Ford Falcon XR8 v HSV Clubsport head-to-head...

[vbvbvb088]

http://www.drive.com.au/new-car-comp...14-1mktc6.html

Comment....

[Havoc]

i haven't read the review but ill say the holden wins by a star or some other arbitrary number because of its chassis as handling means stuff these days or more electronic gizmos now to see if im right

[Havoc]

well there ya go spot on should of just saved my time and not bothered.

[Falcon Coupe]

There was plenty of "whine" from inside the HSV cabin considering it has no blower...

[jimt3te50]

I have to say I honestly have no idea how anyone could get sick of the sound of a blown V8

(Except possibly my neighbours! )

[Shonky.]

totally

those two were such a pair of hommos

I weep not just for the loss of Aussie auto manufacturing, but the loss of straight Aussie blokes

and the "X Factor"

you farkin wot?

[Express]

When I was young the X factor was how wide was the back seat before you had to open one of the doors and hang your legs out the side.

Is the X factor still the same?

[CyberWasp]

I think the "whine" was the passengers wanting to get out and into the Ford.

[brens]

I'm new to these car reviewers having most of my misspent youth gone on all things two wheels, and have to say these guys are absolute hand shanders. They review cars like a fine dining restaurant! How can you be a car enthusiast in a supercharged V8 and be complaining about the whine of the blower? Seriously? It's not a Lexus, it's an XR8!! The reason why I bought the XR8 was for its subtle performance queues (no racing stripes and big wings) the V8 and that blower whine (actual performance), family practicality (size) and the fact it doesn't have a push button start and it doesn't have electronic steering assist and it doesn't have a thousand beeping alarms warning me of things that I am very much aware of (the motorcyclist at my rear quarter).

Rant over....

[mcnews]

I can say one thing though, I never really looked at the Holden product or went into a dealership before I bought my last few FPVs, but after seeing a Clubsport on display at a local shopping centre and looking inside I must say I was absolutely shocked, our cars look so out of date inside in comparison. And with the Commodore having a clear handling advantage over our cars it is not hard to see why reviewers who are reviewing cars for the average uninformed punter, largely give the kudos to the Holden every time.

[FGX335]

Adequate dynamics? Floaty body control? Lack of traction?

Were they even driving the new XR8?

The dynamics in the R8 may be better (and I wouldn't know as I haven't driven one), but the dynamics in this car are phenomenal, body control is sharp and sure, and the traction is rarely an issue with the 275 rears. The traction control addresses wheel spin, generally only found in the wet, without robbing your forward progress much at all. Having done almost 3000km in mine, and driving in all types of conditions with a mix of light and WOT, I can't agree with these sentiments.

[brens]

I took the Commodore for a test and didn't particularly like the interior. This is all very subjective, but I thought it looked cheap and tacked on. Pieces of suede glued here and there, the overall layout of the cockpit was all too busy for me. The reviewers moan about the Falcon interior not changing since 200X but that's not really an issue unless you're updating from one Falcon to another year on year. If you're new to make, it's an all new interior. These reviewers see all cars from all models year on year and I think they lose perspective…..

Originally Posted by mcnews

I can say one thing though, I never really looked at the Holden product or went into a dealership before I bought my last few FPVs, but after seeing a Clubsport on display at a local shopping centre and looking inside I must say I was absolutely shocked, our cars look so out of date inside in comparison. And with the Commodore having a clear handling advantage over our cars it is not hard to see why reviewers who are reviewing cars for the average uninformed punter, largely give the kudos to the Holden every time.

[mcnews]

Originally Posted by FGX335

Adequate dynamics? Floaty body control? Lack of traction?

Were they even driving the new XR8?

The dynamics in the R8 may be better (and I wouldn't know as I haven't driven one), but the dynamics in this car are phenomenal, body control is sharp and sure, and the traction is rarely an issue with the 275 rears. .

