to share the existing road space in a safe manner," the Maurice Blackburn's principal, John Voyage, said.

"Motorcyclists are not risk-takers. These are Victorians who understand risk and take steps to mitigate it."

The firm put forward two alternatives: compulsory re-testing, or a voluntary system that would give those drivers a reduced TAC premium. Re-testing could happen every five years, or upon licence renewal every 10 years.

Major improvements also need to be made in testing for motorcyclists, it says.

"(There is) a need for testing in real road environments with infrastructure including traffic lights, level crossings and other scenario training," the report says.

Riders are particularly vulnerable to drivers who simply don't see them. The submission says a common response to a crash is: "Sorry, mate. I didn't see you".

And navigation aids and entertainment systems were distractions: "The motorist is less likely to be aware of what is happening around them and in fact almost oblivious to other road users."

Experienced motorcyclist Catherine Elliott, who was in hospital for eight months after a crash, said everyone needed refresher training.

"There is not enough training for motorists on how to look out for motorcyclists, cyclists or pedestrians.

"Add five minutes to your trip, show a little respect to others and be patient," she said.

"That way we will all be able to make it home safely."

Submissions to the inquiry have closed. Public hearings will be held before the final report is tabled in Parliament by next June.

The State Government will issue a response before any changes are introduced.



Read more: http://www.news.com.au/national/test-motorists-to-make-bikers-safer/story-e6frfkvr-1226134432212#ixzz1XghFSIAs

[Falc'man]

Refreshers will mean jack all for common sense.

[2011G6E]

Sorry, but I don't see a problem.
I'd also agree that the average motorcyclist probably has better road awareness and road skills than the average car driver...our lives depend on it.

As a train driver, every 18 months or so we have to undergo not only a full class one physical (same as airline pilots get) but also have to virtually "re-sit" our "drivers licence"...it's called a MOC, or "Maintainance Of Competance", and covers all the rules and regs, and also whether you still know how to drive the train according to strict standards, and in an efficient way. If you don't pass, you're "on the platform", off the rails, until you can prove your skills are back up to scratch.

Train drivers often wonder what the roads would look like if cars and truck drivers were required to do the same thing. We don't know, but I'm betting they'd be a lot emptier...

[aussie muscle]

i don't like the inconvenience, but with road rules and regulations changing all the time it's probably not a bad idea. maybe some will even learn how to use a roundabout!!

[burnz]

why is it the bike rider is well mannered on an expressway.
yet goes silly when in traffic?? changing lanes fast than the car can respond..

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by Falc'man

Refreshers will mean jack all for common sense.

Agreed. However a lot of people lack common sense and care on the roads.

Retesting should exist for over 60's. My dad is over 60 and awesome driver, but time for a refresher. A lot of bad habits were learned in 45 years!

Also getting licence should be harder!

[Mr Hardware]

I see the main cause of confusion of road rules due to the fact that so many over 50's got their licence by driving the local copper around the block in a town that didn't even have a roundabout.

I fully encourage 5-yearly driving tests.

[DBourne]

Originally Posted by aussie muscle

i don't like the inconvenience, but with road rules and regulations changing all the time it's probably not a bad idea. maybe some will even learn how to use a roundabout!!

I agree it would be good for most people to do. As for learning how to use a roundabout, they didn't say it'd be a miracle course

[mytgxl]

would want to see how many more motorbike licences there were, when they started the study & how many more are there now! people are turning to a cheaper way to get around these days!

[TheSneakiness]

Originally Posted by 1 bad ef

would want to see how many more motorbike licences there were, when they started the study & how many more are there now! people are turning to a cheaper way to get around these days!

Agreed.

Also agreed with the over *insert age here* refreshers.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

I see the main cause of confusion of road rules due to the fact that so many over 50's got their licence by driving the local copper around the block in a town that didn't even have a roundabout.

I fully encourage 5-yearly driving tests.

As opposed to the current young drivers who are trained to pass a test rather than actually drive a vehicle.

I agree that the 5 year retest should be implemented but with a few caveats.

