98 octane Vs 100 octane E10

[MR.BA.GT.332]

Hey guys

Just a quick question for all those who always run 98 octane (shell, BP etc) and wondering have you used the United 100 octane E10 and noticed any difference at all?? just curious really

[The Yeti]

I ran it once, the car ran like a bsted **** and was woful ecomony wise

[fanboi]

I had no problems at all

[graham7773]

Probably not what you are looking for but you can only expect power loss by using alcohol. the American drag boys proved this years ago and I am surprised that the issue still causes confusion. The simple fact is that you need to use two litres of alcohol to get the same power you get from 1 litre of standard petrol. looking at it this way, you can see that 10% alcohol in your petrol is going to cost you 5% power loss. This means that you have to put your foot down a bit further to get the same power from your engine. More foot = less economy. It really is that simple. The only (dubious) benefit is that your engine should run a couple of degrees cooler on E10.

[turbodewd]

Ive moved from 95 to 98 after seeing the results of some fuel economy tests on Today Tonight (yes I know that show is dodgy).

Anyway, my economy is definitely better on 98. I religiously try to maintain good economy and only give the turbo the odd squirt. Ive not been higher than 10.8L/100km on the rolling average in the LCD display.

[ryeman]

TT dodgy? Neevveerr....

[Alan D Segal]

I second what was said by the Yeti and graham7773. I tried it, noticed no positive difference - if anything it seemed down on power and it seemed to get slightly worse economy. It wasn't worth the money IMHO.

[xtremerus]

Notice SFA difference between the two in my ute.
Yeti, what did you run it in to have it run so bad?

[63futura]

I run the P100 which is the 100 octane (E10 is only 95)
No idea on econemy but makes more power than 98 in my turbo car and the car runs alot smoother all over

[ratter]

what sort of car?

United 100 is 10% ethanol

On a late model car your fuel economy will become a little worse due to the ethanol but if the car was tuned to the 100 then there is a little extra power to be had in most cars

[63futura]

Originally Posted by ratter

what sort of car?

United 100 is 10% ethanol

On a late model car your fuel economy will become a little worse due to the ethanol but if the car was tuned to the 100 then there is a little extra power to be had in most cars

1963 XL Falcon with AU 5.0 but has a single 66mm turbo with blow thru carby and runs 10.8s
So economy isnt really something im worried about
But would agree if its economy your after its not realy for you but if its HP then go for it

[XBROO]

Yeah my coupes engine is pretty stock and it really liked the 100, it stop pinging under load in forth. And it had more power and ran smoother. I only ran it a few times, just wasn't sure if the ethanol would to any harm to my motor or parts. To many mixed reviews on it, some say it won't harm you car. And others say it will, so I'll just run 98 just in case. I also ran it in my bike (MT01) and it didn't like it.

[shyun]

Originally Posted by graham7773

Probably not what you are looking for but you can only expect power loss by using alcohol. the American drag boys proved this years ago and I am surprised that the issue still causes confusion. The simple fact is that you need to use two litres of alcohol to get the same power you get from 1 litre of standard petrol. looking at it this way, you can see that 10% alcohol in your petrol is going to cost you 5% power loss. This means that you have to put your foot down a bit further to get the same power from your engine. More foot = less economy. It really is that simple. The only (dubious) benefit is that your engine should run a couple of degrees cooler on E10.

Wrong. You use about 40% more ethanol than petrol to get the same power, but ethanol burns at a different ratio than unleaded which basically cancels this out. Running the same ignition timing power should be similar but If you can add more ignition advance then you should gain power, which is why people with turbo's love ethanol.

[watejs06]

My experiences with P100 from United Fuels are positive, Fist car I tried it in was my Daily driver AU 1 tonne V8 ute.

A few persistent problems that the car had previously :

1. Flat spot @ 2000 rpm was very strange could never get rid of it.
2. Would surge on cruise - 100km/h I.E speed up, slow down, speed up slow down.
3. would sit on the cam at idle I.E Lumpy idle (small tow cam)
Average fuel economy was 400km's per tank.

After the first tank of P100 the Flat spot had gone completely. The following 3 tanks progressively fixed up both the idle and surge on cruise. I have not gone back to 98RON fuel since. Fuel economy hasn't changed much, probably a bit more thirsty around town, but nothing massive.

The AU has never run better, I highly recommend P100, Not just 1 tank give 3 or 4 tanks a go, see what happens. After this I got my supercharged FG Boss 290 tuned on P100 as pump fuel and responded with more timing being added I.E higher octane.

Like previously mentioned, this is my experience

Originally Posted by XBROO

Yeah my coupes engine is pretty stock and it really liked the 100, it stop pinging under load in forth. And it had more power and ran smoother. I only ran it a few times, just wasn't sure if the ethanol would to any harm to my motor or parts. To many mixed reviews on it, some say it won't harm you car. And others say it will, so I'll just run 98 just in case. I also ran it in my bike (MT01) and it didn't like it.

Pinging or Pre detonation is never good.

P100 has 10% Ethanol, so it will lean out any Air Fuel Ratio (AFR) by about 4% meaning if you have a 12.0, you would now have a 12.5. I.E Slightly leaner.

If the P100 stops the pinging, I would keep using it ! It won't break your motor, in fact in your case it will prolong engine life.