With sticky 275s on my MKII GT-E and Shockworks coil overs etc. I would still never comes close to mentioning the word phenomenal in regards to dynamics. The chassis is well old now, and you do know the reason why our cars have their power limited is because the inhernet weakness in the firewall area of the chassis etc? The cars are still pretty good, but dynamically on the underpinnings they are based on they will never be fantastic handlers, particularly the V8 cars with those huge cylinder heads up high and away from the centreline to really tax any engineer trying to get some semblance of front end poise in the car.

[sbutler]

Um we are looking at a base XR8 against a Top shelf Clubbie. With 4
$10,000+ bigger price tag.. Come on Drive APPLES WITH APPLES PLEASE !

[mcnews]

Comparison should have been SS v XR8 agree. But the result would have been largely the same apart from the Falcon creaming it in acceleration numbers

[sbutler]

Apples with apples>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwfN-U3LMbM

[701let]

Originally Posted by sbutler

Um we are looking at a base XR8 against a Top shelf Clubbie. With 4
$10,000+ bigger price tag.. Come on Drive APPLES WITH APPLES PLEASE !

It's the entry level clubby I'm pretty sure?

[Professor Farnsworth]

As much as I love Falcon, face the facts. Ford has just about wrapped up, and obviously are putting less money and resources into the product, and have all but strangled production. This is widely known, and has been the slow-down plan the whole time. If I were unbiased and just out for a muscle car, it's hard to say what I'd shoot for. No need to defend or attack articles, we still have a car we love available to buy new, for a short time longer, just enjoy it for what it is. The fastest Ford Falcon ever made.

[sbutler]

Either way not the correct comparo.
I know the Falcon is getting old, but I'd still have my GTP over a Clubsport R8. I know I have the better motor, the better auto, & Im happy knowing that.. The Clubbie is a good car, even the SS is ok my daughter had one, SSV redline, very very nice indeed, but my stock XR6T cained it, at $9,500 less cost.

[40RDT]

Originally Posted by sbutler

Um we are looking at a base XR8 against a Top shelf Clubbie. With 4
$10,000+ bigger price tag.. Come on Drive APPLES WITH APPLES PLEASE !

The Xr8 is far from a "base" model, its the top shelf model of the FGX range. I think you will find this is the base model Clubsport too not the R8 Clubsport.

[FGX335]

I'm certainly not defending the car, it's not my job to do so. But to use words such as those are not accurate or fitting. You can certainly say that the XR feels good on the road, and up to the task, and simply that the R8 does all of that and more to a better standard. That I can accept, but 'floaty' and 'lack of traction' are not statements that I can agree with.

[sbutler]

Originally Posted by 40RDT

The Xr8 is far from a "base" model, its the top shelf model of the FGX range. I think you will find this is the base model Clubsport too not the R8 Clubsport.

The G6E turbo is the top of the line Falcon my friend..

[40RDT]

Originally Posted by sbutler

The G6E turbo is the top of the line Falcon my friend..

Price tag, standard equipment and performance seems to prove otherwise...far from a "base" model imo

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by brens

I'm new to these car reviewers having most of my misspent youth gone on all things two wheels, and have to say these guys are absolute hand shanders. They review cars like a fine dining restaurant! How can you be a car enthusiast in a supercharged V8 and be complaining about the whine of the blower? Seriously? It's not a Lexus, it's an XR8!! The reason why I bought the XR8 was for its subtle performance queues (no racing stripes and big wings) the V8 and that blower whine (actual performance), family practicality (size) and the fact it doesn't have a push button start and it doesn't have electronic steering assist and it doesn't have a thousand beeping alarms warning me of things that I am very much aware of (the motorcyclist at my rear quarter).

Rant over....

Spot on- I agree totally on this.

About the interior, the Commodores do look nice with the suede stitched dashes, and the little analog dials in the centre console, and has the expensive bling factor. But it is very busy, almost old Japanese chintzy, and the main speedo and rev counter dials are clunky and unappealing, like having a hot babe with boobs that are actually downright unattractive and unpleasantly unbalanced (not sure what that would entail but I will leave it up to your imagination).