1) the test is practical and not some stupid agenda driven farce where travelling at 30km below the speed limit causing chaos is ok but answering the question "when is it safe to exceed a speed limit by even 1km/h" with anything other than NEVER is instant fail.

2) tests include new optional endorsments for trailer, caravan, 4WD etc so 5 years from now everyone will have actually been tested capable of controlling such vehicles as opposed to now when 20 seconds after passing initial issue in a Kia Rio a driver can jump in a twin turbo V8 4WD with a giant boat or caravan draging along behind.

3) Failure of the test requires a retest within 30 days and the test must be failed 3 times before license is suspended. The effect of instant loss because of some minor oops and a tester with a hitler personality profile will potentially cause grief to the community. A tester cannot test the same person twice during this period.

4) The test requires completion of an advanced driving course with emergency situation avoidance and recovery in the previous 12 months.

[Grunter]

Originally Posted by flappist

As opposed to the current young drivers who are trained to pass a test rather than actually drive a vehicle.

I agree that the 5 year retest should be implemented but with a few caveats.

1) the test is practical and not some stupid agenda driven farce where travelling at 30km below the speed limit causing chaos is ok but answering the question "when is it safe to exceed a speed limit by even 1km/h" with anything other than NEVER is instant fail.

2) tests include new optional endorsments for trailer, caravan, 4WD etc so 5 years from now everyone will have actually been tested capable of controlling such vehicles as opposed to now when 20 seconds after passing initial issue in a Kia Rio a driver can jump in a twin turbo V8 4WD with a giant boat or caravan draging along behind.

3) Failure of the test requires a retest within 30 days and the test must be failed 3 times before license is suspended. The effect of instant loss because of some minor oops and a tester with a hitler personality profile will potentially cause grief to the community. A tester cannot test the same person twice during this period.

4) The test requires completion of an advanced driving course with emergency situation avoidance and recovery in the previous 12 months.

Bring it on. I consider myself an ok driver but I know I could benefit from getting up to speed brushing up on current and any new road rules that come out, not to mention brushing up on the skills previously learnt on the advanced driver course.

[mik]

even every ten years would be ok, some people have had their brief for 30/40/50 years and never had a refresher, i can remember my dear old nana 70 years old (now departed) would make the trip down from bendigo in her 62 falcon wagon, going through stop signs/give way signs, she had all her marbles but did`nt know the modern road rules, but argeed with falc`man, it won`t give common sense .

[Charliewool]

Stupid idea AND just another money grabbing scheme.
(plus, I'm way too old to be bothered having my car/motorcycle/and HC retested )

[tweeked]

The only thing faster than a motorcycle is the quoted Maurice Blackburn type lawyers chasing ambulances.

Parasites

[icer]

ban all motorcycles and bikes off the roads.


/EOF

[vanman_75]

So the ex (17yearsago) who only just got her licence but is a real danger to herself , is THAT the test they want everyone to re-sit ? You either got it or you don't .... those that don't will have their little accidents all their driving life ....and with any luck won't hurt anyone on the way . yess even. Awesome drivers have accidents ,but re-sitting driving tests won't fix diddly.I. wpuld like current road rule book issued upon licence renewal though...with major changes highlighted in first pages .but as said that don't stop idiots or common sense

[Fev]

Happy to do it if it reminds people of the simple road rules like keep left on the highway.

Hopefull they make the test harder but easier to understand. Anyone who has done the tests in the last 5 years will know what I mean when I saw they are the most pathetic pieces of drivvel i've ever had to experience. They are more about scare campaigning and propaganda than actually teaching you anything whatsoever about the road rules!

[SEZ213]

No one is such a good driver that they wouldn't benefit from retesting, motorcyclist or otherwise. Experience alone doesn't make you a good driver, particularly in an ever changing society (road rules, etc). Providing that retesting is 'RELEVANT' I don't see any problem with this - and I don't think it should be reserved for over *this age bracket* either - it should encompass all.