Also keep in mind that the United Fuels intended this to be a replacement for Premium unleaded in performance vehicles, so they can't sell a dodgy product.

Cheers
Jay

[icer]

ive used all 3 fuels in my car.

Car made 320rwkw on BP 98....you could fart next to the car and it would knock. Fuel economy was about 380km full tank.
Car made 335rwkw on United 100 and was safe as a house. Was awesome fuel. More power, and safer to run the car. Fuel economy was about 350km.
Then went to e85 (200L DRUM Delivered not United). Best thing ever done. Safe as a house, NO detonation with e85 and massive power gains. depending on your setup you can get 30-50rwkw gain over 98. I get about 300km a full tank of e85. Driven hard and cruising. 280 if given a full day of hard KMs.

I advice everyone to use united 100. Its great. If you can do e85, i advice to go UNITED e85 if fuel system persists.

Im going to move back to UNITED 85 shortly and will see if there is any difference from the DRUM e85.

[ebxr8240]

Lets get some facts.. Ethanol is different to methanol. here's stoich ratio they run at..

Gasoline is 14.7:1
methanol is 6.5:1
ethanol is 9:1

[GTP-RPD]

Can I put E10 100 in my 100% stock ED 6 cyl? Or will it impact my fuel system?

[ebxr8240]

Originally Posted by GTP-RPD

Can I put E10 100 in my 100% stock ED 6 cyl? Or will it impact my fuel system?

At first it may if there's gummed up fuel lines and water in the tank..
In that case it should be cleaned any way..
The ethanol cleans the fuel system..It may pay to change filter after you've run some if its an old one. Run it in my old EB and ED with no issues.. The EB has alloy as part of its fuel line too..

[MR.BA.GT.332]

great info here, thanks for all the replies so far fellas.

My reason for asking is when i have the big block running and tuned, it would be tuned for 98, BUT....... there are some United servos around my area and if i was close by to one and needed fuel i could top up with the United P100 E10 and was hoping i wouldnt have to many issues..... but when i convert to EFI i have considered E85 but thats another topic

Lately ive been running United's E10 95 octane in my mrs little honda jazz and it loves it (and its there cheapest fuel too) but last few tanks ive been running shell 98 with great economy results also, ive managed to get it down to 5.7lt/100km on both fuels..... not bad for her car having 172000km on the clock

my forby, well it just drinks any unleaded it can get with no difference weather it be 91 E10 or 98, it just chugs along sipping away

[Olbucko]

I put some United 100 octane in my XM falcon by mistake, didn't realise that it had alcohol in it, made the old bird run like a dog.

[63futura]

The cars that run like crap is usually form it cleaning all the gunk and crap out of the fuel system
If you fuel systems fairly new it should run better than normal
It will run a little leaner but not much to worry about

[ratter]

look at how you want but E85 does not have cleaning agents that clean the fuel system, it has corrosive properties which eat into the fuel system and can dislodge rubbish, some will view this as the same thing

[Qwik6]

Ive used P100 for years in my cammed EB. Gained a couple rwkw when tuned over 98.
Now use a P100/E85 mix. More power again. Stock fuel system bar injectors. No issues had.

Also run 94ron E10 in my daily EL and previous ED. No issues.

[provked]

My engine builder swears buy it, I was told bring a jerry can full for my dyno session, that's what he wanted to run my fresh motor in on, we did have to take a few jets out of the 750 quick fuel pumper though. And it ran sweet as,

[Franco Cozzo]

What about in my scenario, I've got a 97 EL Fairmont Ghia, cammed, head work, exhaust and tuned (for BP 98).

The tuner was saying now that BP 98 is the best fuel etc and the car is tuned for it, made 138KW at the rears.

Would I be able to use United 100? Or what about Caltex E85 (E-Flex?) (I want to experiment with this maybe just for a tank or two if it fixes my rough idle problem).

Would the E85 damage anything in an old car like my EL?

I'm getting about 600km out of a tank on 98 with my driving style.

[jakkes]

a person on these forums pointed out to me if you don't have the compression to take advantage of it why bother??? that was from a person in the carb industry

[ebxr8240]

Yep compression or boost.. Or atleast a tuned motor..
Be interesting to see the new LPG engine sniffing some E85 ??
With boost ...

[Franco Cozzo]

I have slightly raised compression with shaved head and AU MLS gasket, nothing major though.

[Qwik6]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

What about in my scenario, I've got a 97 EL Fairmont Ghia, cammed, head work, exhaust and tuned (for BP 98).

The tuner was saying now that BP 98 is the best fuel etc and the car is tuned for it, made 138KW at the rears.

Would I be able to use United 100? Or what about Caltex E85 (E-Flex?) (I want to experiment with this maybe just for a tank or two if it fixes my rough idle problem).

Would the E85 damage anything in an old car like my EL?

Shouldn't do any harm using P100. Should get tuned to get the most out've it.
Also it should be ok using E85 as an octane booster either. Add about 5ltrs to a tank.

The blend of P100 and E85 I run netted me about 7rwkw when I got a tune for it.

To get the most out of a straight E85 NA motor you'll need big comp (as well as the bigger fuel system to cope).
An NA 6 Barra motor in South Oz had around 13:1 and 230 at the rears.
Think the saloon cars have similar comp?

[ebxr8240]

Mate has just tuned his EB Atomic engine on E85 with 993 rwhp at 37 psi...