The Falcon I have never owned, so I come into it with new eyes. It is very utility, the speedo and rev counter dials are big and centre stage and are naturally balanced. The centre control stack is a bit small/finicky buttons, but is functional. In a way, the Falcon has a certain utility Germanic basic efficiency about it- functional. The attempts at stitching on door trims is nice. Is nice, functional and does not overtly give you a bling, nor do you feel you are slumming it.

About the XR8 -engine is great, engine note personally I love the 4 valve multi cam sound over the woofy holdens. Dynamics, yeah- I felt the weight up front with the Miami, but the linear power and great steering of the Falcon makes it easy to dial out understeer.

I agree about the floaty rear end of the Falcon- whether it needs stiffer bushes, thicker anti roll bar I do not know, but it felt floaty in the rear to me.

But then, unlike these muppets, I like to feel the road and all bumps through my steering wheel, and I like to feel all the bumps through the rear as well.

Way I look at it, the FGX XR8 gives you one hell of a starter package to play with if you love engineering, sure there are inherent problems such as the high engine mass and super, which will get worse with an intercooler and water weight up high, but hell- where do you go from this to get 5 litres of multi valve v8 with super and 6 speed manual that you are looking to tailor in terms of suspension and power.

Way I look at it, the Commodore is a more balanced finished product that is "nice" and has not much left to tailor in development potential, the XR8 is a raw animalistic package that has some 40% "easy" development potential, that by inherent design of the multi valve v8 with quad cams and super will always be more feral than the Commodore and to me I want that, I do not want a pseudo BMW 335 or whatever.

Looking forward to the journey on this one.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by 40RDT

Price tag, standard equipment and performance seems to prove otherwise...far from a "base" model imo

It is pretty much what was the GS. A price reduced FPV. It has all the go fast bits from the FPVs so the comparison is fair.

[sbutler]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Spot on- I agree totally on this.

About the interior, the Commodores do look nice with the suede stitched dashes, and the little analog dials in the centre console, and has the expensive bling factor. But it is very busy, almost old Japanese chintzy, and the main speedo and rev counter dials are clunky and unappealing, like having a hot babe with boobs that are actually downright unattractive and unpleasantly unbalanced (not sure what that would entail but I will leave it up to your imagination).

Couldnt have said it better myself !

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by brens

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]They review cars like a fine dining restaurant!

For a long time I've been trying to put my finger on what has been wrong with some of these so-called car "reviews" and "tests" (amongst other things) and I think you've nailed it right there.

[DFB FGXR6]

These reviews are largely irrelevant now.

Both of these cars and the whole Ford vs Holden thing just doesn't matter any more. We are in the final years of a the Australian Motor industry and at the end of the day, these cars are for the fans of both brands not the a person who may be swayed by the end result and proven with those who will defend the XR8.

THERE IS NO WINNER in the grand scheme of things. Both are the pinnacle of what Ford and Holden are about.

[GT450]

Quite agree, from Fords point of view , this as good as it gets , there will be no more updates so any criticism is largely going to fall on deaf ears . As for GM they are in much the same boat and when the replacements come along I can't see Fomoco USA giving a toss what Josh Dowling and Paul Gover think , and that wont be a bad thing at all.
However i do forsee GM still paying these so called experts to give their products top reviews ( c'mon Camira car of the year I ask you what a joke).
For fans of the Aussie Ford this is where it stops, so lets enjoy what we have, there won't be any more but over the period it was made here the Falcon was, more often than not , the better car by a good margin no matter what Wheels , Modern Motor and all the other various thought, and like most here , I put my money where my mouth is which is more than any of these experts did.
GT450

[FGX335]

Originally Posted by Wretched

It is pretty much what was the GS. A price reduced FPV. It has all the go fast bits from the FPVs so the comparison is fair.

Not to be nitpicky, but not really. It is much more closely aligned with the R-SPEC, as it has its' suspension and calibration, plus it gets a new look with extras like Sync 2, Sat Nav, rain sensing wipers and front park sensors. It is better specced than an FG MkII GT. But it is heavier and has less brand cache, if you care about badges.