I'm all for drivers taking responsibility, but it should be ALL vehicle drivers, not pointing fingers at one particular group such as car drivers or motorcyclists - ALL those in charge of a vehicle (bicycle, motorcycle, scooter, car, etc.) need to understand and remember that they aren't the only person on the road. The cyclist needs to follow their road rules, and where possible stick to bike lanes; the motorcyclist needs to follow their road rules and not drive up the left hand side of someone in traffic - or up the middle of the road if traffic is moving; the car driver needs to follow their rules and LOOK and give notice that they're going to change lanes, before they do it - an indicator is NOT a confirming action.

[2011G6E]

If you agree that a lot of people aren't very good drivers, if you agree that road rules change all the time, if you agree that some people just see driving as an automatic habit, then you should agree with this idea, and it should be brought in around the country.

The point isn't that it is a "money raiser", the point is that those very drivers will most likely fail, lose thier driving privelages, and have to sit it out until they can prove they are worthy of being on the road again.

If you can't be bothered to take a little interest in driving as a skill, then get on the bus and out of the wa of everyone else.

I don't think they'll bring in such a scheme though...they'd be horrified by the tens of thousands of people who'd lose thier licence at the first testing time and the political backlash this would cause.

[fg_nitro]

Originally Posted by Grunter

Bring it on. I consider myself an ok driver but I know I could benefit from getting up to speed brushing up on current and any new road rules that come out, not to mention brushing up on the skills previously learnt on the advanced driver course.

Following on from Flappist and Grunter I agree bring it on, the number of Muppet's on the road who who:

1. Drive and text and/or call.
2. Do not use mirrors.
3. Change lanes without mirrors head check.
4. Day dream.
5. Think indicators are not required.

I ride a motorbike and drive a car, I spend a considerable amount of time on the road and am discussed in the way people carry on. I would hate to be in a truck.

[Silver Ghia]

Agreed that vehicle drivers need to keep a better lookout for motorcyclists and have seen some close calls caused by inattentive drivers, but many times its the motorcyclists themselves that cause the problems by weaving in and out, and between traffic, cutting in and passing all other vehicles on the road which are travelling at the posted speed limit.

Originally Posted by SgtBourne

I agree it would be good for most people to do. As for learning how to use a roundabout, they didn't say it'd be a miracle course

I just wonder how many drivers will go with licence renewal tests, when it seems testers have a different set of road rules to whats on the Vicroade website? For example, why do learners always sit there at a roundabout waiting for a car from the right not on the roundabout, and still way in the distance?

[Jim Goose]

Great idea... at the very least if they dont impliment the driving test, then people should be made to resit the road rules test!

5yrs is a good enough gap and (in QLD) you can pay for a 5yr renewal. So it would co-incide with that time period.

Though if it goes ahead they will need to employ MORE STAFF to handle the extra work load.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by flappist

a tester with a hitler personality profile will potentially cause grief to the community. A tester cannot test the same person twice during this period.

This is a big issue, particularily with VicRoads, you get some real smart-*** license examiners, for example two weeks ago:

My friend is concerned about his learner log book, he has over 120 hours, which is fine, he goes into a VicRoads office with his driving instructor, they take the book in and the lady behind the counter says its fine, she even gets her supervisor to come over and he says its all good, no problems with the book.

Come the day of his license test a few days later, he fronts up with his instructor again, the examiner takes his log book, then right away starts complaining about how the pages are dog eared, the book is a bit faded, the writing is messy and she starts crossing off hours left right and centre. He asks, and says how come she is crossing off hours and mentioned that they come in a few days ago to check if it was OK and her supervisor said it was fine? She replies "I'M THE LICENSE EXAMINER SO I MAKE THE CALL!".

Not only is she being a jerk, she's smart-assing a kid with a diagnosed mental illness, who unfortunately happens to be very down on his luck.

I had the same issue with my license examiner, I only messed up a few things on the test, doing 40 in a 50 zone because it looked like a school building where I was driving, It took me a while to do a hill start (which wasn't part of the test anyways), because I was revving the car slightly, slowly let out the clutch until the revs dropped, then dropped the hand brake to slowly roll off. I accidentally took off in second gear as well later on, when I finished she starts yelling at me telling me how I'm the most dangerous driver she's ever tested and that the definition of a good driver is one who makes their passengers feel safe, then she goes inside and hands me my license and said I passed?

The same license examiner did the same thing to another friend, he thought she was joking.

The whole bloody licensing system needs an overhaul right down from the learner driver, to the license examiner and everything in between like driving instructors etc.

The testing is BS, you get given one of 6 random test routes, and it depends on the license examiner on how long it goes for, my test went for just under an hour, took me all over town on the hardest possible route, whereas a friend who did the test at the same office drove around for 20 minutes, then came back?

Its not really a good test either, I did a three point turn and drove around town for the rest of the 50 minutes, nothing to do with highways, gravel roads, in the wet, how the car handles etc.

[Parkway]

Motorcyclists can't always be the victim here, though. A few years back I nearly witnessed what could have been a fatal crash for a bike rider because of his stupidity. You wouldn't believe what he did.

I'm sure most experienced drivers know to be cautious when driving because of potential cyclists, but it has to be understood, they can be very difficult to see sometimes and from experience, most people don't have enough time/effort to check twice.

Also, I don't know what the rules regarding motorcyclists are. Can they legally ride through the middle of the traffic? Can they sit next to you on a single lane set of lights? This information would be handy

To conclude, in my opinion, this test will do nothing. Anyone ever seen World's Strictest Parents?

[asdf1234]

If it's to p plate driver test standards everyone's gonna fail

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by fg_nitro

Following on from Flappist and Grunter I agree bring it on, the number of Muppet's on the road who who:

1. Drive and text and/or call.
2. Do not use mirrors.
3. Change lanes without mirrors head check.
4. Day dream.
5. Think indicators are not required.

I ride a motorbike and drive a car, I spend a considerable amount of time on the road and am discussed in the way people carry on. I would hate to be in a truck.

Motorists already know what is right and what is wrong; my concern is, would a simple test actually get people to do the right thing? That is, they know that texting while driving is dangerous, but it's the complacent attitude, lack of courtesy to others' safety, impatience, or whatever, that doesn't prevent them from doing this.

This is why I see it more of an inconvenience and money grabbing exercise. Spend the revenue money on more highway patrol officers because a speed camera can't see any of the stupidity that goes on on our roads.

Originally Posted by asdf1234

If it's to p plate driver test standards everyone's gonna fail

That is really interesting. Please elaborate.
The amusing thing with P-platers is just the day before when they were on the Learners they were driving like an old citizen 20 kph below the limit (which I have time for, it's understandable) but when they get the Ps they're invincible. I'm not having a go at any P licensed motorists rather it proves the point that attitude is not something that is being taught, nor is it captured by a one-eyed camera.

[SteveJH]

Originally Posted by Parkway

Also, I don't know what the rules regarding motorcyclists are. Can they legally ride through the middle of the traffic? Can they sit next to you on a single lane set of lights? This information would be handy

No and no, but many of them do it anyway.

Edit i'd prefer that rather then a test, people had to do an accredited advanced driving course once every 5 years or something.

[sudszy]

How is redoing a driving test going to make life safer for motorcyclists or enable a driver make out a motorcycle that is darting about that is dressed up in road camoflage colours?
Perhaps some people are more genetically disposed to not noticing things in their peripheral vision or even direct vision and possibly there are other indicators that could be tested for that would identify those that are going to cause more collisions.

Of course its not just car drivers that fail to see motorcyclists, motorcyclists themselves are no better at spotting other motor cyclists than car drivers. The chances of two bikes colliding are proportionally the same as a bike/car collison, and that excludes collisions between bike riders that are riding together/ in a group.

According to the lawyers, motorcyclists are not risk takers?

Perhaps they can explain the validity of this when the typical motorcycle is darkly painted and the typical motorcyclist shuns wearing high visibility clothing , in favour of dark leathers and the like when the claim is their major problem is not being seen

For the record, I give motorcyclists as much space as I can as even a simple touch could end up very serious and do my best to look for them

[Geez Louise]

I have to say that I don't see it as a bad thing.

I have been driving for a long time and I consider myself a good driver but there are new rules coming in all the time and having people brush up on basic driving skills, checking mirrors etc couldn't hurt.

Some drivers get overly confident so having them brush up/re-check their skills can't be a bad thing.